Those make pretty interesting reading Calum, thanks for posting the links. The improved version does provide an extra 200fps velocity, but that means yet more reloading. Currently, being that I am still gainfully employed, and with other demands life places on my time, I've convinced myself that the turdy turdy will be fed store bought factory ammo, the LeverEver stuff. Remember that I have limited myself to shoot within the limitations of the caliber. I think it will do fine. Certainly, I wouldn't recommend it as a one gun choice especially for elk. But it makes a great addition to the gun safe.
Is 30-30 enough for close range elk?
- Thread starter gitrdun
- Start date
Covey Ridge said:I think gitrdun is a cowboy and I would expect him to come off his hoss and meet Yogi with both gunzzz
Me? iron sighted 30-30 or SCOPED .338? Put me down for the SCOPED .338 and a change of shorts!
Actually the bear will change your shorts for you.
Lazy Ike said:
Either that or I might out run my shorts
As for gitrdun and his tutty tutty or whatever he calls it, I am sure he will do fine. I look forward to him posting his hunt on CGN next fall. His entusiasm for the ancient old cartridge has got me to thinking that maybe I will try some of those evolutions myself.
gitrdun didn't bring up the subject of bears. Someone else did. My reasoning for the 338 over the 30-30 was this:
gitrdun started this thread by asking about that capabilities of the 30-30. CGN responded with sound opinions. From previous posts he is a fan of the 338 and even did some killing with it. He even got one of those armour plated elk
which was the subject of a previous discussion. Now, Which gun for BIG BEAR? Which would he reach for. I still say the 338. He asked about the 30-30. HE KNOWS WHAT THE 338 WILL DO!
- Location
- Saskatchewan
Giturdun, consider that paper ballistics can be decieving. I really like deep penetration on elk, they just don't seem to be impressed by foot lbs. of energy. Your choice of the Leverevolution looks good on paper, and it is likely a great deer/black bear/caribou bullet, but I suspect that it will not penetrate as deep as a slower, heavier 170 gr. bullet. I'd suggest the Federal with the 170 Nosler partition. However, if you hit 'em perfectly in the ribs, out to about 200 yds, none of the above matters, you're eatin' elk steaks either way!
- Location
- Ft. Mac. Alberta
gitrdun said:
I would like to see a 200FPS difference with only two grains of powder , myself.
I have been told by many people who read stuff about immproved cartridges, and every one said " 200 to 300 FPS difference".
I have never seen it , when the cartridge is kept withing the loading specs...
Think about it, you are adding only 2 grains of powder, a 200 FPS increase?
Cat
Something that needs some chrony work for sure, but I have no doubt that other folks have done this and found out that you do get better performance.
Just how much 4 or 5 grains more will give you is a good question...also note that it seems like other powders are also being used in the ackley version.
I guess I'll just have to try it.
Anyone have a reamer for this chamber?
Just how much 4 or 5 grains more will give you is a good question...also note that it seems like other powders are also being used in the ackley version.
I guess I'll just have to try it.
Anyone have a reamer for this chamber?
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Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Just because you are in possible grizzly country Gitrdun, I beleive what Longwalker suggested (170 partitions handload or Federal factory) is an excellent idea.
You probably can get away with a 170 regular "cup & core" bullet on elk alone. But the security of a RN Nosler Partition, for a 30-30, could be extra security, for deeper punch, just in case of a
"close encounter of the fur and tooth kind."
You probably can get away with a 170 regular "cup & core" bullet on elk alone. But the security of a RN Nosler Partition, for a 30-30, could be extra security, for deeper punch, just in case of a
"close encounter of the fur and tooth kind."
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
The 30-30 has killed Grizzly before, in fact, it held the record for some time. That doesn't make it the perfect cartridge for the job, but, in cool knowledgeable hands, it can work.
If I remember right, that record book bear, was taken in an up close and personal fight or die situation. It was a head shot, by a guy that carried the rifle everywhere, for defense.
Wouldn't be my first choice as a hunters gun for grizzly bears, but, the rifles the 30-30 is chambered in, are so light and handy, they are less likely to be left behind somewhere when you need them.
If I remember right, that record book bear, was taken in an up close and personal fight or die situation. It was a head shot, by a guy that carried the rifle everywhere, for defense.
Wouldn't be my first choice as a hunters gun for grizzly bears, but, the rifles the 30-30 is chambered in, are so light and handy, they are less likely to be left behind somewhere when you need them.
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Given a clear mind and empty shorts, I would obviously go for the .338 when grizz comes a'callin. Only problem with the .338 is that darned scope. However, I've never had to make such a choice. Who knows what one might go for or how one might react. You'll never know, things do get awfull "different" shall we say, when life and limb are under threat. CAT does make a good point about that extra 200fps. Tell you what...as soon as this GD snow melts, I'll chrono those LeverEver's vs winny 170gr and report back, so stick around.
Come to think of it, HTF did grizzly bears come into this??? I'm just out to get an elk.
Come to think of it, HTF did grizzly bears come into this??? I'm just out to get an elk.
gitrdun said:
Funny how that works. I was out shed hunting last week with my boys and a 1/2 hour in all we did was measure bear scrapes that pretty much surrounded the area we were walking. @ 8' and change I was glad there was still snow on the ground to confirm these were old scrapes. Next time il remember to take my 3030.
Covey Ridge said:I think gitrdun is a cowboy and I would expect him to come off his hoss and meet Yogi with both gunzzz
Me? iron sighted 30-30 or SCOPED .338? Put me down for the SCOPED .338 and a change of shorts!
I would grab the 30.30.
Good look finding a moving, charging target through the scope with your adrenaline pumping.
Just got back from the range, and as promised here are my test results. These velocities are 3 shot averages from Marlin 336XLR:
Hornady 160gr LeverEvolution: 2361 fps (factory claims 2400)
Winchester 170gr Powerpoint: 2222 fps
Winchester 150gr Silvertip: 2410 fps.
All shot equally well, for an opensighted lever gun that is. I was shooting at an 8 1/2" x 11" paper with standard iron sights from 100 yds. Groupings was about 3" for all which as far as I'm concerned is the best I can ask for, not only from the gun/ammo, but myself as well
Calum: I thing troutseeker is into the tactical lever gun something. I recall a post of his a while back evern wanting to start a levergun tactical club.
Hornady 160gr LeverEvolution: 2361 fps (factory claims 2400)
Winchester 170gr Powerpoint: 2222 fps
Winchester 150gr Silvertip: 2410 fps.
All shot equally well, for an opensighted lever gun that is. I was shooting at an 8 1/2" x 11" paper with standard iron sights from 100 yds. Groupings was about 3" for all which as far as I'm concerned is the best I can ask for, not only from the gun/ammo, but myself as well
Calum: I thing troutseeker is into the tactical lever gun something. I recall a post of his a while back evern wanting to start a levergun tactical club.
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- Location
- AB foothills
I just got back from shooting as well. While out, we had a good chat about your turdy turdy and elk topic. We all had a good laugh over it anyways . Don't worry, we were laughing with you, not at you .
. Don't worry, we were laughing with you, not at you .Right on Dave, as long as you were laughing...that's all that matters. I'll mention that I shot my .338 also (since it's been brought up in the thread). I've never had it kick the #### out of me so bad as it did today. It's kinda like it was saying, "hey bud, you getting awful friendly with that wussy turdy turdy, here's a lil jab for ya". Yah...my guns do talk to me. 
And I listen.
And I listen.
