is a .223 enough for a deer?
- Thread starter Kyler
- Start date
I don't think hunting form a GT500 at highway speeds if that advisable either
...he'd be wishing he had earplugs in if he did fire inside the cabin of the car!!
Last edited:
I suppose that it is politically incorrect to admit that there are animals that are wounded and never found - steel shot on waterfowl is especially bad for that.
I am in my earlier post : "Maybe wounding an animal that takes an hour to die is better than any natural death of the animal.", comparing the worst likely to happen to a deer at the hands of a hunter to the best "natural death of the animal." I think that one hour of dying time is much less painful than starving or freezing or suffering of diseases or being harassed and gutted alive by wolves.
Sometimes us humans take years of dying before we finally go, drugged and wheezing into the darkness. Dang - that's almost poetic!
I don't like to think of the death of an animal as I eat it - it takes a cattle beast a long time to die - the screaming of a pig is terrible. The cry of a rabbit brings tears to the eyes.
Has anyone shot their muzzle loaders over a chrony and calculated muzzle energy? Likely not much oomph left at a hundred yards.
Bone Collector - I think it is customary for us to each attempt to establish our credibility by telling how everything we ever shot died as we pulled the trigger - then get all offended at something else and then go to sleep angry. Lets skip that.
- Location
- Lakes District BC
so its ok as a human that you let animals suffer? your obviously not a hunter but you are in my opinion PATHETIC!
psst muzzle loader will go through a moose @ 100 yards
and no I dont go to bed mad I just laff at people like you!
psst muzzle loader will go through a moose @ 100 yards
and no I dont go to bed mad I just laff at people like you!
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
Modern military rounds are designed to wound, thus taking the injured man, and two of his comrades as stretcher bearers, off the field.
A round designed to wound as a hunting round? Not for me thanks.
I have more respect for the game I hunt than that.
Dream on! If it helps you feel better about shooting someone.Political correctness if I've ever heard it piled neck high.When a soldier is in a firefight he is only intending to incapacitate the enemy so his two friends can carry him away?Not...........................Harold
BC Bigbore
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- BC's Peace Country
Sure why not? I'm gonna retire all those overly-powerful rifles in my vault and hunt all British Columbia big game (except bison) with my .223 cause that would be kewl don'tcha think?
londongunguy
Member
- Location
- Transplanted to Ottawa...
Ummmm.....yes.
The thought being that by injuring one, three are removed from the fight. The objective is to decrease the resistance to your progress. Basic strategy. Works well unless you're up against a resistance that cares not for their wounded brethern.
londongunguy
Member
- Location
- Transplanted to Ottawa...
Over a chrony? No.
Broadside into the heart and lungs? You bet.
100 yards, bang flop.
Yes.
Specifically, during mine warfare training when I was a field engineer in the late 1980's, we were taught that it is ALWAYS more productive to wound the enemy than to kill them outright. (Thus the OUTSTANDING Canadian designed plastic anti-personnel mines, that only used 1/4 oz. of explosive...)
Of course, that was back in the day when we were allowed to use mines....
It's a kinder, gentler form of warfare these days! (NOT!)
Neal
the only thing i'd shoot with a 223 outside of warefare...... would be paper and gophers
would i use it on deer? ....... not the deer i hunt
argue away all you want but look at this way. there are tools designed for the job.... use the appropriate one. use a finishing hammer on a framing nail..... sure... you'll get the job done in some fashion.... but use a framing hammer and you'll get er done quick n easy.
same goes for calibers for hunting deer.....leave your 223 at home unless you are hunting them baby fallow deer.... at 50 yards......
would i use it on deer? ....... not the deer i hunt
argue away all you want but look at this way. there are tools designed for the job.... use the appropriate one. use a finishing hammer on a framing nail..... sure... you'll get the job done in some fashion.... but use a framing hammer and you'll get er done quick n easy.
same goes for calibers for hunting deer.....leave your 223 at home unless you are hunting them baby fallow deer.... at 50 yards......
- Location
- interior b.c.
In the mountains where I hunt a wounded animal can change a 10 minute drag to the truck into a 5 hr feat of endurance, I would never take a chance on a borderline cal like the .223 for deer. Trust me dragging a deer up a mountain by yourself is no fun at all.That being said I wouldn't be grabbing my 30-06 when going on a gopher shoot either.The right tool for the job.
Takujualuk
CGN Regular
- Location
- Whitehorse, Yukon
When I lived in Nunavut my wife and I used a Browning Micro-Medallion in 223 for caribou. It worked fine to 150 yards but was a bit iffy after that. This was North of the tree line and I found the wound channels similar but a bit inferior to those caused by a 30-30.
We used
53 X bullets
55 Grain Trophy Bonded
60 Nosler partitions or Allred Triple Jacket Bonded
64 Win Power Points.
They all worked. I liked the heaviest bullets just a bit more than the lighter. Penetration with all bullets mentioned was adequate as was killing power..but the round was noticeably more effective at 100 yards and under and not so good past 150. Caribou like to lay down when hurt and I am pretty sure based on my experience that for woods use on a nervous animal like a deer that it would be a poor choice unless the shooter had iron discipline.
Here in the tree belt we have moved my wife up to a Rem 600 in 6mm Rem and recently a Ruger Carbine in 44 Mag. Both 5.75 pound guns with reasonable recoil and more punch. Funny thing is I really enjoy these light rifles too. I dust off the 358 Norma out for my own hunting however.
We used
53 X bullets
55 Grain Trophy Bonded
60 Nosler partitions or Allred Triple Jacket Bonded
64 Win Power Points.
They all worked. I liked the heaviest bullets just a bit more than the lighter. Penetration with all bullets mentioned was adequate as was killing power..but the round was noticeably more effective at 100 yards and under and not so good past 150. Caribou like to lay down when hurt and I am pretty sure based on my experience that for woods use on a nervous animal like a deer that it would be a poor choice unless the shooter had iron discipline.
Here in the tree belt we have moved my wife up to a Rem 600 in 6mm Rem and recently a Ruger Carbine in 44 Mag. Both 5.75 pound guns with reasonable recoil and more punch. Funny thing is I really enjoy these light rifles too. I dust off the 358 Norma out for my own hunting however.
Blargon :
That's a dandy load. Really no point - just gathering facts and wondering what energy the old timers were shooting supper with. With a muzzle loader, they could easily load down for rabbits and possibly a little shot for a bird - handy. I'll take mine out tomorrow and see what it clocks. A patched round ball in .50 cal will not come close to your load I'm sure.
Londongunguy:
Great - Having only one shot is a challenging handicap - similar to bowhunting I suppose. How large was the exit hole ? We don't have an early season here for muzzle loaders, so they just haven't caught on.
Bone-collector: quote :so its ok as a human that you let animals suffer? your obviously not a hunter but you are in my opinion PATHETIC!"end quote.
Hey - neat - I just discovered those little arrows at the top right of the message box that I am typing in. If I keep pressing the bottom one, the box gets bigger - handy!
Um - you ask a question and then make a conclusion before allowing me to answer - that's not fair! I demand a retrial! : ) Good night.
That's a dandy load. Really no point - just gathering facts and wondering what energy the old timers were shooting supper with. With a muzzle loader, they could easily load down for rabbits and possibly a little shot for a bird - handy. I'll take mine out tomorrow and see what it clocks. A patched round ball in .50 cal will not come close to your load I'm sure.
Londongunguy:
Great - Having only one shot is a challenging handicap - similar to bowhunting I suppose. How large was the exit hole ? We don't have an early season here for muzzle loaders, so they just haven't caught on.
Bone-collector: quote :so its ok as a human that you let animals suffer? your obviously not a hunter but you are in my opinion PATHETIC!"end quote.
Hey - neat - I just discovered those little arrows at the top right of the message box that I am typing in. If I keep pressing the bottom one, the box gets bigger - handy!
Um - you ask a question and then make a conclusion before allowing me to answer - that's not fair! I demand a retrial! : ) Good night.
This is a gun nuts site, but I wonder if guys here would allow anti hunters to ban bows because of the suffering of the animal as it bleeds out. There may be an occasional slice-flop with a bow, but by a gunmans standards, there is a lot more tracking involved.
One real upside is the small amount of meat damage by the broadhead. I really don't like discarding a whole quarter because of a magnum sized bloody mess. More guys use stands now - or so it seems - less driving bushes and so less running shots and more sniper shots - but even so, if a guy isn't careful, the bullet goes in through the ribs and tears up the heart and lungs - fine, then angles out through the off-side front leg and rips up good meat on the way out. Head shots - now there is a challenging target.
One real upside is the small amount of meat damage by the broadhead. I really don't like discarding a whole quarter because of a magnum sized bloody mess. More guys use stands now - or so it seems - less driving bushes and so less running shots and more sniper shots - but even so, if a guy isn't careful, the bullet goes in through the ribs and tears up the heart and lungs - fine, then angles out through the off-side front leg and rips up good meat on the way out. Head shots - now there is a challenging target.
Savagefan: Yes I do - though most of my shooting is handgun - I spend a few boxes of reloads in rifles in late summer. One Ruger and two Savages ( .243 and .270) have been the most trouble-free. Year before last, one 99C was nothing but grief - a bit of pitting at the muzzle made accuracy impossible.
