Is the volume of a bullet also a factor in killing power?

elker

elker

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I have been frustrated by the slow velocity of my 9.3x62 using 286 grain TSX. As it is made with copper, it is 40% lighter than a lead bullet of the same weight. So it has to be seated deeper in the brass and as a result, less room for powder.

So I will move to 250 grain TSX or TTSX next year. And I also wish that Barnes could make 232 Grain TTSX at 9.3. The lighter the bullets, the more room for powder, hence the more velocity.

Also if we look at the volume of the copper bulllets, a 232 grain bulllet would be even bigger than a 286 grain lead bullet. So my question is, does the volume of a bullet also count in killing power?

Thank you in advance for any help on this topic. And yes, I have tried to search on internet for the answer but there is not much discussion on it yet.
 
The copper bullet is 40% lighter than a lead bullet of the same weight? No, it weighs exactly the same but it is longer than the lead core bullet. Many of the longer bullets require a faster twist to stablize them. Longer bullets will generally penetrate deeper and maintain a straighter wound channel. Volume is a misleading term to describe bullets, the proper term is mass as in E=MV squared. The same mass produces the same muzzle energy but a longer bullet may wade more meat if the rifling twist is fast enough to stabilize it.
 
Bullet performance is important in killing power. I don't think the volume of the projectile is that important. I would prefer quality jacketed lead bullets over copper bullets if the velocities are not high... especially on game animals.
 
elker said:
I have been frustrated by the slow velocity of my 9.3x62 using 286 grain TSX. As it is made with copper, it is 40% lighter than a lead bullet of the same weight.
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A fundamental misunderstanding is putting you off track from the start. A 286 grain lead bullet and a 286 grain copper bullet weigh the same.
 
What is heavier, a ton of bricks, or a ton of feathers?

Either solid copper or copper jacketed lead will work fine at the velocities they are intended for. Mass would only matter if the difference in densities is great, like say an aluminum bullet vs a lead bullet, a 300 grain aluminum bullet would be so large that it could not maintain adequate velocity. Imagine launching popcorn at a deer at 3000 fps, even if the deer was 10 feet away, no damage would be done.

I think you are over thinking this a little, both bullets will have the same frontal area, and the same weight. Killing performance will be determined by the bullets construction and velocity at impact.
 
One of the great benefits of the 9.3 is that it performs very very well with standard lead core jacketed bullets. Unless you are one of the people concerned about possible lead fragments in game meat, why not stop using the long,light copper bullets?
 
I have found the 9.3 X 62 to be a cartridge that has no need for homogenous bullets and in fact suffers from their use as you are finding for yourself. I use the 270 gn Speer and have killed several animals with it, it works flawlessly. I know Why Not? (Ted) has killed much more game than I with this combo and it is a match made in heaven, more velocity than the 286 gn and as much if not more penetration as the 286 gn. I recovered one from a walrus and it worked just like the ads, impact was at about 40-50 mtrs. (I was going to include a photo but can't find the bullet just now) I have mine loaded hot and am getting 2600 fps and to me this is the perfect bullet for the 9.3.
 
Volume? Maybe if it was keyholing? Volume would effect velocity if you're COAL is restricted by your magazine forcing you to seat the bullet deeper, which you say it does. I think what you are saying is that the TSX is 40% lighter than a lead bullet of the same size, but I think you know this already and just mis-spoke?
 
sorry for the typo. I meant copper bullet is 40% lighter for the same volume. my wife was kicking me out from computer room to send kids to school,so I was in a hurry. anyway,you know what I meant
 
elker said:
sorry for the typo. I meant copper bullet is 40% lighter for the same volume. my wife was kicking me out from computer room to send kids to school,so I was in a hurry. anyway,you know what I meant
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Okay, that makes more sense. I could be completely off base, but I think raw volume would be a much less significant factor than bullet construction, sectional density, impact velocity, and the like. (Not to mention whether the bullet - almost regardless of characteristics - is striking the vitals; the most basic and critical of factors). That is to say, volume is a variable in play, but probably not nearly as important as many others?
 
It stands to reason that a bullet of greater volume for a given caliber.(longer) would have a greater mushroom Dia potential. However, a tough copper bullet may not expand as readily as a soft lead or lead core bullet so the long copper one may not utilize its full potential.
That being said longer bullets tend to have better BC's for long range use.

The longer bullets may not stabilize in a slower twist bore but inversely an over stabilized short bullet can have problems too.

Shoot the bullet that best fits your barrels twist.
All else is of inconsequence. Dead is dead, whether you ripped a 1/2" hole or a 1" through the heart and lungs of an animal.
 
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I have killed, and seen killed, several dozen truly big game animals with the 270 gr Speer, and various 286 gr 9.3 bullets. There is little, if any, noticeable difference in performance other than a slightly flatter trajectory with the 270 gr.

As to the Barnes monos, the 286 gr starting out at 2400 fps will not get you much expansion on game. BTDT. The 250 started out at close to 2700 should work better, however there is no need for this type of bullet when Partitions, Matrix Bonded Cores, and plain vanilla cup and core bullets work so well.

Matrix 270 gr from big bear last year.
IMGP3176.jpg




Speer 270 gr from moose. The only one I ever recovered from an animal
270Speer2.jpg




Here's a bear that a Speer did not stop in.
Chocolatebear2.jpg





Norma 286 gr PP Dual Cores, three moose and one bear.
DSC04136.jpg




Ted
 
The original load was a 286gr bullet at 2150fps - and folks were killing all sorts of game with it. the old 9x57 did very well with the Kynoch 245gr RN at 2150fps, and that load must certainly be "inferior" to the 9.3x62's original loads. Also keep in mind that, imo, modern bullets are superior to what was available back in those days. And by modern bullets I mean all of them, not just the fancy premium stuff.

So then, let's say you get "only" 2300fps. I'd say that and a regular 286gr bullet would easily deal with any game in North America.
 
The 9.3 x 62 doesn't generate the velocities where a TSX is going to have any advantage over a basic cup and core bullet.

In fact, the TSX's, designed to expand properly at 1800+ fps, will likely NOT perform as they should at medium to longer ranges in 9.3's.

I've spoken to a few experienced 9.3 users, including our own Why not? and also the owners of Trade Ex, one of our site sponsors, and they have indicated to me that buying TSX's for 9.3's is a waste of money. The Trade Ex owners were particularly firmly against TSX's in various 9.3's, and they handle 9.3's for a living.

My 9.3's are loaded with 270 grain speers and 286 grain Prvi bulk bullets.
 
Northman999 said:
I've spoken to a few experienced 9.3 users, including our own Why not? and also the owners of Trade Ex, one of our site sponsors, and they have indicated to me that buying TSX's for 9.3's is a waste of money. The Trade Ex owners were particularly firmly against TSX's in various 9.3's, and they handle 9.3's for a living.
Click to expand...

No wonder last year TradeEx's Tony recommended and sold 250 grn Accubond to me.

Here is the bullet I recovered from a 250 lb black bear. I shot it at 70 yard. so I guess the impact velocity is around 1900 fps. It opened a little bit but no mushroom which I so much wish to see one.

286tsxon250lbsblackbear.jpg


P.S. I posted my topic hoping to get some support for using lower weight TSX, but it has turned out that those Yukoners almost killed my love for TSX. What can I do with those loaded 286 grn TSX? LOL
 
Has anyone used the Privi Partizan 286 gr bullet on game? From the looks of the cross-section(second from right below), they look to be a fairly stoutly constructed cup and core bullet that may be effective on game at 9.3X62 velocities(2375 fps from my 21" barrel).

93bulletssectioned.jpg
 
Slap me! When I saw "volume" I thought of sound. I thought he was going to ask if a "louder" bullet would kill better that a "quieter" one.

With all the theories one hears about on here it would not surprise me to find such a thread one day.
 
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