Is there a Fwt that doesn't heat up

WhelanLad

WhelanLad

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So I got the Kimber.. pencil thin barrel.

I'm noticing my model 70 barrel isn't of much more thickness an even though spring is here, I'm noticing Hot barrel after attempting 3 shot groups .
Firing steady an about 3 mins apart the first two, by the time the third goes, it's Hot.

This has to be effecting my development with the SGK 140gr....

But I read on a forum that, some fellas Model 70 fwt doesn't heat up an the shots don't dance once it does heat up.....

So I wanna know what yurs is like , realistically..

She open up a bit , fairly easy?


As per my usual, in going to go slower and mostly focus on those first 2 shots per say, then work on fine tuning.


It's just a Paper gun for a few years.

"All" loads would smoke a deer at 250m... But some are submoa and most are 1.5 but there's some big flyers and I believe it must be the Barrel heat. (Plus technique at times)

Thanks guys

PS any SGK tips -

The test I did with Bullet backwards in case, indicates a short throat too! So loads are around 80mm, one being sweet at 81.5mm. An now trying the SGK up to 79mm short
 
My featherweight in 280 AI heats up very quickly. It’s basically a 2 round gun if you want to be able to touch the barrel. It has been action bedded and free floated so it doesn’t change point of impact much at all but I still try to keep things cool to avoid toasting my barrel.
 
I noticed the other day that my new to me mod70 heats up pretty quick, faster than anything else I have but it is also my only 300 win mag rifle and other than my 458win mag I don’t have any other magnum so maybe that is normal for a magnum rifle barrel to heat up a lot faster 🤷🏼‍♂️
 
257hunter said:
My featherweight in 280 AI heats up very quickly. It’s basically a 2 round gun if you want to be able to touch the barrel. It has been action bedded and free floated so it doesn’t change point of impact much at all but I still try to keep things cool to avoid toasting my barrel.
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Mines a 2022 or so Modern production,....
When I put it together there was a decent looking bedding job under it!?
An it free floated...
Will test free float when it's Hot next!!! Good reminder


I can't be sure it's not My #### fold up plastic Shooting bench either yet .....
 
DGY said:
I noticed the other day that my new to me mod70 heats up pretty quick, faster than anything else I have but it is also my only 300 win mag rifle and other than my 458win mag I don’t have any other magnum so maybe that is normal for a magnum rifle barrel to heat up a lot faster 🤷🏼‍♂️
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Yeah!
I was surprised at the temp of it the other day 😆

300 win mag is burning a fair bit of powder in 22 inches!!!

I noticed a min load didn't get as hot as quick, if that helps lol.
More powder certainly hotter down the tube too
 
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257hunter said:
My featherweight in 280 AI heats up very quickly. It’s basically a 2 round gun if you want to be able to touch the barrel. It has been action bedded and free floated so it doesn’t change point of impact much at all but I still try to keep things cool to avoid toasting my barrel.
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Thats the thing. Being hot doesn't mean impact should shift.

Thin barrels heating is just the nature of the game until we find new materials haha. But POI can remain stable even though the heat builds.

Its one of those things like "cold bore shot" that shouldn't be a thing lol
 
I like 2 shot groups for load development with pencil barrel rifles.
3rd shot was to hot for the barrel.

Being a primary hunting rifle. Cold bore and clean shots are the most important .
First shot matters the most .
Cold bore mapping is fun.fun to get a good tune.
My third shot for my pet load is always high and right by 1 inch.
 
Sporter weight or lighter barrels heat up…. Ain’t a damn thing you can do about it.
2 or 3 shot groups at 200 and 300 yards/meter is what I’d do, fire you 2 or 3, sit the rifle to cool, grab another rifle, shoot with it, then grab another rifle shoot with it, then back to the first rifle, fire another 2 or 3, rinse and repeat…..

It’s a hunting rifle, not a BR or Match rifle, work loads with that in mind. Ain’t no way you’d be taking more than a couple quick shots in the real world to begin with.

Oh ya it helps if you have one of these and a length of fuel line hose:
https://www.amazon.ca/Westminster-Inc-Worlds-Smallest-Blower/dp/B08ML8YB7R

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Lefty #### said:
Sporter weight or lighter barrels heat up…. Ain’t a damn thing you can do about it.
2 or 3 shot groups at 200 and 300 yards/meter is what I’d do, fire you 2 or 3, sit the rifle to cool, grab another rifle, shoot with it, then grab another rifle shoot with it, then back to the first rifle, fire another 2 or 3, rinse and repeat…..

It’s a hunting rifle, not a BR or Match rifle, work loads with that in mind. Ain’t no way you’d be taking more than a couple quick shots in the real world to begin with.

Oh ya it helps if you have one of these and a length of fuel line hose:
https://www.amazon.ca/Westminster-Inc-Worlds-Smallest-Blower/dp/B08ML8YB7R
Click to expand...

R700 MTN, M70 FWT, M77 UL, Wby #2 profile etc etc, anything with those small bbl dia’s and it doesn’t matter it’s gonna heat up quick. Again, Cal (and amount of powder burned) and rate of fire have a lot to do with it.
Falconflyer said:
The rate at which your barrel heats up is dependent on more than just the weight of the barrel. A 300 Wby will heat a barrel a lot faster than a 308 just due to the amount of extra powder being burned.
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^ I can vouch for this..
My .300Wby is a two shot deal and then let it sit while I shoot something else for a while.
 
Barrel heat as a deterrent to accuracy is a myth. Poorly assembled components can cause problems. But heat causing accuracy problems is a symptom of another issue.

Heat is detrimental to barrel life, but stopping between shots or not wanting to shoot five shot groups because of a heating barrel is not necessary.
 
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Do you wait several minutes between shots in hunting situations where you have to fire multiple shots? I don't understand excessively spaced shot strings, they're a pretty poor indicator of the field accuracy of the rifle


If you like 2 shot groups you should try one round groups, they are always super tight.

Some people will search for any reason to explain innacuracy besides poor marksmanship.

Dispersion from field positions is going to be so great that the .5 inch difference between the magical 1 moa load and 1.5 moa don't matter anyways
 
conor_90 said:
Do you wait several minutes between shots in hunting situations where you have to fire multiple shots? I don't understand excessively spaced shot strings, they're a pretty poor indicator of the field accuracy of the rifle


If you like 2 shot groups you should try one round groups, they are always super tight.

Some people will search for any reason to explain innacuracy besides poor marksmanship.

Dispersion from field positions is going to be so great that the .5 inch difference between the magical 1 moa load and 1.5 moa don't matter anyways
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Let me expand a bit as you’ve lost my jist.
2 shots let it cool, 2 more shots same poi, let it cool etc etc….. after 2 shots at game its a series of hail Mary’s anyways, if you consistently put two shots where they belong when ever it’s tried, what’s not to like…. It’s a hunting rifle, not a bench/varmint/match rifle…….
 
I never lost your jist, I wasn't even talking to you.
..

Don't overestimate your own genius, nothing you said was remotely complicated
 
Bullet/barrel friction also plays an important factor (approx 20-30%) in barrel heating. Moly coating and short-for-caliber bullets reduce the rate that barrels heat up. Of interest, some of the new calibers designed to handle long heavy bullets (22 Creedmore, 6.5 PRC, 6.8 Western) might actually heat up faster than their short bullet cousins.

All barrels will swell and elongate due to increased temperature change. Slight variations in concentricity of the bore, wall thickness, material consistency and rifling will result in bullet impact shift. The hotter the barrel gets, relative to the first round, the more bullet impact shift will occur. Some manufacturers use Crio treatment and stress relieving to reduce some of these issues. Not all possible issues are corrected with stress relieving.

Load development with hunting weight barrels can be challenging. I look for loads with 1st and 2nd shot consistency and repeatability . The other thing I use is a laser heat gun. I keep it in my range kit. After the second shot, I monitor the barrel in the area immediately in front of the chamber. I try to ensure 3rd, 4th, etc have a somewhat consistent temperatures. This saves me time and shots.
 
The comment about "Heated barrels dont spray shots". Is the One I was chasing.....

How does that stay true?
The fact being , the shots Fly when Hot only DUE to wood touching ?

The other day I put 2 shots down... Nice close , the barrel was warm so I thought. Slam another an go ..
It's a combo of Me, the Load and the bullet but there's one that just Strays well off.

I'll chase this Up this week, maybe later today ...
There's a few things to check after making this thread ✅✅


2x at a time is plenty and I'll do "4 shot" groups per say
 
Joel said:
Thats the thing. Being hot doesn't mean impact should shift.

Thin barrels heating is just the nature of the game until we find new materials haha. But POI can remain stable even though the heat builds.

Its one of those things like "cold bore shot" that shouldn't be a thing lol
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Hold on Joel. There are heat treaments that can be done to barrels to stop them from changing point of impact when they get hot. They aren't cheap, and I don't know if anyone in Canada does this treatment, but it is available in the US.

No, I'm not going on about Cryogenics.

A few years ago, when I ordered the last factory profiled barrels from Shilen in the US, one of the options listed on the form was heat treating. I hadn't seen it before, so I called them and asked what it was, and they told me it was a special heat treatment to stop shifting harmonics caused by increased heat during firing long strings at the range, and for Varmint shooters.

I didn't order the treatments because the people paying for the rebarreling, didn't feel they needed the rather expensive option.

WL, your Mod 70Win, FWT barrel did not get this special heat treatment at the factory. To my knowledge it's not a factory option either.

For someone in your line of work, that rifle may not be what you need on the job, especially if you're in a "cull" situation and the shots are fast and close together.

The FWT type rifles are not meant for this type of shooting, and most will not do it well.

Many decades ago, I was involved in a domestic sheep cull. The fellow who owned them went broke, then walked away from the flock, which went wild. Some died in the winter, when their coats froze together, and they were easy pickings for the Coyotes, but most of them survived.

There were close to a hundred animals, in all stages of health.

The realtor, who bought the property at auction, tried to find someone to come in and take the animals.

No takers, mostly because it was a difficult place to get to, and there were concerns about disease.

The animals were a nuisance to the surrounding farms/ranches, so the MOE hired a friend and myself to "reduce" the flock to "0" animals, and remove the carcasses.

It took a four days, because they were no longer tame, and human contact for the past couple of years was not happy experience, and a poor choice on our part for rifles.

The shots were anywhere from 50-300 meters, and usually there would be at least a half dozen animals together.

We both used Rem Mod 7 rifles, chambered for 243Win, with factory, wood stocks, and Leupold 2x7 scopes, shooting handloads.

The cartridge choice was just about perfect for the job, but those pencil barrels were a big negative, and a job that should have taken a day at most, turned into four days of hiking over brushy, steep terrain, because of lack of consistent accuracy after the first couple of shots from each rifle.

The Mod 7s would have been fine for a sporting Deer or Bear hunt, but not for a cull.

Google "John Barsness and heat treating barrels for accuracy"
 
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