Israeli use of the No.4 T sniper rifle

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x westie

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This weekend {May 10}..there was a interesting photo on pg D8 of the book section of the Globe and Mail of two Israeli soldiers in the 1948 war of independence , both with Lee Enfield No.4 T sniper rifle,..the photo shows the one soldier using the No.4 scope to check for targets while the other Israeli stands on top of a armoured car .

Intersestingly one Israeli wear a U.S. web ammo belt used for holding M1 Garand or 03 Springfield clips ...also in the photo a Israeli communicates with a U.S army style "walkie talkie..a Thompson SMS is slung around his neck.

These No.4 T rifle were obviously "borrowed" from the Brits...and i can well imagine how these Israeli felt carrying one of the best sniper rifles available at this time .
 
Well, when you're at war before you're even a nation, I'm sure any assistance is greatly appreciated. Look at all the ex-German rifles they found in their hands...
 
The IDF at that time was a mish-mash of everything:vehicles,weapons,personal equipment,aircraft,and even people.I've read accounts of "Russian" sub-units composed of recent Russian immigrants who spoke nothing but Russian.The Israelis did seem to use a preponderance of British kit left behind by the Brits as they promptly exited stage left as Israel was granted statehood in 1948.Ex-German Mauser rifles and MG34s also seemed quite evident in photos of the time.
 
purple said:
The IDF at that time was a mish-mash of everything:vehicles,weapons,personal equipment,aircraft,and even people.I've read accounts of "Russian" sub-units composed of recent Russian immigrants who spoke nothing but Russian.The Israelis did seem to use a preponderance of British kit left behind by the Brits as they promptly exited stage left as Israel was granted statehood in 1948.Ex-German Mauser rifles and MG34s also seemed quite evident in photos of the time.
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The Arabs used a large number of SMLE rifles,and Bren guns,.i have seen many photos of the SMLE in action .i know the Israelis did buy up huge numbers of the German 98k ,which they later rebarrled to 7.62 mm.

It would be very interesting though how these No.4 rifles were "acquired",..as i don't think the Brits just "forgot" to take these weapons with them when they pulled out of what was then called Palestine .
 
Look at all the ex-German rifles they found in their hands...
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Actually, most of the KAR-98's and other mauser's which were basically the standard infantry weapon for the IDF until the French started selling stuff to them, were actually of Czech origin. The Czechs felt very guilty about their actions, or lack thereof, while occupied by the germans, and as a result were a major arms supplier for Israel. They also supplied the first fighter aircraft to the IDFAF: The Avia S-199, a czech built BF-109 with a Junkers Jumo engine. A terrible plane, but it was better than the piper cubs they were using at the time!
 
The Jordanians, being trained and equipped by the British & later US were another mid east army to retain WW2 Brit & US weapons well into the 60's. Moshe Dayan was almost killed by a Jordanian sniper using a LE #4 in Jerusalem during the Six Days War
 
The ammo logistics weren't the only pain. They had the problem of several different languages to overcome as well.

I was talking to a couple of kibbutzum several years ago that just couldn't handle the day and night vigilence and fear anymore and moved to Canada. Nice couple.

They had at least 8 different languages being spoken at any given time on their kibbutz. There was a school that was mandatory for anyone that didn't speak hebrew.

Because of the language difficulties and the supply difficulties, they learned their lesson well and that's the main reason you see the mausers with huge 7.62 brands and gougeings. They still had lots of 8x57s as well as other calibres in stores in the mausers. You're absolutely right Gibbs505, logistics were pure hell, on everything, includeing and especially food as some sects require special diets.

The Israelis amaze me. Tough, resourceful people, trying to carve out a homeland, in a world that didn't care about or want them. Many even hated them. Things are better now, but the war clouds are always on the horizon.

bearhunter
 
purple said:
The IDF at that time was a mish-mash of everything:vehicles,weapons,personal equipment,aircraft,and even people.I've read accounts of "Russian" sub-units composed of recent Russian immigrants who spoke nothing but Russian.The Israelis did seem to use a preponderance of British kit left behind by the Brits as they promptly exited stage left as Israel was granted statehood in 1948.Ex-German Mauser rifles and MG34s also seemed quite evident in photos of the time.
Click to expand...

The Brits left a great deal of their ordinace there, and they also left piles of captured German ordinance in the desert. They sold a great deal of this stuff to the surplus dealers. There is a story of a U.S. dealer who bought a cache of several million 303 cartridges. He visited the pickup site and reported that the ammo was sitting in the desert in crates on pallets stacked on top of each other at least four or five pallets deep and five pallets high - the row of ammo pallets was three miles long. THis ammo got sold worldwide and a significant portion had the bullets pulled and was reloaded into sporting ammuntion. If I remember correctly the dealer was Sam Cummings (Interarms).
 
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