IVI Brass

PanzerIV

PanzerIV

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Hey All,
Got a question for ya, hope someone has some experience in this field.
I have a load developed for my 1950 No.4 Mk. 1 Enfield that shoots very well. The load is with Winchester brass, using Hornady 174g BT-FMJ (#3131), with 38.5g of IMR 4064 powder. Overall length of 2.983", and a .003" Lee factory crimp. Winchester primers.

Now my question is this. I have bought some IVI .303BR brass, but am not sure how this IVI will affect my load. I know they say for NATO .308 to reduce the loads by 10% due to case volume........will this be the same for my 303 brass? The max load for that powder is 39.3g, so I am already close to max load with that Win brass, so am looking for some advice from anyone with experience with IVI brass. There is no nato stamp on the brass, its 1990's manufacture.

I plan on working up a load with the IVI, and I was thinking if I dropped down to 36g of 4064, and worked back up in .5g steps to find that same sweet spot I found with the Win brass, that might be a good idea? Am I right, or will my #### fall off doing something like that? Didnt want to waste anymore bullets or time than neccessary, so am just wondering if there is a best guess out there on how IVI brass will affect my load..........or will it make any difference at all?

And as a side note, I am about to step into the same arena with some IVI .308 brass. Have loads worked out using Federal, PMC, and Win brass............how much will I have to reduce the load on that to start working back up to find the sweet spot?

Any and all opinions are most welcome! Thanks guys.

PanzerIV
 
"...no NATO stamp on the brass..." There wouldn't be. .303 British was never a NATO cartridge.
As I recall, IVI .303 Ball brass isn't any different than the commercial hunting ammo they made. You shouldn't need to reduce the load.
"...IVI .308 brass..." Came as 7.62NATO and commercial hunting ammo. Milsurp brass will have the NATO stamp and crimped primers(I think. It's been a while). Commercial will not.
 
The .308 IVI brass has the nato cross on it. So any suggestions on how much to reduce loads by?

And yes, I realise .303 isnt a nato cartridge, but I was under the impression IVI made their brass thicker, similiar to nato specs. I dont think I have ever seen IVI commercially available on the store shelves...............where does one buy that stuff? I just bought my brass as once fired. It also has sealant around the primers, so I was thinking perhaps it was gov't issued stuff, maybe for those crazy canadian ranger guys with their #4m mk.2's. But then again...............I could be way out in left feild.
 
I have found that in 308 vs. 7.62, the military brass needed about 2 grains less powder.

When changing brass, such as Winchester to IVI 303, weigh a few of each. If the weight is the same, the volume will be similar. If the brass is heavier, you use less powder.

You are wise to reduce and work up because the sweet spot could be at a lower charge weight. You would not want to miss it.
 
Thanks Guys! Two full grains less on 7.62 than .308 eh? Ok, well I'll drop down that couple, and see what happens. Just curious what people found out in the real world for results. I'll let ya know in a few weeks what I found out!
 
Ganderite said:
I have found that in 308 vs. 7.62, the military brass needed about 2 grains less powder.

When changing brass, such as Winchester to IVI 303, weigh a few of each. If the weight is the same, the volume will be similar. If the brass is heavier, you use less powder.

You are wise to reduce and work up because the sweet spot could be at a lower charge weight. You would not want to miss it.
Click to expand...

Fill the IVI case with water. Then dump the water into your Win brass. You'll quickly know if the IVI case has more or less inner volume than the Win Brass.

You may encounter crimped in primers with your new .303 brass. Be aware and be prepared to remove that ring before re-priming.

You should always start loads at a slightly reduced propellant qty. Safety first and always.
 
I have no idea regarding current IVI brass in .303, but I can say for certain that there is no difference worth bothering about with DCCo, DC, DOMINION, IMPERIAL and Defence Industries (DI with the date and Z).

IVI did turn out some absolutely horrid stuff in late '70s/early '80s but that got straightened out after a lot of screaming and they started turning out the ammo that they COULD. Note that brass HARDNESS and not WEIGHT generally was the complaint.

From my experience, generally you can interchange all of these headstamps and the rifle won't know the difference.

Still, I do avoid modern IVI (post-1975 through to about 1980, say) but perhaps I should give their new stuff a try. Most of the old will have hit the reycle bins by now.

Defence Industries made the stuff with the DI, and DATE headstamps during WW2; it was NC, NM, Boxer primed and the most consistent .303 brass I have ever encountered, rims all right at max. It was produced in a Government-owned plant in which all the key staff were from the old Dominion Cartridge Company, so no wonder the brass is identical.

Interesting figure: Canadan Inspectors passed on more than 4 BILLION rounds of .303 alone during War Two. That's a pile of ammo.
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Hey Guys,
Got a little feedback here. The 1990's 303 IVI brass i tried likes exactly one full grain less than the Win and Rem brass. The IVI liked 37.5g of IMR4064 using the 174g Hornady HPBT, overall length of 2.983", and a .003" Lee factory crimp. The Win and Rem brass liked the same data, but 38.5g of IMR4064. With both loads i was getting 1" groups with my 1950 #4 Mk.1 with iron sights.
Just working on a load with Sierra 180g SP now..............

So you say the DA brass is no difference then eh? I have some DA .308 that I have been meaning to try. Headstamp is DA 67 + . Any ideas if I will have to use a smaller load than with my Fed brass I was using? Was going to go try my IVI 308 this morning.............but its raining. Again.
 
There was a recent production run of .303 IVI made specifically for Afganistan, that never actually made it there. I have about 200 or so of these rounds. They shoot horrible in a Bren, as they get ripped off at the rim. Looks like the cases were made more to commercial specs then military with this batch. They shoot fine out of a No4 or No1.

I'll see about getting some more specs on these ones.
 
Dutchie said:
There was a recent production run of .303 IVI made specifically for Afganistan, that never actually made it there. I have about 200 or so of these rounds. They shoot horrible in a Bren, as they get ripped off at the rim. Looks like the cases were made more to commercial specs then military with this batch. They shoot fine out of a No4 or No1.

I'll see about getting some more specs on these ones.
Click to expand...

- I rather doubt they were designed for Afg, more likely for the Cdn Rangers and their Long Branches.
 
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