IWI Israeli vs IWI USA X95

Ebola said:
There is zero accuracy issues regarding the Tavor/X95. The only issue regarding accuracy this platform has is the unrealistic expectations of people who are to dumb to realize that this rifle was designed as a CQB rifle and not a platform built for accuracy. Using the AR15 as the "gold standard" in regards to achievable accuracy is also asinine as the AR15 platform has about a 40 year head start of people and companies owning and perfecting the design.
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I will +1 this with the following data point take it for what you will as I was worried about all the talk online about accuracy in this platform.

I was able to dig up a picture of a target I had shot with a rack grade AR-15 with cheap bulk ammo a 15 round sample size a couple years ago. I compared it with the same size target 15 rounds out of the x-95 same distance and ironically the same optic. The x-95 was the same if not slightly better grouping with less flyers. Maybe it was the day maybe it was that particular batch of ammo or I can shoot the x-95 better but regardless I have 0 issues with what I am seeing from this platform accuracy wise. In my humble opinion it's the same as any off the shelf AR shooting the same crappy ammo.

I will caveat by saying that I have no experience with free floated or custom barrel AR-15's that might achieve 1 MOA accuracy with bulk ammo. From my experience 1 MOA in a bolt gun consistently with cheap bulk ammo is hard enough to achieve. But I will let all the internet shooters continue to out shoot me.

Cheers,
 
Armedsask said:
Please enlighten us where you see AR18 influence. I'm at a complete loss.

It's basically an AK bullpup, as previously mentioned.
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The return spring, locking lug configuration and *arguably* the piston are AK inspired, but the extractor, ejector and firing pin are clearly AR-inspired. The bolt carrier has a little bit of both, riding on both receiver rails and guide rods. The chamber, unlike the AK, has symmetrical locking shoulders designed to accept both left and right-handed bolts. The camming system, where the bolt has a helix cut that rotates it around a static cam pin, is very unique. I've only seen one other obscure rifle that uses this system on forgotten weapons years ago, and I'm having a hard time finding it. If you've ever taken the bolt apart, you'd see the extractor spring is not a spring at all, but a little polymer jujube, which is genius. I don't think that would ever need the be replaced.


shoota said:
I will +1 this with the following data point take it for what you will as I was worried about all the talk online about accuracy in this platform.

I was able to dig up a picture of a target I had shot with a rack grade AR-15 with cheap bulk ammo a 15 round sample size a couple years ago. I compared it with the same size target 15 rounds out of the x-95 same distance and ironically the same optic. The x-95 was the same if not slightly better grouping with less flyers. Maybe it was the day maybe it was that particular batch of ammo or I can shoot the x-95 better but regardless I have 0 issues with what I am seeing from this platform accuracy wise. In my humble opinion it's the same as any off the shelf AR shooting the same crappy ammo.

I will caveat by saying that I have no experience with free floated or custom barrel AR-15's that might achieve 1 MOA accuracy with bulk ammo. From my experience 1 MOA in a bolt gun consistently with cheap bulk ammo is hard enough to achieve. But I will let all the internet shooters continue to out shoot me.

Cheers,
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I got into the habit of writing down the ammo, optic, range and weather conditions on my targets and photographing them. When I shot a variety of AR15s with NATO ball and a red dot I got about 2MOA. When I shoot the Tavor and the X95 with NATO ball and a red dot, I get about 2MOA. I'm really not seeing the "accuracy issues" either.
 
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Armedsask said:
Tavor bolt rides exclusively on guide rails. No rods.

It has zero commonality with the AR18.
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Just going to ignore the rest of it, huh?

That guide rod is an antirotation device for the bolt. An AK bolt rides on a rail along with the carrier as it uses a static ejector built into the rail, and this prevents it from rotating before it goes into battery. But because the Tavor uses an AR-inspired spring-loaded ejector and a totally different camming mechanism to both, that guide rod becomes necessary to keep the bolt in alignment when stripping rounds out of the magazine.
 
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Jarvy said:
Just going to ignore the rest of it, huh?

That guide rod is an antirotation device for the bolt. An AK bolt rides on a rail along with the carrier as it uses a static ejector built into the rail, and this prevents it from rotating before it goes into battery. But because the Tavor uses an AR-inspired spring-loaded ejector and a totally different camming mechanism to both, that guide rod becomes necessary to keep the bolt in alignment when stripping rounds out of the magazine.
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AR18 how?

I ignored the rest because it accurately described the AK similarities.
 
Armedsask said:
AR18 how?

I ignored the rest because it accurately described the AK similarities.
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I described the exact components that are clearly AR inspired. If you choose to ignore them, and pretend I didn't say anything, that's your prerogative. But I've laid it out clearly for anyone actually interested. Have a good one.
 
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