Just curious. Ammo shortage in Canada?

[silverfoxdj]

Can't you see what the governments are doing? They're making a few token silly gun laws, to keep us off track to what their real agenda is.
Letting us keep the useless guns, but what good are they without bullets. Soon it will be all gone!
Buy now, and buy fast. Stock pile it and hoard it. Quick, before it's too late. Soon there will be none.
And reloaders aren't safe, either. Whatcha gonna do, with no primers.
Tricky devils. And don't say you weren't forewarned. Woe is me!

Didn't the Obama government propose exactly that somewhere?

 

[hacksaw23]

Local gun store

 

[enfield303t]

Just had another visit with a supplier who deals in the US for much of his product. Went with a fellow CGN member and we were told to BUY if you see what you need. Most manufacturers in the US and Europe are now manufacturing for only the military and NOTHING is coming to Canada.

If you need brass for reloading his quote was "buy it no matter what the price is".

I know the naysayers will be on here any moment but a word to the wise is sufficient.

 

[Hawkeye80]

Most manufacturers in the US and Europe are now manufacturing for only the military and NOTHING is coming to Canada.

lol and you believe this?

 

[enfield303t]

lol and you believe this?

Well seeing he runs a business that relies on sales in the shooting market yes I do and guessing he has forgot more than you know and hasn't forgot much think he is probabaly correct. I was in a big retailer last week, ammo supply overall was pretty dismal, reloading projectiles pretty dismal and brass for cal's that are so offbeat they rarely sell. There was not a single round of brass for any 308-243-270-30-06-303-22-250.

Most ammo from suppliers in the US are now isted as "discontinued" which means they are no longer producing for the civilian market.

You remind me of the poster who said there would be big discount sales starting late last summer (2013) as companies would be fighting for market share, and anyone who knows retail knew that was never going to happen.

Where I have spent countless dollars the guy had over 2 million rounds of .22lr, stocks are dwindling to the point he believes he will not have any for the summer shooting season and has been unable to purchase a single round to replace his stock.

Time will tell, bet he is right!

 

[Hawkeye80]

Well seeing he runs a business that relies on sales in the shooting market yes I do and guessing he has forgot more than you know and hasn't forgot much think he is probabaly correct. I was in a big retailer last week, ammo supply overall was pretty dismal, reloading projectiles pretty dismal and brass for cal's that are so offbeat they rarely sell. There was not a single round of brass for any 308-243-270-30-06-303-22-250.

Most ammo from suppliers in the US are now isted as "discontinued" which means they are no longer producing for the civilian market.

You remind me of the poster who said there would be big discount sales starting late last summer (2013) as companies would be fighting for market share, and anyone who knows retail knew that was never going to happen.

Where I have spent countless dollars the guy had over 2 million rounds of .22lr, stocks are dwindling to the point he believes he will not have any for the summer shooting season and has been unable to purchase a single round to replace his stock.

Time will tell, bet he is right!

It's funny how the people selling the ammo are the sames ones saying "you better stock up before its all gone" and yet they keep getting new stock in while raising prices. If you read that sentence I quoted and think about it for just a minute, you're going to realize how stupid it sounds. Just because your local store doesnt have what you're lookign for doesnt mean there is a shortage. It's people like you spouting this nonsense that there wont be anymore ammo thats causing the "shortage" problem.

 

[enfield303t]

It's funny how the people selling the ammo are the sames ones saying "you better stock up before its all gone" and yet they keep getting new stock in while raising prices. If you read that sentence I quoted and think about it for just a minute, you're going to realize how stupid it sounds. Just because your local store doesnt have what you're lookign for doesnt mean there is a shortage. It's people like you spouting this nonsense that there wont be anymore ammo thats causing the "shortage" problem.

The problem with your argument is the guy that I buy reloading products from doesn't sell loaded ammo so telling me what he is being told by suppliers in the US is no advantage to him.

There is a shortage, maybe you have missed the hundreds of posts on every shooting site that ammo is a premium in many areas and getting worse in others.

I am sure you must be in good with a independent gun store in your area, go in and ask the guy if can get a million rounds of .22lr and get back to me. Ask him to source a couple hundred thousand rounds of US made .308 or .223 and get back to me. After all according to you there is no shortage.

And we all know there has not been a single issue of shortage of common powders for reloading. There is a shortage and things will get much worse before they get better.

 

[critter928]

Most manufacturers in the US and Europe are now manufacturing for only the military and NOTHING is coming to Canada.

Really?

 

[critter928]

and the head of Federal saying the same thing;

http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/gun-shots/2014/03/ammo-shortage-not-conspiracy

 

[enfield303t]

Really?

Well the Hornady video is old and Nato countries especially in Europe are replenishing supplies JIC things go further south with Putin. We aren't going to have a war but they aren't taking any chances.

I wouldn't expect you to believe it as IIRC you stated that there would be manufacturers fighting for market share in the later part of 2013 with discount pricing and ample supply.

 

[enfield303t]

Like I said before, you also must have a friend with a gun shop, have him order a couple hundred thousand .308 or .223 and get back to us when he gets the order. When where I buy .22lr tells me he is unable to resupply and he is down to a few hundred thousand rounds from the two million he had and is concerned he will run out before summer I take it he really does know what he is talking about.

Take a look at CanAm

List 6 kinds of .308 all sold out.

7 kinds of .223 only Norinco and Wolf left. 5 others sold out.

21 different .22lr, all sold out.

2 listings for 30-06, both sold out.

Of course there is no shortage of ammo.

 

[Hawkeye80]

The problem with your argument is the guy that I buy reloading products from doesn't sell loaded ammo so telling me what he is being told by suppliers in the US is no advantage to him.

There is a shortage, maybe you have missed the hundreds of posts on every shooting site that ammo is a premium in many areas and getting worse in others.

I am sure you must be in good with a independent gun store in your area, go in and ask the guy if can get a million rounds of .22lr and get back to me. Ask him to source a couple hundred thousand rounds of US made .308 or .223 and get back to me. After all according to you there is no shortage.

And we all know there has not been a single issue of shortage of common powders for reloading. There is a shortage and things will get much worse before they get better.

I was generalizing about the retailers. I'm not saying there isnt a shortage, buts its not as bad as you're making it out to be. Its being perpetuated by paranoid people that think there wont be anymore ammo and they have to buy everything they see. That is the real problem. Manufactures will eventually meet the demand, it may take 5 years but if there is money to be made they will expand their operation. I also think its silly to think that the military is going to be getting all the ammo that is made in the future. Unfounded statements like that are what can cause shortages. I don't think anyone can say for certain what is going to happen, but if money is to be made you can bet the manufactures will do everything they can to get it.

 

[critter928]

Well the Hornady video is old and Nato countries especially in Europe are replenishing supplies JIC things go further south with Putin. We aren't going to have a war but they aren't taking any chances.

I wouldn't expect you to believe it as IIRC you stated that there would be manufacturers fighting for market share in the later part of 2013 with discount pricing and ample supply.

The Europeans are buying Hornady ammunition for their militaries now?

Can you tell us what rounds they use and what countries use them?

In fact, can you tell me what European powers are buying American ammunition and which ones?

 

[Hawkeye80]

Like I said before, you also must have a friend with a gun shop, have him order a couple hundred thousand .308 or .223 and get back to us when he gets the order. When where I buy .22lr tells me he is unable to resupply and he is down to a few hundred thousand rounds from the two million he had and is concerned he will run out before summer I take it he really does know what he is talking about.

Take a look at CanAm

List 6 kinds of .308 all sold out.

7 kinds of .223 only Norinco and Wolf left. 5 others sold out.

21 different .22lr, all sold out.

2 listings for 30-06, both sold out.

Of course there is no shortage of ammo.

I dont think it was ever easy to get that amount of ammo?

 

[critter928]

Like I said before, you also must have a friend with a gun shop, have him order a couple hundred thousand .308 or .223 and get back to us when he gets the order. When where I buy .22lr tells me he is unable to resupply and he is down to a few hundred thousand rounds from the two million he had and is concerned he will run out before summer I take it he really does know what he is talking about.

Take a look at CanAm

List 6 kinds of .308 all sold out.

7 kinds of .223 only Norinco and Wolf left. 5 others sold out.

21 different .22lr, all sold out.

2 listings for 30-06, both sold out.

Of course there is no shortage of ammo.

So which ones are military rounds used by these European military powers causing this shortage.

The shortage is caused by fear mongers like yourself causing people to hoard.

That is 99% of it.

Even the heads of Hornaday and Federal (in the second video from less than 2 months ago) are saying so and debunking this "the military/government is buying it all" BS.

 

[critter928]

oh look, an article from yesterday;

http://www.adn.com/2014/05/11/3466090/big-shortage-of-little-bullets.html

Big shortage of little bullets: Alaskans line up to buy .22 ammo

While an ammunition shortage may be easing across much of the nation, Alaskans are still having a hard time finding .22-caliber ammunition, among the smallest of rifle and gun cartridges.

In fact, if you aren't at the sporting goods store or gun shop when it opens in the morning, you might have a better chance of encountering Bigfoot roaming the aisles than of finding ammunition for your .22-caliber weapon. It is a shortage that has been years in the making and has hampered gun enthusiasts, recreational and competitive shooters. It has led to daily lines of people standing outside Anchorage stores like Cabela's and Sportsman's Warehouse, waiting for the doors to open so they can get to the freshly stocked ammunition.

About 20 people lined up at the Sportsman's Warehouse store on Old Seward Highway on Tuesday -- many had gotten there a half-hour before the place opened, hoping to get their hands on one of the 30 boxes of .22-caliber cartridges that would be available that day. Once the store opened they made a mad dash to the gun counter, where waiting employees -- without saying a word -- simply handed each a 500-round box. Within 10 minutes it was over. All the .22 ammo had been sold. The scene was similar on Wednesday at Cabela's and plays out regularly across Alaska.

There are many theories about why the once-easy-to-find .22-caliber ammunition is now so hard to locate. It hasn't always been that way. The most popular cartridge shot in the U.S. is .22-caliber, and it is the cornerstone of shooting sports including collegiate and Olympic biathlon as well as riflery. Once, the .22-caliber was as common as a Canada goose in the Last Frontier. But that all changed about three years ago. Why?

"Nobody has been able to explain that, because it was readily available for all of my life," Anchorage shooter Everett Walton said.

According to the National Shooting Sports Foundation -- the trade association for the U.S. firearms and ammunition industries -- the .22-caliber shortage is due to a combination of factors, including demand outstripping the manufacturers ability to supply the cartridges, and people hoarding hard-to-get rounds. The NSSF said that .22-caliber ammunition is the most popular of all cartridge types in the U.S. because it is cheap and the guns that shoot it are favored.

Gun sales are on the rise in the U.S. April saw the second-highest gun sales ever recorded, according to the NSSF. More people shooting .22-caliber ammunition means more demand. That means there is less to go around as manufacturers scramble to increase their capacity to make more.

But the NSSF said many people are confused as to why they can't find their favorite ammunition.

"There are a lot of wild stories," said NSSF public affairs director Mike Bazinet. "One story we've heard anecdotally is that the government is buying up all the ammo. That is not true. Government purchases have gone down over last three years."

Bazinet said the .22-caliber shortage is easing up in the Lower 48, and the rounds can be found from Texas to Connecticut. But in Alaska, the ammunition is still hard to find and even harder to buy.

Some are buying it up and hoarding it, or re-selling boxes of .22-caliber ammo for a profit on websites like Alaska's List. Stores that do get the cartridges can't keep them on the shelves. Most have limited the number of boxes any one person can buy in an effort to keep ammo available.

"We are just as frustrated as our customers because we want to supply the customers with what they want," said Steve Batsch, store director for Fred Meyer on Northern Lights Boulevard.

The .22-caliber cartridges are popular among people who want to teach their children how to shoot. It is small and has little kick when fired. It's also popular for targeting small game like snowshoe hares, grouse and ptarmigan. But .22-caliber is also the round of choice for shooting competitions, including the biathlon -- a combination of Nordic skiing and shooting. Anchorage has a budding biathlon community and the .22-caliber shortage could affect its growth, according Zach Hall, head coach of Alaska Biathlon, a group of about 14 elite-level skiers and shooters. Hall said his group has been waiting eight months for a bulk delivery of the ammunition, and some members had gotten creative in finding ways around the shortage.

"Everybody has been scrambling to locate ammunition," Hall said. "It has gotten to the point that when people have family coming up from Lower 48, they ask them to bring ammunition with them."

The NSSF said it expects the rush on .22-caliber cartridges to lessen as the summer progresses, and that most of the shortages these days are regional problems with hoarding. But how that will play out in Alaska is anyone's guess.

Jeff Patterson stopped by Cabela's on his way to work on Wednesday morning; the store didn't have any that day. Patterson said he has been looking for two years, without success, for .22-caliber cartridges to teach his three kids gun safety and how to hunt.

"It's kind of worthless to have a .22 rifle and not have any ammunition for it," Patterson said.

The government is not buying it all (even with tensions in Europe), production is at record capacity with new equipment, and the shortage is abating in the Southern 48 and the shortages are regional (we are considered a small region not unlike Alaska and face the same issues of being last to catch up with the supply, that is if people stop fear mongering and hoarding all they can find).

 

[enfield303t]

The Europeans are buying Hornady ammunition for their militaries now?

Can you tell us what rounds they use and what countries use them?

In fact, can you tell me what European powers are buying American ammunition and which ones?

Where did I say Europeans were buying from Hornady?

S&B who are one of the largest are showing their military cal's as discontinued. That means they are not manufacturing for the civilian market at this time.

From the conversation I had today most US manufacturers are showing discontinued for countless cal's as they are manufacturing for the military now.

 

[critter928]

Where did I say Europeans were buying from Hornady?

S&B who are one of the largest are showing their military cal's as discontinued. That means they are not manufacturing for the civilian market at this time.

From the conversation I had todaymost US manufacturers are showing discontinued for countless cal's as they are manufacturing for the military now.

Conversations with yourself don't count.

As for the Europeans, you were the one who refuted my Hornady video by saying that things have changed since the Europeans started buying ammo because of tension in Ukraine

Well the Hornady video is old and Nato countries especially in Europe are replenishing supplies JIC things go further south with Putin. We aren't going to have a war but they aren't taking any chances.

Hornady has SFA to do with Europe, and European military contracts have sweet friggen all to do with the US domestic market.

And show me a source (and "infowars" doesn't count) that says Europeans have recently placed ammunition orders bumping civilian orders overnight?

Sorry, but military procurement does not work like that in Europe (or the US), and they don't just order ammunition over night and civilian manufacturers shut down and start making military ammunition. They are completely different divisions and manufacturing facilities in every company that makes ammunition. In fact, we have seen a glut recently in mil spec ammunition hitting the shelves from the US manufactures that have excess capacity because military orders have dropped since the wind down in Afghanistan and previously Iraq.

As for S&B, it is not an American company and is a small component of the US (and our) market, so what does it have to do with the price of tea in China?

Military contracts don't just happen overnight, and the US has all they need and them some, and the Europeans would have the same stockpiles for any tension over Ukraine.

US Military orders are down (the head of Federal said so in the second video from only 2 months ago, and contracts and switch in production doesn't change that fast and you have failed to provide any proof things have changed since he made the statement, like the head of Hornady, to refute everything you have said).

So stop pulling answers out of your arse (and attributing them to imaginary people in your life).

And read the article from yesterday I posted. It refutes everything you said. And again, it was from yesterday.

 

[enfield303t]

So which ones are military rounds used by these European military powers causing this shortage.

The shortage is caused by fear mongers like yourself causing people to hoard.

That is 99% of it.

Even the heads of Hornaday and Federal (in the second video from less than 2 months ago) are saying so and debunking this "the military/government is buying it all" BS.

.

So seeing as you know there is no shortage of ammo, where is it? It is not on the shelves of retailers in the US or Canada. It is not in warehouses in Canada for sure.

People like CanAm are out of lots and their business is ammo so why don't they have it. They are big players in Canada and their business relies of sales so being out is not good business and they are very good at business.

Cash in some of your investments and order a few hundred thousand rounds of .308 or .223, again let us know when you get it.

The supplier we had the conversation with today had nothing to gain by telling us about what is happening, he is known by many on here and considered to be right the vast majority of times. When I met him a couple of weeks ago he told me there would be no new .308-.223-338 Lapua and .300 Win Mag shipped to Canada from a US supplier for the balance of 2014. That coincides with what my local gun shop is telling me, he can't get many cal's and has no idea when he will be able to. He has always given me a discount when I buy Nosler Custom .308 by the case, no longer as last week he told me he can't get a supply so no more deals.

Take a look for what is available in .223 and .308, Tula or Norinco. Ever wonder why no Federal, Winchester or ?? US manufactured?

Thanks for thinking I am responsible for the shortage, (wait you say there is no shortage right) remember California buys more ammo than all of Canada combined.

I await your next prediction of copious amounts of ammo on sale at bargain basement prices as manufacturers attempt to obtain a larger market share..

 

[critter928]

.

So seeing as you know there is no shortage of ammo, where is it? It is not on the shelves of retailers in the US or Canada. It is not in warehouses in Canada for sure.

Reading comprehension failing you?

So which ones are military rounds used by these European military powers causing this shortage.

The shortage is caused by fear mongers like yourself causing people to hoard.

That is 99% of it.

Even the heads of Hornaday and Federal (in the second video from less than 2 months ago) are saying so and debunking this "the military/government is buying it all" BS.

I believe I mention the shortage, and why there is one. I also quoted the head of two of the largest ammunition manufactures in the US saying the same thing (and it is not from the US or European military suddenly buying it).

You can't seem to grasp this.

Ignore the biggest players in the industry, but hey, you talked to your local supplier so you must know more than the rest of us.

People like CanAm are out of lots and their business is ammo so why don't they have it. They are big players in Canada and their business relies of sales so being out is not good business and they are very good at business.

Other than Norinco, CanAm is notoriously short on ammunition supply and cannot keep it in stock when they get it. It has been happening long before the 2013 run on ammunition.

Cash in some of your investments and order a few hundred thousand rounds of .308 or .223, again let us know when you get it.

Why the hell would I do that when supply is catching up and I would loose money.

Besides, I don't want to be part of the problem with the rest of the hoarders and profiteers.

The supplier we had the conversation with today had nothing to gain by telling us about what is happening, he is known by many on here and considered to be right the vast majority of times. When I met him a couple of weeks ago he told me there would be no new .308-.223-338 Lapua and .300 Win Mag shipped to Canada from a US supplier for the balance of 2014. That coincides with what my local gun shop is telling me, he can't get many cal's and has no idea when he will be able to. He has always given me a discount when I buy Nosler Custom .308 by the case, no longer as last week he told me he can't get a supply so no more deals.

And this is form the Europeans and US army buying it all?

BS

We are a small player, and they have little market power when their is a shortage leaving us last to get it when the manufacturers catch up.

Take a look for what is available in .223 and .308, Tula or Norinco. Ever wonder why no Federal, Winchester or ?? US manufactured?

SFRC still has Federal and had a shyte load of it, as did many other manufacturers.

There was a huge amount of AE223 (and still some) that hit the market in bulk packs and ammunition cans.

Thanks for thinking I am responsible for the shortage, (wait you say there is no shortage right) remember California buys more ammo than all of Canada combined.

I await your next prediction of copious amounts of ammo on sale at bargain basement prices as manufacturers attempt to obtain a larger market share..

Not you, people like you (that reading comprehension problem you have again) who fear monger the sky is falling and spread internet rumours (refuted by the manufactures themselves) that the government is buying up all the supply creating the shortage. It is civilian demand causing it. Period.

So which ones are military rounds used by these European military powers causing this shortage.

The shortage is caused by fear mongers like yourself causing people to hoard.

That is 99% of it.

Even the heads of Hornaday and Federal (in the second video from less than 2 months ago) are saying so and debunking this "the military/government is buying it all" BS.

ATK (owner of Federal) makes 99% of the small arms ammunition for the US Government.

They have ONE contract awarded this year (and since the Ukraine situation), and it was for .300 Win Mag.

All the other manufacturing is business as usual, which from the CEO's mouth is down (and his production is up).

That means civilian demand. Period.

Nobody can be as dense as you pretend to be.