K98K,Mosin Nagant,Lee Enfield.

I suggest a sporterized Lee Enfield as a place to start. It has excellent sights, and better trigger than a MN.

You can cut the barrel back to 22" or 20", and fit a low mounted scope, if you like, and no milsurps would have been hurt.

A sported #4 sells for around $250.
 
Dakk said:
Not trying to be a smart ass here, but I could say the same thing about the idea of a refurbed Mosin having collectible value in the first place. I paid more for my daughter's BB gun.

If a WWII era Mosin Soviet refurb looks like crap, and is going to be put back into service, I personally think it's ridiculous to treat it like its Ming dynasty vase. Of all the milsurp stuff out there, the refurbed Mosin is probably the best candidate for refinishing or sporterizing. That's what the OP wanted to know, and that's my opinion.
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Agreed. As I stated befor, my last Mosin had no rifleing. It could not shoot anything beyond 25 yards. I have seen many like this. If these were going to be brought back into service they would have been re-barreled to meet min requirements.
It is also assumed by some here that the poster was going to find some mint collectable and bubba the thing. That was only an assumption on your part. Why attack a guy for asking a question? The Hector the Collector types need to chill.
If I bought a sported Enfield for $100 bucks and added some piece of crap, what's the big deal? It was already altered.
 
I really wanted to say something about overstuffed, pompous little egos who think that they know more about designing a rifle than did Paul Mauser, James Paris Lee or Sergei I. Moisin......

the ones who know more about making a rifle than Ishevsk, Enfield and Oberndorf put together......

the pretentious pills who have to stroke their self-esteem by deluding themselves into thinking that they know more about manufacture than the greatest factories and designers who ever lived......

the ones who have so very little respect for anything other than the middle letter in the word "idiot" that they are willing and eager to trash yet another surviving original rifle of one of the World Wars.....

and then flaunt their ignorance by asking what specimen to wreck..... in a forum devoted to UNwrecking the things.

But I won't say it.

Likely it would get me banned.... after 3500 posts trying to help people.

The Lee-Enfield rifle in any of its produced forms can be an IDEAL rifle for just about any purpose one can imagine. There are a MILLION of them in circulation in this country, nearly ALL already wrecked by guys who thought that they knew more than James Paris Lee, more than Enfield and Lithgow and BSA. Most of them don't shoot terribly well because they NEED all that extra ugly wood to make them shoot accurately, but sometimes you can fudge that one, too. Get one, clean it, keep it clean, tighten it up, feed it on the best handloads you can make and just enjoy the hell out of it, the feel, the history, the immense practicality of a rifle which came out in 1879 and still is unsurpassed today. If it wants help, just ask and I'll be glad to help.

Just don't ask me how to wreck another.
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desporterizer said:
Why bother customising a mosin with a poor bore? BTW, the worst refurb mosin I have ever seen still shot 6" groups at 100 with milsurp.
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I have had 3 that would not shoot 6" at 50 yards.

So Smelly. If I found a cut down, sportered Enfield with no original sights, no lugs on the barrel and cut down crappy wood, then decided to put a new stock on it, am I now destroying a piece of history?
Forget the fact that it's a $50 dollar rifle and not worth the effort. Lets just say I like Enfields and like to work on them regardless of cost. Am I some kind of low life bottem feeder for doing this? I really would like to know.
 
points said:
If I bought a sported Enfield for $100 bucks and added some piece of crap, what's the big deal? It was already altered.
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Thats what everyone is saying - it wouldnt be a big deal at all. It is already sportered. No one here is putting you off sporterizing an already permanently modified rifle. Infact, taking a hacksaw bubba sporter job and fixing into a nice, practical sporting rifle is quite the feat. I have seen a few "bubba hack jobs" turned into really nice sporting rifles.
 
points said:
I have had 3 that would not shoot 6" at 50 yards.
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If you still have them post some pictures! Im sure many of us would really like to help you bring them back to shooter-grade rifles. Sometimes it is something small. I have had Mosins with almost no rifling left shoot really, really well.
 
points said:
I have had 3 that would not shoot 6" at 50 yards.

So Smelly. If I found a cut down, sportered Enfield with no original sights, no lugs on the barrel and cut down crappy wood, then decided to put a new stock on it, am I now destroying a piece of history?
Forget the fact that it's a $50 dollar rifle and not worth the effort. Lets just say I like Enfields and like to work on them regardless of cost. Am I some kind of low life bottem feeder for doing this? I really would like to know.
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What are you saying? If you had money and liked to buy and sporter original rifles........bottom feeder might be the right term. hhaha lol
But in all seriousness if its already been altered, go for it, if not and you really want to, i guess your call, what smellie is saying, is dont ask for advice on which rifle we'd like to have someone butcher and tips on how.
 
ArtyMan said:
If you still have them post some pictures! Im sure many of us would really like to help you bring them back to shooter-grade rifles. Sometimes it is something small. I have had Mosins with almost no rifling left shoot really, really well.
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The first one looked like someone had shot gravel through it. The dealer gladly exchanged it. The second one had no rifleing in the first 3" from the muzzle. It shot 14" groups at 100 yards. I got it to shoot 4" but I can't tell you how I did that or I'll get flamed.
The third one I have been playing with for a couple of weeks. There is no rifleing left. I slugged the bore and all there is is a ghost of the lands. Once I had scrubbed the bore and soaked it in Hopps, the pitting was the deepest thing there was. I counterbored all the way to 1 1/4" to see if there was anything. All shots keyhole as it did from the start.
I remember seeing a lot of old Enfields like that in the 60s and 70s. These were the ones sitting in barrels in pawn shops. I think those all became stakes for tomatoe plants.
 
Thanks for all the ideas guys.

And the reason I was thinking a Mosin at first is that since I could get a refurnished one for a little over $150, and It wouldn't be like I was destroying a piece of history like a M1 Garand or something like that.

I would simple be taking a old unused (really unwanted or uncherished) Old rifle that are cheep as dirt, and turning it into something custom. The only thing I was worried about was the Mount with is expensive for the one I want (RockSolid) and the trigger on the Mosin seems to be pretty god dam awful.

Any ways thanks for all the ideas I will also look into buying one that is already custom but then again that will also take away from the thrill of making it and knowing that it is mine and I can basically say I made that.
 
points said:
The first one looked like someone had shot gravel through it. The dealer gladly exchanged it. The second one had no rifleing in the first 3" from the muzzle. It shot 14" groups at 100 yards. I got it to shoot 4" but I can't tell you how I did that or I'll get flamed.
The third one I have been playing with for a couple of weeks. There is no rifleing left. I slugged the bore and all there is is a ghost of the lands. Once I had scrubbed the bore and soaked it in Hopps, the pitting was the deepest thing there was. I counterbored all the way to 1 1/4" to see if there was anything. All shots keyhole as it did from the start.
I remember seeing a lot of old Enfields like that in the 60s and 70s. These were the ones sitting in barrels in pawn shops. I think those all became stakes for tomatoe plants.
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You cut it down into a 91/59 clone. You might have rotten luck but I am working on mosin #83 & have never seen a russian refurb that bad. Other countries yes but they were sold as worn out, not refurbed for future use. Kind of seems a waste of time to reblue & reassemble a rifle with no rifling.
 
desporterizer said:
You cut it down into a 91/59 clone. You might have rotten luck but I am working on mosin #83 & have never seen a russian refurb that bad. Other countries yes but they were sold as worn out, not refurbed for future use. Kind of seems a waste of time to reblue & reassemble a rifle with no rifling.
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Caught me. Yes I did. And I love it. Hell, if the Russians could do it, why can't I.
 
@ friend Liam: taking somebody else's thrown-away JUNK and making it into a useful and beautiful sporting rifle which will keep your freezer filled for the rest of your grandchildren's lives is ALSO a kind of Art. Nice thing is that the basic rifles are already down around $100, often even less. The expertise to help you through such a project is right HERE and people are willing to help. Then, when you pick it up and go out to play, you can take pride that you DID make a silk purse out of a sow's ear! That's a pretty good feeling, I know. I have done it several times myself with rifles which were already destroyed by people "customising" them. And a point: Moisins are cheap NOW. I remember crates of unfired Kar98ks at $27.50, Lee-Enfields at $8.50, Kar43s at $60. I bought my first serious Target rifle for $10.66...... but they are ALL gone now. The nice, new $150 Moisins are VERY transitory: they will not last. Put away a couple while you still can..... just don't butcher them. They WILL go up in price.

@Points: It is spelled with an "ie", not with a "y". See above for my philosophy. BTW, if that's all the groups you are getting, I would suggest downloading a copy of "Shoot To Live!", the Canadian WW2 manual on how to shoot a rifle. You should also get a copy of Lyman's "Cast Bullet Handbook" to start tightening up your MNs. Then check the bedding.
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smellie said:
@ friend Liam: taking somebody else's thrown-away JUNK and making it into a useful and beautiful sporting rifle which will keep your freezer filled for the rest of your grandchildren's lives is ALSO a kind of Art. Nice thing is that the basic rifles are already down around $100, often even less. The expertise to help you through such a project is right HERE and people are willing to help. Then, when you pick it up and go out to play, you can take pride that you DID make a silk purse out of a sow's ear! .
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:agree:

Well said Smellie.
 
You guys realize that whenever you fire one of these milsurps, your causing some wear to the bore don't you? Whenever you handle it, your body oils are deteriorating the finish.

What!?!?! You removed the original 60 year old 'historical' cosmoline that the Soviets put on the rifle to preserve it?

:rolleyes:
 
Some do, some don't.

If guys want to shoot their rifles, they do.

The important thing is that SOME are left absolutely original.

That is why I haven't fired my 1887 Martini-Henry Mark IV; it still has factory grease in the bore.

Why? Have YOU never tried to keep something just as nice as when it was made?
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