Kapyong
- Thread starter RobAK
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RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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Thanks for the post. The Forgotten War. How sad.
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- land of f-cktards
From the blog.....
F_ck you CBC, our "national" media outlet should have picked this up long ago ! oh well I guess they have better things to do
I actually had the the privilege of buying a kayong vet a beer on remembrance day about 20 years ago .........I was the one of the few in uniform who recognized the decoration it shames me to recall it, that many don't know
F_ck you CBC, our "national" media outlet should have picked this up long ago ! oh well I guess they have better things to do
I actually had the the privilege of buying a kayong vet a beer on remembrance day about 20 years ago .........I was the one of the few in uniform who recognized the decoration it shames me to recall it, that many don't know
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Interesting blog. I look forward to reading it more, the book, and seeing the movie.
As one who has worn the citation in 2VP it is close to my heart to see this project's success. I had the privilege when I lived in Kamloops of becoming good friends with two particular PPCLI Korea vets, both of whom fought in WWII also. One fought in D Day with the Regina Rifles and was later the 2 PPCLI platoon sergeant for "Constant Force" (the Recce/Anti-Armour Platoon) at Kap'yong. The other was a Patricia in WWII who fought in Italy etc and later served as an exchange air spotter for close air support with the yank Air Force and later as a Paratrooper in the Airborne. It was a absolute pleasure to swap lies about our various stories and battles fought over too much scotch. They kept my wife and newborn company while I was deployed to the Middle East as surrogate grandparents. Good people.
As one who has worn the citation in 2VP it is close to my heart to see this project's success. I had the privilege when I lived in Kamloops of becoming good friends with two particular PPCLI Korea vets, both of whom fought in WWII also. One fought in D Day with the Regina Rifles and was later the 2 PPCLI platoon sergeant for "Constant Force" (the Recce/Anti-Armour Platoon) at Kap'yong. The other was a Patricia in WWII who fought in Italy etc and later served as an exchange air spotter for close air support with the yank Air Force and later as a Paratrooper in the Airborne. It was a absolute pleasure to swap lies about our various stories and battles fought over too much scotch. They kept my wife and newborn company while I was deployed to the Middle East as surrogate grandparents. Good people.
My first RSM. Dave Crook, was there. He wore the unit citation on the sleeve of his CF uniforms. If you saw Norm Christie's documentary on that battle "Bloody Hills", Dave was the vet who travelled back there with him.
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It's a shame, there are many intriguing and important stories from all arms of our country from that conflict, no less important than any other conflict.
And how many returned to the military to fight in Korea after WW2 ? I feel the public has no true realization of what that might have took
And how many returned to the military to fight in Korea after WW2 ? I feel the public has no true realization of what that might have took
"...wore the unit citation on the sleeve of his CF uniforms..." He say why? Just curious. The only PUC's I've ever seen on CF uniforms had it over the right pocket.
The really sad part is that it took 8 years for the Canadian government to allow 'em to wear it. Who knows how long it'll be for them to let Rob Furlong(had he stayed in. Apparently he's a cop now.), et al, to wear their Silver Stars.
The really sad part is that it took 8 years for the Canadian government to allow 'em to wear it. Who knows how long it'll be for them to let Rob Furlong(had he stayed in. Apparently he's a cop now.), et al, to wear their Silver Stars.
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2 PPCLI and JTF2 are the only CF units to be awarded the presidential unit citation, AKA "the swimming pool." Vets who were there at the battle wear it above their pockets in perpetuity and all other who serve in that unit subsequently will wear it on the shoulder but only while serving with that unit.
Canada's own Governor General's Unit Citation (the lion) is very similar. Those who were awarded it directly wear it on the left pocket in perpetuity and others serving at the unit will wear it above the right pocket.
The Op ANACONDA snipers were awarded Bronze Stars with V and can wear them like any other medal in order of precedence.
RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Nova Scotia
Yea we were lucky so many WW2 vets went back to korea there experience really helped the green soldiers i think. I think of Jacques Dextra
ze WW2 vet being asked to return to uniform ,agreeing and asking former nco's to join him. When taking command of The R22R in Korea, one of his first statememnts to subordinates was ," Ok there will be no panic and no withdrawls." Defense of Hill 355 with when others withdrw leaving the Vingt Deux surrounded.
When I joined the Army in 1964 virtually all of the senior NCOs and many officers above the rank of Capt were Korean vets. I enjoyed serving with them and learned a lot from them. It was a different Army back then and things were tolerated or dealt with thru Sgt-Maj's punishment that would have folks tossed out nowadays. Jeez, I well remember a 2LT who put his own father, a Cpl cook, on charge for being pi$$ed on duty.
I served with SSgt (WO) Len Barton who won the MM as a young Pte at Kapyong and got pretty shot up in the process. Len was a great practical joker and always took things on the lighter side. He used to enjoy pushing the officer's buttons from the CO on down and seemed to know just how far to take it. Ken Barwise, another MM winner from Kapyong, was retired locally and died a couple of years ago. He was pretty well debilitated and confined to a wheelchair, but was still seen on Remembrance Day with a heavy chest of medals.
We still had a pretty good sprinkling of Korea vets in the PPCLI bns 40 years ago. Our RSM in 1 PPCLI, John-John Richardson, who also won the MM after Kapyong, was one. Places were found for the old Sgts and Cpls in transport and stores where they continued to give excellent service. They were great guys in the field where they always knew what to do and when to do it and needed no supervision. I always found them to be a lot of fun and a great help, and was happy to have soldiered with them. I can still remember sharing a tent group with a gang of the old bandits on winter schemes where moose stew always seemed to appear in preference to IRPs. Takes me back to a winter exercise in the Ghost River Wilderness where the game warden pulled up to the CP vehicle to make a complaint about our guys poaching a moose. I knew exactly who he was talking about, but of course stated that we weren't here to do that sort of thing. He was a smart old-timer who came back with the retort that there were APC tracks leading to and away from the scene of the "crime", and he figured that we were the only people around who were driving those things.
I told him that we would investigate and assured him that the miscreants would be found and severely punished.
I served with SSgt (WO) Len Barton who won the MM as a young Pte at Kapyong and got pretty shot up in the process. Len was a great practical joker and always took things on the lighter side. He used to enjoy pushing the officer's buttons from the CO on down and seemed to know just how far to take it. Ken Barwise, another MM winner from Kapyong, was retired locally and died a couple of years ago. He was pretty well debilitated and confined to a wheelchair, but was still seen on Remembrance Day with a heavy chest of medals.
We still had a pretty good sprinkling of Korea vets in the PPCLI bns 40 years ago. Our RSM in 1 PPCLI, John-John Richardson, who also won the MM after Kapyong, was one. Places were found for the old Sgts and Cpls in transport and stores where they continued to give excellent service. They were great guys in the field where they always knew what to do and when to do it and needed no supervision. I always found them to be a lot of fun and a great help, and was happy to have soldiered with them. I can still remember sharing a tent group with a gang of the old bandits on winter schemes where moose stew always seemed to appear in preference to IRPs. Takes me back to a winter exercise in the Ghost River Wilderness where the game warden pulled up to the CP vehicle to make a complaint about our guys poaching a moose. I knew exactly who he was talking about, but of course stated that we weren't here to do that sort of thing. He was a smart old-timer who came back with the retort that there were APC tracks leading to and away from the scene of the "crime", and he figured that we were the only people around who were driving those things.
I told him that we would investigate and assured him that the miscreants would be found and severely punished.
Worn there on the full dress scarlets (48th Highrs.) on the right upper arm. I recall it being done on his greens as well. This was in the 1973-77 period and may have been particular to the 48th own "house rules". He was also the only person in the unit who had one which may have some bearing as well. Then again it was 37 years ago and I may be stroking out......
Sit Rep: not stroking out. Found this:
A-AD-265-000/AG-001
CANADIAN FORCES DRESS INSTRUCTIONS
2001-06-15
Quote:
PRESIDENTIAL UNIT CITATION OF THE UNITED STATES ARMY
This emblem (see A-AD-200-000/AG-000 The Honours, Flags and Heritage Structure of the Canadian Forces) shall be worn by authorized personnel on both sleeves of the service dress and mess dress jackets, centred 6.5 cm (2 1/2 in.) below the shoulder seam. The insignia shall also be worn on both sleeves of the No. 3B short-sleeved shirts of authorized personnel, centred 6.5 cm (2 1/2 in.) below the shoulder seam.
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RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
When I joined the Army in 1964 virtually all of the senior NCOs and many officers above the rank of Capt were Korean vets. I enjoyed serving with them and learned a lot from them. It was a different Army back then and things were tolerated or dealt with thru Sgt-Maj's punishment that would have folks tossed out nowadays. Jeez, I well remember a 2LT who put his own father, a Cpl cook, on charge for being pi$$ed on duty.
I served with SSgt (WO) Len Barton who won the MM as a young Pte at Kapyong and got pretty shot up in the process. Len was a great practical joker and always took things on the lighter side. He used to enjoy pushing the officer's buttons from the CO on down and seemed to know just how far to take it. Ken Barwise, another MM winner from Kapyong, was retired locally and died a couple of years ago. He was pretty well debilitated and confined to a wheelchair, but was still seen on Remembrance Day with a heavy chest of medals.
We still had a pretty good sprinkling of Korea vets in the PPCLI bns 40 years ago. Our RSM in 1 PPCLI, John-John Richardson, who also won the MM after Kapyong, was one. Places were found for the old Sgts and Cpls in transport and stores where they continued to give excellent service. They were great guys in the field where they always knew what to do and when to do it and needed no supervision. I always found them to be a lot of fun and a great help, and was happy to have soldiered with them. I can still remember sharing a tent group with a gang of the old bandits on winter schemes where moose stew always seemed to appear in preference to IRPs. Takes me back to a winter exercise in the Ghost River Wilderness where the game warden pulled up to the CP vehicle to make a complaint about our guys poaching a moose. I knew exactly who he was talking about, but of course stated that we weren't here to do that sort of thing. He was a smart old-timer who came back with the retort that there were APC tracks leading to and away from the scene of the "crime", and he figured that we were the only people around who were driving those things.
Enjoyed reading that. That was a special time to be in the Canadian Army with those Veterans. What you are relating is history that needs to be on paper. You know Purple there are people such as myself who like the details of day to day Regimental life both in garrison and on deployment. I remember a guy who worked with me up to the early 90s who was RCR from 56-58. He said he was 2nd Bn who were the paratroopers and he was a bren gunner. He told me different stories and i loved every minute of it. One story was concerning a chap who accidentally shot his section buddy threw the head with a No4, in barracks, but it was in a different company and they were all confined to barracks because of it. Just this year I was reading on a site with the same 20 questions asked to Canadian Soldiers of different eras and by god a guy who was in the same Battalion ,same year , related the same story but it was in his barracks! What a coincidence. This stuff means alot to me. When soldiers are telling you their story, even though you were not there, by others stories you have heard and read, you can relate and talk about specific details and the people light right up because since they were retired or got out they maybe had no one to relate details of their service life to
!
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Old soldiers are the most terrible of bullsh*tters you know, and that's one of the reasons why they get to be old soldiers.
When they say, "there's no life like it", it's true. You don't live like a millionaire, but you get a million dollars worth of life experiences in some pretty wierd and wonderful places and circumstances. The thing that holds it all together is the comraderie of shared experiences and working together to get it done, stuff that the average civvy can't conceive of, but which another old sweat can instantly relate to. You miss some things and it plays hell on the family life, but on balance it was and is a pretty good ride.
Just thinking back to the Korea vets, we had a long-in -the- tooth Cpl in the Bn Orderly Room who had been bayonetted in the groin by a Chinaman in Korea. The story was that old George got the Chinaman who got him and and was taken care of in his later service by having a permanent job running the Gestetner machine, cranking out routine orders and the like, in those pre-photocopier, pre-computer days. He was excused all parades and PT and had a pretty jammy go of it in recognition of his long and loyal service in a hard time and place.
When they say, "there's no life like it", it's true. You don't live like a millionaire, but you get a million dollars worth of life experiences in some pretty wierd and wonderful places and circumstances. The thing that holds it all together is the comraderie of shared experiences and working together to get it done, stuff that the average civvy can't conceive of, but which another old sweat can instantly relate to. You miss some things and it plays hell on the family life, but on balance it was and is a pretty good ride.
Just thinking back to the Korea vets, we had a long-in -the- tooth Cpl in the Bn Orderly Room who had been bayonetted in the groin by a Chinaman in Korea. The story was that old George got the Chinaman who got him and and was taken care of in his later service by having a permanent job running the Gestetner machine, cranking out routine orders and the like, in those pre-photocopier, pre-computer days. He was excused all parades and PT and had a pretty jammy go of it in recognition of his long and loyal service in a hard time and place.
RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Old soldiers are the most terrible of bullsh*tters you know, and that's one of the reasons why they get to be old soldiers.
When they say, "there's no life like it", it's true. You don't live like a millionaire, but you get a million dollars worth of life experiences in some pretty wierd and wonderful places and circumstances. The thing that holds it all together is the comraderie of shared experiences and working together to get it done, stuff that the average civvy can't conceive of, but which another old sweat can instantly relate to. You miss some things and it plays hell on the family life, but on balance it was and is a pretty good ride.
Just thinking back to the Korea vets, we had a long-in -the- tooth Cpl in the Bn Orderly Room who had been bayonetted in the groin by a Chinaman in Korea. The story was that old George got the Chinaman who got him and and was taken care of in his later service by having a permanent job running the Gestetner machine, cranking out routine orders and the like, in those pre-photocopier, pre-computer days. He was excused all parades and PT and had a pretty jammy go of it in recognition of his long and loyal service in a hard time and place.
Exactly. I understand what you mean. I started with DND as a civilian in 1980 and there was an old guy who was the cleaner in our building. He was cheerful, but slow no panic be early 60s at the time. I remember speaking about him to another older worker and he said these jobs were kinda made for those guys because of their time in the service. I wasnt that famaliar at the time about WW2 but when i spoke to him about it he said yes he landed on D Day and through the end of the War. He said you know i was a sergeant when we landed on D-day. I carried a Thompson Sub machine-gun. I can't remember for sure but i believe he was North Novies part of the 9th brigade. The things i know now, but i didnt know or have the sense to ask him about because i was too young. When I see a popular clip of Canadians moving inland on D-day and i see a guy with a thompson, kinda drifting sideways as though he tripped i always wonder could that be him.Or another clip i see soldiers moving through a village just in land from juno, one has a Sten and hes just a very tiny man, i always say to myself," is that Kenny", another guy who was retiring at the same time i started work. These guys are all gone now and the questions i could ask now. This is why i am so nosey sorry. My Grandfather was a veteran of the Great War and died when i was 7 in '68 so no chats there. One question for you. When you joined in 64 did you wear the new combats or the old battledress first?
I was in the Reserves from 84-90 before I went Reg. There was an RSS MCpl who was the storesman that was a Korea Vet.
He didn't talk much about it but the thing I remember the most is when someone #####ed about the issue sleeping bag (the old open topped ones, not the tapered ones that are issued now) and he said "Just be happy that I'm not giving you two wool blankets".
His service in Korea was confirmed by the much younger Captain attached to the unit, not that we doubted it. He retired soon after I got in.
He didn't talk much about it but the thing I remember the most is when someone #####ed about the issue sleeping bag (the old open topped ones, not the tapered ones that are issued now) and he said "Just be happy that I'm not giving you two wool blankets".
His service in Korea was confirmed by the much younger Captain attached to the unit, not that we doubted it. He retired soon after I got in.
RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Yea i remember a Canadian Vet being interviewed in a documentary about Korea, i think he was 2 PPCLI, saying one of the first things he saw when he arrived near the front in Korea was the bodies of scores if not hundreds of American soldiers all dead in their sleeping bags after a surprise night attack on them by the enemy i guess because of poor sentry postings and patrols. He said his platoon guys said the bastards will never get us asleep in our bags, so he said he spent many a cold sleepness night over that i beleieve just with blankets. Wish i could remember the documentary. Maybe someone can give the name of it.
