Kel-tec Rdb/Rfb owners.

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Mitchum96

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Thinking of buying a keg Tec Rdb/Rfb.
Got lots of .223/5.56 and am thinking of going the Rdb route, but would like to have opinions of owners to see if it’s better to just buy the .308 version?
This is going to be the cheap version of a Tavor, cause I just can’t build the courage to buy the .308 version.

Positive or negative feedback is encouraged.
 
While I certainly wouldn't trust it as a go to battle gun, they are excellent for the price as long as you can get past the plastic flashing and the overuse of screws to bolt the clamshells together.

About the only thing they do better than the Tavor series is accuracy and price... and I suppose Factory trigger should be included in that too .
 
onetwentyish said:
.....About the only thing they do better than the Tavor series is accuracy and price... and I suppose Factory trigger should be included in that too .
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The basic design of the RDB is far simpler than that of the Tavor X95 or Tavor 7. In the mechanical world where simpler generally = better, the RDB has a distinct edge over the Tavor. With its superior operating system design, accuracy and trigger, combined with its much lower ($1300!) price and equal reliability, the RDB has much to commend it in direct competition with the IWI Tavor X95. The only down-side to the RDB that I could ascertain was the difficulty associated with clearing a double-feed or other feeding obstruction in the breech area, which is difficult to observe and physically rectify on the Keltec product. Aside from that? It is absolutely good to go with zero hesitation to recommend - especially at the $1500 price point!!
 
I've owned all of the above and I prefer the RDB over the x95 I had, also my RFB fired all ammunition I figured I'd sell it and "upgrade" to the T7 and that damn gun wouldn't fire off the norinco .308 bulk I had stacked up so I sold it and will be looking for a RFB yet again.
 
I don’t know that you can add much to what Bartok said. He knows his stuff.

I will say that my RFB, with handloads, was dang accurate for a 308 semi. At 100 I shot a lot of groups in that 1 1/4” area. A friend of mine, who is a better trigger-puller than I am, shot several groups at MOA or just under. Nothing like being outshot with your own rifle. Pissed me off every time he did it.
 
Have you shot one before? It's seems a love or hate relationship. I couldn't get used to mine comfortably so I ended up selling at a couple hundred loss after only a box of ammo.
 
I also like my RFB and it shoots far more accurately than I expected. You need to buy the after market vinyl check piece and a decent scope mount Burris PEPR...
 
selling point is the big issue with the tavor and clearly its not that much better than the kel-tec. I like the fact that it is also a less complex operating system than a tavor. as for this double feed issue or obstructions how often would that happen? after a couple rounds or a couple boxes?
 
I have both an X95 and an RDB.

The RDB certainly has the better trigger but mine currently has a serious trigger problem, in that it doubles, quite often. The biggest issue is that I am not the first owner so I am out of luck when it comes to a warranty fix. The second issue is that no gunsmiths want to work on the RDB. The rifle is currently sitting, waiting for me to figure a way to fix the darn trigger.

Like many Keltec designs, the RDB has some odd design features and as noted above, clearing a jam or double feed is kind of a PIA. Double feeds are quite easy to induce if the gas system is not set high enough for the ammo.



The X95 is more expensive and heavier but it is decidedly more durable and in my experience, way more reliable. The X95 was designed and built for military use. The RDB was designed by engineers freebasing magic mushrooms.
 
Rifle Master said:
I've owned all of the above and I prefer the RDB over the x95 I had, also my RFB fired all ammunition I figured I'd sell it and "upgrade" to the T7 and that damn gun wouldn't fire off the norinco .308 bulk I had stacked up so I sold it and will be looking for a RFB yet again.
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Tavor 7s can hit primers harder with the firing pin spring removed.
 
I Dont Care About You said:
I have both an X95 and an RDB.

The RDB certainly has the better trigger but mine currently has a serious trigger problem, in that it doubles, quite often. The biggest issue is that I am not the first owner so I am out of luck when it comes to a warranty fix. The second issue is that no gunsmiths want to work on the RDB. The rifle is currently sitting, waiting for me to figure a way to fix the darn trigger.

Like many Keltec designs, the RDB has some odd design features and as noted above, clearing a jam or double feed is kind of a PIA. Double feeds are quite easy to induce if the gas system is not set high enough for the ammo.



The X95 is more expensive and heavier but it is decidedly more durable and in my experience, way more reliable. The X95 was designed and built for military use. The RDB was designed by engineers freebasing magic mushrooms.
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As always, experiences may vary. I have never experienced doubling, which (from the outside, looking in) is probably attributable to an out of spec Disconnector. My reliabitity was also flawless for most of a 1000 rd case PMC XTac 55gr ammo once the gas was properly adjusted. I know that you know how to adjust the gas on an adjustable rifle so I won't bother telling you how to suck eggs, but that seems to be the downfall of most RDB owners. They simply don't know how to deal with an infinitely adjustable Gas Regulator.

Your experience in finding a gunsmith to work on your Keltec product is potentially more troubling. I wonder why the reluctance to take your money? A trigger job is a trigger job, and the RDB trigger cannot be THAT different from any other. Aside from a lack of factory spare parts I can see no reason for a 'smith to refuse work.... IIRC, Vault Distribution is the Canadian Distributor for Keltec products. I had no problem in obtaining warranty service on my Canadian-retailed RFB back in the day, but if you are the 3rd owner of a rifle purchased from IRG, you may be out of luck for Canadian Warranty coverage....
 
Bartok5 said:
As always, experiences may vary. I have never experienced doubling, which (from the outside, looking in) is probably attributable to an out of spec Disconnector. My reliabitity was also flawless for most of a 1000 rd case PMC XTac 55gr ammo once the gas was properly adjusted. I know that you know how to adjust the gas on an adjustable rifle so I won't bother telling you how to suck eggs, but that seems to be the downfall of most RDB owners. They simply don't know how to deal with an infinitely adjustable Gas Regulator.

Your experience in finding a gunsmith to work on your Keltec product is potentially more troubling. I wonder why the reluctance to take your money? A trigger job is a trigger job, and the RDB trigger cannot be THAT different from any other. Aside from a lack of factory spare parts I can see no reason for a 'smith to refuse work.... IIRC, Vault Distribution is the Canadian Distributor for Keltec products. I had no problem in obtaining warranty service on my Canadian-retailed RFB back in the day, but if you are the 3rd owner of a rifle purchased from IRG, you may be out of luck for Canadian Warranty coverage....
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I screwed around w the gas and the rifle was running fine from that perspective but I did get some experience clearing failures to eject and the following double feed.

I went back and forth with Vault and I am definitely SOL for warranty work. They won't even fix the rifle for me at my cost. They don't want to touch it. They did suggest a smith in Vancouver who might work on the rifle. I need to contact them as I will be down that way soon. Would save me the shipping cost one way at least.

I've had other things to deal with lately so the RDB took a back seat for a while.
 
I own both an RDB and an RFB, never had an issue with either, my RFB is damn accurate (talking under 1moa with good ammo at 100m), I replaced the plastic factory handguard with the Lucky Irishman one, my RDB is a fun gun, I upgraded the trigger spring with the MCarbo one dropping it down to a ~2.5lb triggerpull, as well as replacing the handguard with the Lucky Irishman extended one and his extended bolt release, also kitted it out with everything Haga Defense has for it, imo it turns it into a much better gun ergonomically. If you can find an RDB for $1300 it's worth it, I don't regret either purchase.
 
From personal experience, if you're thinking of buying a Kel-Tec product, it is best to avoid scalpers and purchase one brand new from a store, even if this means waiting for the next shipment to arrive.

Kel-Tec, unfortunately, does not have the best reputation for reliability or quality control. You are more likely to require warranty work on a Kel-Tec than most other 'name brand' firearms. The Kel-Tec warranty is a lifetime one, but only for the original owner - it cannot be transferred. So if you buy a used one, even an unfired, secondhand Kel-Tec from a scalper, you don't get any coverage. That might be okay on something like a Sub-2000, since they're pretty simple and generally reliable. Most people do a ton of mods on their S2Ks that can void the warranty, anyway.

The other thing I'd do before purchasing is to ask the store "who is providing the warranty support?" This is an important question to ask, because some distributors have been known to push US-market Kel-Tecs onto Canadian retailers, who then sell these grey market firearms to unsuspecting customers. These firearms do not come with the standard warranty. If the store can't give you an answer, then you might want to hold off. AFAIK, Vault Distribution is the only warranty center in Canada and they were only servicing firearms that they had imported themselves. I have heard rumours that Amchar is supposedly an approved Canadian distributor for Kel-Tec now, but I have no idea if that's true or not.

Some people are perfectly happy buying a gun without warranty coverage, and that's a call you'll have to make for yourself.
 
As the third owner, I have no warranty on my RDB. It is currently in at a Smith having the trigger sorted out because the thing started doubling pretty reliably and even dumped a 5-round mag one time. Once the rifle is back from the Smith, it's gonna get sold.

I like the RDB, it has an excellent trigger but the X95 I bought to replace it is just more durable and reliable and less prone to problems and getting jammed up with dirt.
 
The "doubling" on an RDB seems to be caused by a slam-fire action.
(Meaning that the round gets fired as the chamber is closing on said round.)

I had one that would not only double when the trigger was pulled, but also fire when you simply dropped the bolt on a fresh magazine.

I sent it back to IRG, who sent it back to Keltec for warranty repair.
They replaced all the guts of the rifle, and it's been fine ever since.
 
Dexter Morgan said:
The "doubling" on an RDB seems to be caused by a slam-fire action.
(Meaning that the round gets fired as the chamber is closing on said round.)

I had one that would not only double when the trigger was pulled, but also fire when you simply dropped the bolt on a fresh magazine.

I sent it back to IRG, who sent it back to Keltec for warranty repair.
They replaced all the guts of the rifle, and it's been fine ever since.
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As the third owner of this rifle I have no warranty. Mine has never fired upon chambering a round. It has always been the result of a trigger pull.
 
Tavor all the way.

I had one of the early batches of RFB in Canada. I liked it. Very handy and the forward ejection with the brass dribbling out was cool. Trigger was good. You needed to buy a kydex cheek rest for it. Made things more comfortable.accuracy was ok. Likes steel cases ammo. Now the bad… build quality and interior design. Tilting block carrier. Think Remington 870, svt40 etc. Works but this gun is nowhere near the quality of the more famous tilting block bolts like the FN FAL. So a bit of a throwback on the bolt / carrier design. Far from a deal breaker. Then you get the long ramp for the spent casing along with the mechanism. Early examples had cases of the welds breaking. There have been incidents of the the switch mechanism ( pushes the brass down the ramp) have issues as well. Now add in the polymer quality. It was solid but felt like good consumer grade. Unknown if it would holdup to heat or extreme cold. Definitely not tested for hard use. But again solid feel, not flimsy. Last but not least it uses Fal type mags. So a less common magazine today.

Of the three of my shooting group that bought RFBs when they first came in. None of us still own them.

Tavors. I have experience with the Tar 21, X95 and T7. Solid firearms. Well built, solid and feel like they were made for any environment. My current favourite is the X95. The older Tar 21 with podium bipod is a lot of fun though too. The T7 is a strange mix between the X95 and Tar 21. Compact like the RFB, but built right and doesn’t feel like a weld will break. I consider the T7 to be what the RFB should have been. Also Uses easy to find SR25 mags. Including Pmsgs.

Of course price plays a part. The RFB is 2/3 s the price of the T7.

Off the options listed and if ok with 223/5.56 then the X95 is my favourite. For 308, T7 over RFB.

Ultimately though yiu will have fun with any of these. They are cool and different that the usual. I just prefer the quality of the Tavors over the Kel Tec.
 
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