Keyhole 303s

SKScanuck

SKScanuck

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My favorite 303 Brit load of 174g hornady FMJBT over 26g WC735 is currently giving me about 3-4 keyholed flyers out of 10 rounds.


The only two things I have done different since I loaded up my last batch are:

1. I now use a sonic brass washer; and
2. I now use a hornady scale/powder dispenser.

I am going to pull a couple, (but not all 100!) to check the powder weight on a beam scale and check for dampness in the powder. My suspicion is I did not get the casings dry enough and I may have damp powder in some.

The bullet OAL is fine, all the bullets are crimped in place and this load has been great for me in the past.

Any other suggestions I should look at?
 
SKScanuck said:
My favorite 303 Brit load of 174g hornady FMJBT over 26g WC735 is currently giving me about 3-4 keyholed flyers out of 10 rounds.


The only two things I have done different since I loaded up my last batch are:

1. I now use a sonic brass washer; and
2. I now use a hornady scale/powder dispenser.

I am going to pull a couple, (but not all 100!) to check the powder weight on a beam scale and check for dampness in the powder. My suspicion is I did not get the casings dry enough and I may have damp powder in some.

The bullet OAL is fine, all the bullets are crimped in place and this load has been great for me in the past.

Any other suggestions I should look at?
Click to expand...

Do you have any other bullets to test ? Will it shoot a 180 or 150 without keyholing ? (im wondering if your barrel is going south and can no longer stabilize that bullet)

Or as you mentioned, maybe some of your loads were so weak and didnt' have the rpm to stabilize.
 
If the velocity is too low to stabilize I would have thought that the recoil drop would be noticed.

damp powder sounds like a good theory. Load a few more in dry cases and seeif they work.

if they do, pull the others, spread the powder out on a cookie sheet overnight and then mix it back into the powder can and shake. the speed of this batch will now be a bit different than it sued to be. probably a bit slower. moisture content is one of the variables in powder.
 
I could not get that combo to shoot well even at max loads, I find that the wc735 is not dense enough, too much air space for my liking. Not sure what my load was but it was much more than that.
 
Have you slugged the bore? I ran into something similar. I used to shoot them just fine in my No1 Mk3 and switched to cast bullets for plinking. When I switched back 9/10 of them keyholed. For me it's definitely size since 150gr and 180gr .312's shoot fine. Perhaps I wore out the last bit of rifling required to properly engage the smaller .3105 projectiles?
 
I slugged the bore about 4 years ago. I actually still have the slug. I will slug it again and compare the two.

As for the powder and bullet combo, I have shot at least 500 hundred of these previously and can get 4-5" groups at 100 yards from the bench with a rest pretty consistently.

I will cry if it is my barrel.. ovrec:ang I love that gun!
 
You might try a flat base bullet instead of the boat tail especially if your barrel is showing signs of wear. There are brand new barrels available, is it a no 4, a No 1 or a P-14?

Scott
 
I slugged the bore and it is 0.303 and 0.316

I have some 150g 0.312 that I will try in in tomorrow.

I think it has to be the rifling as I shot a match today and now I am getting 4-5 fliers per 10. So the numbers of fliers are increasing which suggests it is not my scale or wet casings.

And I discovered I threw the old slug I had out a few months back. Dammit!:bangHead:
 
SKScanuck said:
My favorite 303 Brit load of 174g hornady FMJBT over 26g WC735 is currently giving me about 3-4 keyholed flyers out of 10 rounds
Click to expand...

John Y Cannuck said:
Are you using a scope?
Check mounts.
Typical issue sights are pretty tough, but still worth checking, as are the stock screws etc.
Click to expand...

A scope/sight problem might account for flyers, but not the bullets flying sideways.

I'm afraid your diagnosis is right and your barrel has had the bisquit. Nothing about your loads, sights, bedding etc, would account for stability problems, especially since it used to shoot well with the same loads.
 
:)

I believe it is the barrel. I bought this gun, a 1943 Longbranch in 2003 or 2004. I can personally say I have shot about 2500 rounds out of this rifle. I use it for Military surplus matches that I participate in 3-4 times a year.

Anyhow, here is a photo of my "snap" stage at 100 yards, (hence the 2'x2' group!). The big thing to note is the 5 obvious keyholes using 0.3105 bullets.

IMG-20120910-00445.jpg


I shot this today, 17 rapid shots from the bench (I signed in at 12:35 and out at 13:00 and that includes putting up target, checking it twice, removing targets and packing up).

IMG-20120910-00444.jpg


The idea of today's shoot was to see if I could get a keyhole with 0.312 bullets. No keyholes. Group seems okay as well, but I should move my front sight a blade width to the right and drop the rear down a bit. Anyhow, I think I am moving to 0.312 bullets.
 
since my last EE purchase i now have 6 Enfields three are number 4s, only One will consistently place groups with boat tail rounds without key holing, two reasons why is one that it has a tight bore and most importantly two its a five groove barrel not two groove. two grooves have a hard time due to inefficient twist on the boat tail.

your posted specs on your slugging shouldn't cause an issue some barrels came out .317 right from the beginning. that being said if its a two groove barrel I'd stick with .312 bullets anyway less headaches and better groups.
 
If it was mine, I'd try 314299 cast bullet (316 dia.) with your load of 26gr of WC735. Far cheaper than a new barrel, also cheaper to load and far less wearing on your barrel.
Grouch
 
original specs for the Lee Enfield gave .316 as the MAX. .317 would have been rejected.
Steve at 303british.com used to make some .314 in 180gr and .3145 in 200gr but stopped because he could not sell them. No one wanted them. I bought several boxes he had left and have asked him for more, but he refuses to set up since he can't make them work for him as a business venture.
Perhaps, if we all pre-paid an order, he would do just that though. I would be willing to go in for a few hundred.
 
I still have around 160 or so of his .314" 200 gr bullets. They are easily the most accurate hunting bullet I have used in several Lee Enfields, and they really perform on game.

Ted
 
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