Keymod VS Mlok. Whats the Verdict and some of the better options for both?

[onetwentyish]

So I am in search of the right rail to host my accessories on a future Modern Varmint build and I am looking for suggestions, and also thought this is a perfect opportunity to find out your guys' thoughts on which is better and any evidence supporting your claim! I have some experience in the past with keymod and liked it, but I have never had anything to do with Mlok. I no longer have any keymod either, so I can start fresh collecting accessories and keep all one in the same for the future.

So what I am looking for from you folks is:
-In your opinion whats better
-any literature or videos as supporting evidence
-some of your favorite rail suggestions, hopefully with a link of where to buy.

 

[Exlibris]

I like the idea of keymod, because it is non-proprietary, but most people seem to just end up buying keymod rail sections to attach the accessories they want since there isn't enough being built natively keymod.

 

[mebiuspower]

but most people seem to just end up buying keymod rail sections to attach the accessories they want

Not me. I use the BCM offset light mount for my Inforce WML but I was using the HSP offset mount for my picatinny rail anyway.

I also used a Larue Harris bipod adapter previously but now I use the PWS Harris bipod adapter for keymod.

 

[cr5]

The last three freefloat forends I've purchased came with a continuous top rail and two or three smaller rail sections with attachment hardware. That provided more than enough rail space for anything I need on a rifle. None were keymod or mlok and all worked just fine.
So to answer your poll with an option not provided, I don't care what system it uses as long as it holds solid. I don't feel the need to weigh down my rifles with lights and lasers, and I certainly don't need to move things from one rifle to another on a regular basis.

Go Joe

 

[dusticles]

^^^ This!

The system isn't as important as making sure the rail and attachment hardware are quality. I see so many guys raving about which is better and then find out they attached a polymer pic rail on there anyways...

Aside from that, I have noticed more support for Keymod locally but I'm sure that changes store to store.

 

[onetwentyish]

The point I am trying to get at guys is I want to skip the add on pic rail inbetween the accessory and the hand guard. I hate extra weight and bulk that is needlessly there, so there for I am looking at proprietary scout light mounts and and proprietary handstop kits, all in the name of weight savings and streamlining the rifle with out giving up functionality!

Cr5, I know you are a minimalist and use what ever works, and thats fine for you, but I am looking to build a high end rifle with which ever forend design is likely to be the most relevant x many years down the road. I know I plan to go Mlok on my ACR, so maybe thats just what I should go with.

 

[cr5]

The point I am trying to get at guys is I want to skip the add on pic rail inbetween the accessory and the hand guard. I hate extra weight and bulk that is needlessly there, so there for I am looking at proprietary scout light mounts and and proprietary handstop kits, all in the name of weight savings and streamlining the rifle with out giving up functionality!

Cr5, I know you are a minimalist and use what ever works, and thats fine for you, but I am looking to build a high end rifle with which ever forend design is likely to be the most relevant x many years down the road. I know I plan to go Mlok on my ACR, so maybe thats just what I should go with.

Lol, you want to skip needless weight and keep it steamlined but you're putting on lights and handstop kits? That's all needless crap since a quality optic will give you all the vision you need for varmint hunting till it's almost completely dark. Once it gets darker than a good scope will be useful for I think you'd be better off with a night vision scope than a light which is only good for short range and adds a bunch of weight to the muzzle.

As usual you know I like giving you a hard time about your mall ninja stuff so take it for what it is.

 

[mebiuspower]

 

[onetwentyish]

Lol, you want to skip needless weight and keep it steamlined but you're putting on lights and handstop kits? That's all needless crap since a quality optic will give you all the vision you need for varmint hunting till it's almost completely dark. Once it gets darker than a good scope will be useful for I think you'd be better off with a night vision scope than a light which is only good for short range and adds a bunch of weight to the muzzle.

As usual you know I like giving you a hard time about your mall ninja stuff so take it for what it is.

You do realize that NV requires IR illumination for best results. That usually means the IR Surefire lamp, which I just so happen to have for my one scout light! Mainly I will be running the Surefire Scout 600u for coyotes tho, and I do like a little bit of kit just not anything obtrusive like an RVG or AFG.

I also have another Specter DR lined up.

 

[onetwentyish]

After watching those I am now leaning back towards keymod for the precision and repeatability of mounting accessories, although any aiming devices like a DBAL would likely be top rail mounted, so probably irrelevant....

 

[Jaws]

I like the idea of keymod, because it is non-proprietary, but most people seem to just end up buying keymod rail sections to attach the accessories they want since there isn't enough being built natively keymod.

Actually in the MLOK vs Keymod situation the route Magpul took is the better solution.
M-LOK standard requires license, BUT IT'S FREE.
The license is a requirement, so all vendors respect the specs. There are already plenty problems with keymod, because many vendors just mess up the specs, or like in the case of H&K make their own version.
There's nothing to force them to respect the keymod specs, so all accessories are compatible.
If one has a lot invested in keymod accessories, keymod is ok, but for someone starting now, with one of the two, M-LOK is a no brainer. It's superior in every respect, and supported by Magpul, who already did a bunch of accessories for it.

Here's what someone from Magpul had to say about the advantages of M-LOK:

Here are a few M-LOK advantages over Keymod off the top of my head

M-LOK works over a wider material thickness range than Keymod.
M-LOK uses a flat nut that is suitable for polymer, metal and carbon fiber mounting surfaces.
M-LOK is a true direct attach system so a line of accessories mounted next to each other do not need to be slid off to remove just one piece.
M-LOK has better recoil/impact support than Keymod.
M-LOK uses a larger bolt and has greater direct surface contact than Keymod resulting is greater pull out strength (a single MLOK mount exceeds 300 lbs in all materials)
M-LOK accessories are multi directional (can be mounted forward or backwards).
M-LOK has a uniform internal edge that can be generously chamfered allowing a better feel on the hand than Keymods 45 degree under cuts.
M-LOK can use any of the millions of MOE accessories already fielded via an adapter plate.
M-LOK slots are much lower cost to manufacture than Keymod resulting in lower cost to consumers.
M-LOK nuts are much lower cost to manufacture than Keymod resulting in lower cost to consumers.
M-LOK bolts are commonly available (user replaceable) and allow more torque to be applied than Keymod.
M-LOK slots requires no special CNC cutters or complex injection molds to manufacture an undercut like Keymod resulting in lower cost to consumers.
:

Here's what someone from Geissele had to say about the two:

As a mfg I can say that M-LOK is way easier to make than a Keymod rail. Way easier. The back chamfer on Keymod sucks time up in the machine, too much to make it worth producing at the same price as our MK2-MK4 rails.

The rails also feel much better in the hand since the M-LOK apertures can easily have a generous chamfer. A chamfer on the Keymod aperture can't really be done very well since the wall is so thin at the edge of the back chamfer. The a bare finger sliding along a row of Keymod apertures feels like a dull cheese grater (my opinion)

The Keymod accessory rail is tall in comparison to the M-LOK accy rail (Geissele OEM are shorter than both).

The M-LOK accessory rail is also easier to make. No special seats for odd ball flat head screws. No staking of the nuts which are not relatively easy to make. No special back chamfer tools that require a specially ground tool or one available from one or two tool suppliers.

The button head cap screw for M-LOK are readily available and the flat head design allows you to get more torque on the screw vs. an angled head screw that acts like a torque limiter.

M-LOK accessory rail has nice shear lugs that extend from one end of the accy rail to the other, not just in one place so rotational force into the accy rail is resisted better.

Detractions to M-LOK: The nuts need "adjusting" to the internal thickness of the rail mounting surface. It only takes a second or two but Keymod can just be cranked down.

You have to be careful after adjusting that you only loosen the screw 1 turn to remove. If you just start unscrewing the nut will rotate out of its cam and you have to turn the screw back and forth a little to get it to line up again.

The M-LOK screws require some kind of prevailing torque as the screw is unloosened to work "well". A screw with a polymer patch works good, or a little bit of purple loctite or even grease. If there was absolutely little friction to the screw/nut the system would still work but it might take a little finagling to get the nut into the unlock position.

Personally, I think rail manufactures will like the ease of making M-LOK rails and this will drive availability.

Some M-lok handguards I like:

No experience with any of them.
Geissele Mk8:

ALG :

New ###y slim rail from Mega Arms and Hodge defense :

 

[mebiuspower]

Actually in the MLOK vs Keymod situation the route Magpul took is the better solution.
M-LOK standard requires license, BUT IT'S FREE.

The license is a requirement, so all vendors respect the specs. There are already plenty problems with keymod, because many vendors just mess up the specs, or like in the case of H&K make their own version.
There's nothing to force them to respect the keymod specs, so all accessories are compatible.

There's no problem if you purchase KM rails & accessories from reputable brands like DD, KAC, HSP, Noveske, BCM, IWC, PWS, etc etc. Geissele did produce non-MLok spec for ALG Defense handguards that caused some confusion before.

If one has a lot invested in keymod accessories, keymod is ok, but for someone starting now, with one of the two, M-LOK is a no brainer. It's superior in every respect, and supported by Magpul, who already did a bunch of accessories for it.

Because MLok is created by Magpul. Of course Magpul supports it and creates accessories for it.

No experience with any of them.

So you have no experience with MLok yet you support it?

 

[Jaws]

So you have no experience with MLok yet you support it?

Yep. For someone like me, and the original poster, who has no accessories for either one, M-LOK looks like the much better solution, and more future proof because of Magpul and the huge MOE market.

And about the early ALG rails. You see, because of the requirement to respect the specs, they can't advertise that first generation rail as M-LOK, and those are already discontinued because of it. They had to make a new one that respects the specs. Had that been done in Keymod, nobody could force them to go back to the drawing board.
I'd say that's a real plus.

 

[mebiuspower]

Something that looks like the much better solution may not be the better solution after all.

Usually MLok supporter just copy & paste Magpul's marketing material like you did.

While there's no comparison test for durability of either systems, Keymod accessories are reverse mountable just like MLok despite their marketing material makes it sounds like only MLok accessories are reverse mountable.

Also, Keymod has direct mount, tool-less accessories like the BCM VG. I'm not aware MLok has any direct mount, tool-less accessories like this. And yes, it is reversible.

And speaking of support, Travis Haley (of Magpul fame), Frank Proctor, Pat Rogers, Pat McNamara, Larry Vickers, Ken Hackathorn etc all support Keymod (and BCM). In fact Travis Haley helped design the BCM KAG which are available in Keymod and Picatinny.

http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/gunfighters/

 

[Evil_Edie]

I think when he said "direct mount" he didn't mean the ability to mount without an additional rail adapter piece, but rather the ability to stick it straight on and lock down. Keymod requires you to stick it thorough the slot, slide it forward a quarter inch or so, then lock. This becomes a disadvantage if the user intends to have two or more items mounted stacked right next to each other, but needs to remove one of them from time to time as now one of the attachments may interfere with the removal/attachment of another.

All things considered, i'm with Jaws. stronger and better or not M-Lok is significantly simpler than Keymod. From a manufacturing stand point M-Lok wins hands down. When it comes to support for the user base, well Magpul has a massive user base and their own product line alone means a lot of newcomers will see M-Lok as the more viable option both in cost and availability of accessories. The real advantage Keymod has is the fact that it came first so there were already a bunch of manufacturers making accessories for it, however M-Lok has already caught up a lot in the short time it has come to market and will likely overtake Keymod very quickly. Both factors together creates a feedback loop where the manufacturing side of things creates incentives for users to choose M-Lok and then users demanding more product from the manufacturers. Within a few years i definitely see M-Lok owning the market.

 

[Fenix.NZ]

for me, its keymod simply for the aesthetic. MLOK looks the way its spelled, simple and tough, but definitely not the girl you wanna dance with.

Plus im only ever going to attach two things to the side of any of my guns

 

[Evil_Edie]

for me, its keymod simply for the aesthetic. MLOK looks the way its spelled, simple and tough, but definitely not the girl you wanna dance with.

Plus im only ever going to attach two things to the side of any of my guns

lol, yeah that is one thing keymod has going for it is it looks much more sophisticated. That said i like the look of simplicity myself. Clean lines and simple hard edges. One of the reasons why i don't dig sports cars and luxury cars. I am the kind of guy that thinks AKs and SKSs are beautiful in their ugliness.

i'll probably only have like two things on my rifles. problem is i'm also cheap so instead of having a set to for each rifle, i want one set i can move across all of them, though at times not the entire set.

 

[mebiuspower]

I think when he said "direct mount" he didn't mean the ability to mount without an additional rail adapter piece, but rather the ability to stick it straight on and lock down. Keymod requires you to stick it thorough the slot, slide it forward a quarter inch or so, then lock. This becomes a disadvantage if the user intends to have two or more items mounted stacked right next to each other, but needs to remove one of them from time to time as now one of the attachments may interfere with the removal/attachment of another.

Please provide a real life scenario of such issue.

For me, I only mount a light, VG or Bipod. I don't stack them right next to each other at any given time.

 

[Fenix.NZ]

Please provide a real life scenario of such issue.

For me, I only mount a light, VG or Bipod. I don't stack them right next to each other at any given time.

yeah the "direct mount" advantage isnt a real advantage, because if you needed back to back rails, you'd just get a longer section, or you'd have a quadrail..
afterall, the reason you buy a keymod or MLOK is to keep your handguard as free of extras as possible.

 

[mebiuspower]

MLok accessories are not very well designed. Just look at the QD mount.