Kicking Myself

Magnum_Tom

Magnum_Tom

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I was at the range a month ago and picked up some really nice and shiny 300 Win Mag brass someone had just left behind. When I got it home I realized it was previously reloaded. The reloader was pretty anal about shining up the brass and using a marker to colour code the bases. This stuff looked brand new though.

Fast forward to tonight. I ran 2 cases through the FL die to size and deprime. They were really stiff! Concerned, I readjusted the FL die but instead of giving the die a 1/4 - 1/2 turn down, I gave it a 1/2 turn up by accident. The next case went in and it's never coming out. Half the base ripped off. I spun the holder and successfully ripped the other half of the base off. No problem, says I, I've heard this happens from time to time so here's my educational experience on case extraction.

I figured a little oil and some light tapping on the decapper pin would get the case out. It didn't. I threw the die in the freezer thinking I'd try some cold then some heat but when I tried again, I just ended up bending the decapper pin.

On the bright side, I got to see just how tough the Lee dies are. It dented the snot out of my vice but not even a scratch on the die.

Is there some trick to this? And if I do get this case out, does anyone sell just the decapper pins?

On the bright side, I got to try out my new RCBS neck sizing die on some other, fire-formed brass. Very nice die but I'd hope so considering the price of these things!
 
There is no trick. You were close with the freezer. I've only had luck once getting a pot of water going, as if you're going to boil eggs, oven mitts and tongs ready. Pack the case with crushed ice and dipped it. The last time it didn't work. Got RCBS 458 dies off another gunnutter here, for ten bucks because a case was stuck. I ended up using a 3/8 - 16 helicoil tap. It measures around .460, has four rows of cutters, and I turned it in 13 turns before I chickened out about scratching into the die. Before that everything had to be unscrewed out of the die and it came to me with the entire bottom of the case ripped off, so it was a good start. Drilled a 3/4 inch hole in a board to set over the vise jaws not to scratch the end of the die and a few hesitant taps with a drift punch got it out. Just lucky that time. Your 300 is the same size case inside. Go for it. Got nothing to lose at this point.
 
For the decapper pin. Send an email to Lee explaining you bent it removing a stuck case. They may want a photo of the pin once you get it out. They will probably send you one free. To remove the case you probably should buy or make a stuck case remover. Drill and tap the base of the case for a 1/4" or 5/16" bolt. Place a socket that fits over the case and rests on the end of the die. Thread a bolt and washer through the socket into the base of the case tighten the bolt and extract the case. You should be able to find a video on line (google is your friend) good luck.
 
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Any reloading store will sell decapping pins.

You can get a stuck case extractor set at your normal reloading store for about $5. Make sure you ask the salesman how to use it or else hunt up a Youtube explanation. 5 minutes' work and you'll have the stuck case out of the die.

I recommend to any new loader that they get both spare pins and an extractor set. It's peanuts in cost and good insurance.

If it's any comfort, 90% of reloaders will admit that this has happened to them and the other 10% are lying. The silver lining in the cloud is that having to go through it once makes you religious about properly lubing your cases before sizing them.
 
But if the base is ripped out, the stuck case remover isn't any help.

Is there still some "meat" around the primer pocket?
 
m777 said:
But if the base is ripped out, the stuck case remover isn't any help.

Is there still some "meat" around the primer pocket?
Click to expand...

Point taken. Normally it's the rim that rips loose as that the weakest part and that's how I read the post.

Magnum_Tom. Pictures would help a lot. Is it just the rim that ripped off or has the whole damned head gone, leaving you with nothing but the case walls wedged inside the die?
 
Yup, we need to know if it`s just the rim where the shell holder ripped loose or did the head separate. Stuck case remover is simple to use, and a handy rig for any reloader to have. I haven`t had a case head seperate but it can happen, not as much fun to remove.
 
Sorry for not getting back to this thread sooner. I had to take my wife car shopping.

It was just the rim that ripped off. There's a bit of head still sticking out and lots of meat. Id take a picture but I've gotta run across town to see if I can get a new pin and a case extractor before Lebarons closes.

BTW, the cases were lubed but let's just say I'm going to be using good lube from now on...
 
Mtom, there is nothing wrong with range brass.

Check it carefully for separation signs and reanneal it. Don't take any chances with it.

Sometimes, it's impossible to tell if its been well used or not.

I picked up 300 Lapua 30-06 brass last spring. It looked like it was once fired.

Nope.

It was hard as all get out.

Only took about an hour to reanneal it and it was all soft like butter.

The previous owner, told me he wouldn't trust any case after 3 reloads. OK by me, just let me know when you're going to throw out the next lot.
 
Back off the decapping stem.
Drill and tap the case, running through the primer pocket.
1/4 -20 is the usual size.
Find a socket that will allow the case to enter, but which will butt up against the die mouth.
Place a washer on the socket, run a bolt through, threading it into the case.
Grab the die in a vise, tighten the bolt with a wrench. It will pull the case out. Cut the head off the case, remover the decapping stem. Pull the remains of the case out.
A commercial decapping set will do the same thing. Improvised set of tools does the same job.
 
I made the mistake of useing grit in my case tumbler once and then trying to resize 375 brass. The first one stuck in the die and being the middle of the night I had to make a case extractor to get it out. Not being real smart instead of retumbling the brass right away I tried with more lube and broke the Lee C press. Ended up buying a new C press and stealing my RCBS press back from my brother. The fellow at P&D in Edmonton never even mentioned to me that Lee would replace the press just sold me another. Never dealt there again.
 
I don't think sizing less (by turning die out) caused your case to stick. Lack of lube was the most likely culprit.

No need to buy the case extractor for Lee dies. I would tap harder on that decapper with a punch. Anyone who sells Lee can get a new rod if it is damaged. Even with other brands I would just use a drill,tap, bolt and washer to pull the case.

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/RM3508.pdf
 
hk33ka1 said:
I don't think sizing less (by turning die out) caused your case to stick. Lack of lube was the most likely culprit.

No need to buy the case extractor for Lee dies. I would tap harder on that decapper with a punch. Anyone who sells Lee can get a new rod if it is damaged. Even with other brands I would just use a drill,tap, bolt and washer to pull the case.

http://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/RM3508.pdf
Click to expand...

Yeah, I've been trying to figure out how that could cause the case to jam.

I'm fairly certain it was a lube issue mixed with very hard / brittle brass. I haven't been having much luck with range brass - they always seem to end up being very hard and brittle. I think I'm going to start automatically annealing brass I find.
 
notsorichguy said:
If your brass was too long, ie already past the trim to length then you resized it I can see that jamming a bit of extra brass in the die.

If you were a bit light on lube as well......

Cheers!
Click to expand...

Quite possibly. I normally trim after I deprime / resize. Its never a problem with my brass. But with range pick-ups, maybe they've been shooting hotter loads than I do and the necks are stretched out more. I'll definitely add that to my list of stuff to check on free range brass.

Thanks,

Tom
 
I only mention it as I have had a problem with brass being too long with range pick up .223.

Any 1xf .223 brass I pick up now gets a quick check before I run it up my SB die.... I have had to trim a few before I put them through the die. Just so I don't have a problem.....

I have had several stuck cases in .223, more than all calibres combined (I reload 25ish different cals). I have drastically reduced stuck cases in .223 by triming the long ones before hand.
 
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tiriaq said:
Back off the decapping stem.
Drill and tap the case, running through the primer pocket.
1/4 -20 is the usual size.
Find a socket that will allow the case to enter, but which will butt up against the die mouth.
Place a washer on the socket, run a bolt through, threading it into the case.
Grab the die in a vise, tighten the bolt with a wrench. It will pull the case out. Cut the head off the case, remover the decapping stem. Pull the remains of the case out.
A commercial decapping set will do the same thing. Improvised set of tools does the same job.
Click to expand...

Exactly!

Well, I didn't have time to make it to the store for a new pin and an extractor but I had time before supper to try out tiriaq's suggestion. If I had known how quick and painless this was last night I never would have reached for the hammer. But then again, I never would have thought a case could be wedged so tightly in the die.

Here's what the ripped off rim looked like:
16bfbae8.jpg

1c0fe614.jpg


I set the die in upside down in a Lock Ring Eliminator Bushing in my Lee press, and locked down the bushing. The press just acted as a holder or "third hand" and wasn't actually used to pull or press anything in this excercise.

Using the flash hole as the pilot hole, I drilled a 13/64" hole through the base. I then tapped it to 1/4" x 20NC.
f770a58b.jpg


The extraction kit: A 1/4" bolt, a washer or 2, and a bushing. A socket works fine for the bushing.
e928b589.jpg


Put the bolt through the washer ( I found 2 washers worked better), then through the bushing or socket, and thread it into the hole in the base of the case I had just tapped. I started out with 9/16" socket and it seemed to be the perfect size but then the 300WM case seemed to catch it as it started coming out. A 15mm socket worked perfectly in this case. You just need to make sure the bushing matches up with the base of the die and doesn't interfere with the case being extracted.

Even though the die was locked down, torquing on the "extractor" bolt was spinning the die in the press. The Lee FL dies have a couple of cuts so that a 3/4" wrench can be used to hold the die when torquing the pin collet down. I used the 3/4" wrench to hold the die in place as I cranked on the 7/16" bolt head. Other dies may not have this feature.
3590097d.jpg


Voila!
72f9720b.jpg

88fb950a.jpg


As you can see, the pin is toast and the inside of the die has some light damage from also trying to punch the mouth of the case out from the top. Some brass punches might have prevented that and they're now on my Princess Auto shopping list.

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the help and advice! Although I may have ruined a die, I learned from my mistakes and re-learned an old trick (tap, bolt and bushing trick) and I got some great info from you guys.

Cheers,

Tom
 
Y'ain't the first, you won't be the first. My grandfather once said that you weren't really a driver until you'd had broken glass all over your lap.

Welcome to the club.
 
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