Lee Dies ! Who likes them and Why and who hates them and Why . RJ
Lee Dies
- Thread starter remington jim
- Start date
Let's start with me being tighter than 2 coats of paint.
223 Rem Pacesetter 3 die set (full length sizer, dead length seating die, and factory crimp die) was a whopping $49 at Bass Pro.
The sizing die doesn't overwork the brass, and the expander/decapper rod is stout enough to drive a stuck case out of the die. Lee suggests doing this if you stick a case, and I've actually done it on one occasion. No problems even after that event.
The seating die has what's essentially a micrometer adjustment for seating depth. No, it doesn't click when you adjust it, but even I can figure out that each full turn of the adjuster moves the bullet 56 thou in the case. 1/4 turn gives you 14 thou, and so on. The seater plug is usable even with VLD and ELD style bullets. I do recommend you chuck the seater plug in a drill and polish the edges of the cone. They're not perfect out of the box. The plug slides in the body to guide the bullet on a straight path into the case mouth.
The factory crimp die just works. You don't need to have every case the same length to get a consistent, adjustable crimp. Great idea.
Add in a free shell holder and powder scoop to put the icing on the cake.
Scrape a little of the icing off because of the non-locking die nuts with the O-rings. The ones on the crimp die and seating die are no problem, since I adjust those each time I use them. I use a dummy round to set the seater, takes 10 seconds to do that.
The only BUT is the lack of a locking ring on the sizing die. Why would you want to adjust that each time? I certainly don't, so I added a 6 dollar Forster split lock ring to the sizing die, and the problem (nuisance really) is gone. Screw the die down til the lock ring touches the press and you're done.
The Lee die set makes some of the straightest ammo I've ever made, bullet runout is excellent to non-existent.
I wish the Forster FL sizing die I paid over $70 for as a single item worked as well as the Lee.
I call the Lee set good value, even if it cost twice as much. You get more than you pay for.
223 Rem Pacesetter 3 die set (full length sizer, dead length seating die, and factory crimp die) was a whopping $49 at Bass Pro.
The sizing die doesn't overwork the brass, and the expander/decapper rod is stout enough to drive a stuck case out of the die. Lee suggests doing this if you stick a case, and I've actually done it on one occasion. No problems even after that event.
The seating die has what's essentially a micrometer adjustment for seating depth. No, it doesn't click when you adjust it, but even I can figure out that each full turn of the adjuster moves the bullet 56 thou in the case. 1/4 turn gives you 14 thou, and so on. The seater plug is usable even with VLD and ELD style bullets. I do recommend you chuck the seater plug in a drill and polish the edges of the cone. They're not perfect out of the box. The plug slides in the body to guide the bullet on a straight path into the case mouth.
The factory crimp die just works. You don't need to have every case the same length to get a consistent, adjustable crimp. Great idea.
Add in a free shell holder and powder scoop to put the icing on the cake.
Scrape a little of the icing off because of the non-locking die nuts with the O-rings. The ones on the crimp die and seating die are no problem, since I adjust those each time I use them. I use a dummy round to set the seater, takes 10 seconds to do that.
The only BUT is the lack of a locking ring on the sizing die. Why would you want to adjust that each time? I certainly don't, so I added a 6 dollar Forster split lock ring to the sizing die, and the problem (nuisance really) is gone. Screw the die down til the lock ring touches the press and you're done.
The Lee die set makes some of the straightest ammo I've ever made, bullet runout is excellent to non-existent.
I wish the Forster FL sizing die I paid over $70 for as a single item worked as well as the Lee.
I call the Lee set good value, even if it cost twice as much. You get more than you pay for.
I like the Lee Ultimate 4 pcs die set, bullet seater, size die, collet die and crimp die included.
The dies build accurate ammo as run out is ~0.001" or less, which compares closely to a Forester seat die which gives consistant <0.001".
The collet die makes this set worth it, throw your 'bushing' dies away, this makes bullet release consistant, deprimes, and leaves a straight neck and no lube needed. I use the collet die in conjunction with a Redding body die. To that end I had Lee make a collet die in 6 Dasher, expensive but worth it.
The factory crimp die can lower your extreme spread (ES) up to ~25% in my testing with smaller cartridges like the 223 Rem.
Some folks have issue with their lock collars with the 'O' ring on the bottom, as they are not 'locked' in place. I use the Redding competition shell holder set, increments of 0.002" from 0.000" to 0.010", this allows a slight 'cam over' on the bottom of the die, aids consistancy.
If nothing else 'Lee' the collet die and crimp die are the two that gives the edge over the others as they are designed to work together,
Lee Dippers are employed to get close to powder weight desired then dumped in the pan on an FX 120 electronic scale.
The dies build accurate ammo as run out is ~0.001" or less, which compares closely to a Forester seat die which gives consistant <0.001".
The collet die makes this set worth it, throw your 'bushing' dies away, this makes bullet release consistant, deprimes, and leaves a straight neck and no lube needed. I use the collet die in conjunction with a Redding body die. To that end I had Lee make a collet die in 6 Dasher, expensive but worth it.
The factory crimp die can lower your extreme spread (ES) up to ~25% in my testing with smaller cartridges like the 223 Rem.
Some folks have issue with their lock collars with the 'O' ring on the bottom, as they are not 'locked' in place. I use the Redding competition shell holder set, increments of 0.002" from 0.000" to 0.010", this allows a slight 'cam over' on the bottom of the die, aids consistancy.
If nothing else 'Lee' the collet die and crimp die are the two that gives the edge over the others as they are designed to work together,
Lee Dippers are employed to get close to powder weight desired then dumped in the pan on an FX 120 electronic scale.
- Location
- WMU247 near Edmonton
I use all sorts of different dies and have no real preference,
however the Lee Factory Crimp gets 2 thumbs up.
I must have at least 40 sets of dies and about 1/3 are Lee
however the Lee Factory Crimp gets 2 thumbs up.
I must have at least 40 sets of dies and about 1/3 are Lee
Yes, I am a Lee dies fan too. I own more expensive dies from other brands, but I do not see better performance over my Lee dies, and I no longer see the advantage of bushing dies for the neck, which I will explain below:
Collet die:
For neck sizing, the Lee Collet die requires no lube of the case, no tedious clean-up of lube, and is so fast and easy. I use two strokes of the press, turning the case slightly for the second press. To finish the sizing I always use an additional step with an expander die mandrel (Sinclair or 21st Century) to the precise neck diameter ("tension") desired.
In other words, even when I use other brand's more expensive bushing dies and fiddle with bushings and lube, I am always finalizing neck tension with the expander dies anyways, making the bushing sizing process obsolete if I had simply used the collet die in the first place.
My current target rifle is chambered in 6.5x47L which Lee does not make a stock Collet die for, so I am in the process of sending in an order to Lee for a custom die for it.
Seater die:
For the seater die, as mentioned above you can make marker increments around the top of the die, (halves, quarters, eighths, sixteenths) and line across the top of the seater dial for the pointer, to quickly estimate close to desired seating, and then turn just slightly to find exact seating by testing with your calipers and comparator. With a micrometer seating die you still need to use calipers and comparator to approach, then find the desired seating precision. On my Lee seaters, the 16 increments marked each represent roughly 0.005".
Are expensive micrometer seater dies "better"? Yes IMO for finding the the exact seating depth a little faster. When doing seating depth tests in a big batch of reloads (e.g. 0.003" increments), definitely the micrometer seaters are faster. I own several micrometer seaters (Forster, Whidden) and really like them. But I can get by easily with the marker increments method for the Lee seater. For my calibers that are not precision target calibers, (which I am constantly experimenting with seating depth and various bullets), I can get by quite well with the Lee seating die.
Lock rings:
I actually prefer the lee hand-tightened lock rings with the O-ring on the bottom (old style hex nut style, NOT the new knurled ones), on all dies except for the full length sizing die. The FL sizing die has to be perfectly exact and locked with another brand's lock ring with a set or clamp screw.
But my Lee press uses the quick change "Breech Lock Bushings", and these BLB's stay on each die. Therefore the hand tightened rubber O-ring lock ring stays tight against the bushing and maintains a die length close enough for the seater, collet, and crimp die. No fiddling with an allen key and set screw. The Lee seater dial is custom adjusted every time anyway, checking bullet seating depth with calipers and comparator, so it does not need a set/clamp screw locked die ring IMO.
But if you don't use the BLB's, or want a hard lock, then as others have mentioned, other brand's set/clamp screw style lock rings work just fine on Lee dies.
New Die Cleaning:
My only criticism of new in box Lee dies is that they come new loaded with metal fragments inside, left over from manufacturing. You need to take the dies apart and wash them to flush away the metal fragments. I use dish soap and water and a toothbrush, rinse, then douse with pure isopropyl alcohol (99%) to get the water off, let it flash dry, then spray with oil, wipe down, and finish with a spray of Ballistol. Takes not too long at all. But in the washing make sure you do it in a separate tub nowhere near the sink drain! You don't want a small part going down the drain!
Collet die:
For neck sizing, the Lee Collet die requires no lube of the case, no tedious clean-up of lube, and is so fast and easy. I use two strokes of the press, turning the case slightly for the second press. To finish the sizing I always use an additional step with an expander die mandrel (Sinclair or 21st Century) to the precise neck diameter ("tension") desired.
In other words, even when I use other brand's more expensive bushing dies and fiddle with bushings and lube, I am always finalizing neck tension with the expander dies anyways, making the bushing sizing process obsolete if I had simply used the collet die in the first place.
My current target rifle is chambered in 6.5x47L which Lee does not make a stock Collet die for, so I am in the process of sending in an order to Lee for a custom die for it.
Seater die:
For the seater die, as mentioned above you can make marker increments around the top of the die, (halves, quarters, eighths, sixteenths) and line across the top of the seater dial for the pointer, to quickly estimate close to desired seating, and then turn just slightly to find exact seating by testing with your calipers and comparator. With a micrometer seating die you still need to use calipers and comparator to approach, then find the desired seating precision. On my Lee seaters, the 16 increments marked each represent roughly 0.005".
Are expensive micrometer seater dies "better"? Yes IMO for finding the the exact seating depth a little faster. When doing seating depth tests in a big batch of reloads (e.g. 0.003" increments), definitely the micrometer seaters are faster. I own several micrometer seaters (Forster, Whidden) and really like them. But I can get by easily with the marker increments method for the Lee seater. For my calibers that are not precision target calibers, (which I am constantly experimenting with seating depth and various bullets), I can get by quite well with the Lee seating die.
Lock rings:
I actually prefer the lee hand-tightened lock rings with the O-ring on the bottom (old style hex nut style, NOT the new knurled ones), on all dies except for the full length sizing die. The FL sizing die has to be perfectly exact and locked with another brand's lock ring with a set or clamp screw.
But my Lee press uses the quick change "Breech Lock Bushings", and these BLB's stay on each die. Therefore the hand tightened rubber O-ring lock ring stays tight against the bushing and maintains a die length close enough for the seater, collet, and crimp die. No fiddling with an allen key and set screw. The Lee seater dial is custom adjusted every time anyway, checking bullet seating depth with calipers and comparator, so it does not need a set/clamp screw locked die ring IMO.
But if you don't use the BLB's, or want a hard lock, then as others have mentioned, other brand's set/clamp screw style lock rings work just fine on Lee dies.
New Die Cleaning:
My only criticism of new in box Lee dies is that they come new loaded with metal fragments inside, left over from manufacturing. You need to take the dies apart and wash them to flush away the metal fragments. I use dish soap and water and a toothbrush, rinse, then douse with pure isopropyl alcohol (99%) to get the water off, let it flash dry, then spray with oil, wipe down, and finish with a spray of Ballistol. Takes not too long at all. But in the washing make sure you do it in a separate tub nowhere near the sink drain! You don't want a small part going down the drain!
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- Location
- Newfoundland
Honestly it’s a price thing for me, I don’t care about 0.5 moa at 1000 yards or any of that I just find it easier to get reloading components out here than live ammo and I need to be able to get close to cheap factory ammo performance, Lee gives me that, even better sometimes, I’ve noticed it with my endfield revolver I’m getting better accuracy from my reloads than I was with older factory ammo I had, next thing for me is a Lee progressive press
hunters home
CGN Regular
I have several sets of Lee dies and they work as good or better than some others at 1/2 the price. The Collet die as mentioned by BCBrad is great and their dead length bullet seater IMO is better than any other seater die that comes in a standard die set. In fact I often use it in my PPC rather than my Forster Ultra. Only problem that I find with Lee is they try, at times, to improve stuff and screw it up. The Collet die being one. JMO
BattleRife
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- of No Fixed Address
While I load my highest volume handgun cartridges on a progressive press, I load for several lesser volume guns on Lee 3-station turret. Having the powder-through-expanding die is invaluable in these cases, and I load for a few calibers where I have Hornady or RCBS dies, but ran out and got a Lee powder-through-expander for the middle station, and let the other brand expander collect dust.
Generally I like Lee, and use several sets of them. Downsides to Lee, they are short in body, which can be a problem with presses that use QD bushings, like the Hornady AP. And they are not high alloy or plated, so they are prone to rust in humid environments.
Generally I like Lee, and use several sets of them. Downsides to Lee, they are short in body, which can be a problem with presses that use QD bushings, like the Hornady AP. And they are not high alloy or plated, so they are prone to rust in humid environments.
- Location
- Nova Scotia
I have Lee, RCBS and Pacific.
Some of the RCBS die sets, I replaced the seater die with LEEs.
Some of the RCBS die sets, I replaced the seater die with LEEs.
I don't know if it's still common practice but Lee used to make most of the dies used by commercial loaders in North America.
I have a couple of Lee die sets as well as a few of their universal decapping and seating dies and all work well enough that I can't find anything wrong with them.
I have a couple of Lee die sets as well as a few of their universal decapping and seating dies and all work well enough that I can't find anything wrong with them.
Own many sets, no issues - dan
My first handgun die sets were Lee and 37 years later I am still using them ... along with the 3-hole turret press.
The Lee die I prob use the most is the universal decapper. Can't tell you how many cases have been run through that die but it is hundreds of thousands.
There are nicer rifle dies with more features than the Lee. I don't use any Lee rifle dies except for one collet neck sizer in 303 British.
As noted by others, the Lee crimp dies are excellent.
The Lee die I prob use the most is the universal decapper. Can't tell you how many cases have been run through that die but it is hundreds of thousands.
There are nicer rifle dies with more features than the Lee. I don't use any Lee rifle dies except for one collet neck sizer in 303 British.
As noted by others, the Lee crimp dies are excellent.
I like lee dies and prefer them over the others. I like the bullet seater die as its basically a micrometer type and sets easy unlike the rcbs type with the locking nut
The factory crimp die is awesome too
However I think the case mouth expander on the rcbs dies is better then the lee one, but with the lee you can use your funnel and charge the case with powder so it's a toss up
I have two lee presses (loadmaster and classic turret) and they have been good as well
The factory crimp die is awesome too
However I think the case mouth expander on the rcbs dies is better then the lee one, but with the lee you can use your funnel and charge the case with powder so it's a toss up
I have two lee presses (loadmaster and classic turret) and they have been good as well
Lee is bomb and cheap and effective. Their humble origin story of an inventor making attainable, serviceable products for the everyman is pleasant.
Especially how cheap their carbide pistol dies are... I don't understand paying 3 or 4 times the price for dies from other companies.
Especially how cheap their carbide pistol dies are... I don't understand paying 3 or 4 times the price for dies from other companies.
My first dies were Lee 30-06, and at the time, only. Through my fault, I screwed up decapping/expanding stem. While I waited on the mail, I needed to reload, so a bought a new RCBS FL resizer. When I wanted a dummy round, I had been in the habit of just grabbing a fired case and running through the die relying on the left over lube in the die. It worked with the Lee, but the case stuck in the RCBS . The Lee die had a better interior finish.
At the price we pay for dies, if you think the threaded stems have precision threads, you're dreaming. So a collet makes sense. I have been saying that a collet centers much better by design than a small threaded stem. I have been saying that on the 'net long before Lee picked that up,BTW. Here is the but , the Lee collet has only two fingers to clamp, not near enough for truly effective clamping. Their 11 degree angle is good, unlike Hornady's 45 when they tried using a collet. Hornady's collet is now just a thread lock.
Here is that "but" and my story of grief . I bought some used Weatherby 338-06 brass and went to resize. The collet slipped, so I really tightened it to the point of stripping it and leaving the threads in the die body.(the two fingers) Since my first misadventure with the 30-06, I try to keep a spare set of dies. Used ones at gunshows are a good source. I had already bought a new second Lee 338-06 set as it's an uncommon size. And gave up on the Weatherby brass. When I went to put the parts I received( customer service wasn't as nice this time and it took some talking to get the thread pitch for chasing) back together, I noticed the die was a 338-06 ACK, ackley improved ! The case wasn't supported causing the stem to bend , that was what I was trying to overcome by tightening.
My second set is a new RCBS, off an American Ebay seller, at $190 CND. compare that to Higginson's price of Lee dies.
I will mix and match components of dies now.
The best means of checking how straight the case is resized is a dial indicator. They should be under a thou.
At the price we pay for dies, if you think the threaded stems have precision threads, you're dreaming. So a collet makes sense. I have been saying that a collet centers much better by design than a small threaded stem. I have been saying that on the 'net long before Lee picked that up,BTW. Here is the but , the Lee collet has only two fingers to clamp, not near enough for truly effective clamping. Their 11 degree angle is good, unlike Hornady's 45 when they tried using a collet. Hornady's collet is now just a thread lock.
Here is that "but" and my story of grief . I bought some used Weatherby 338-06 brass and went to resize. The collet slipped, so I really tightened it to the point of stripping it and leaving the threads in the die body.(the two fingers) Since my first misadventure with the 30-06, I try to keep a spare set of dies. Used ones at gunshows are a good source. I had already bought a new second Lee 338-06 set as it's an uncommon size. And gave up on the Weatherby brass. When I went to put the parts I received( customer service wasn't as nice this time and it took some talking to get the thread pitch for chasing) back together, I noticed the die was a 338-06 ACK, ackley improved ! The case wasn't supported causing the stem to bend , that was what I was trying to overcome by tightening.
My second set is a new RCBS, off an American Ebay seller, at $190 CND. compare that to Higginson's price of Lee dies.
I will mix and match components of dies now.
The best means of checking how straight the case is resized is a dial indicator. They should be under a thou.
