Lee hangfire question

Somerset Bar

Somerset Bar

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So had my first ever bona fide hangfire today, on my No4 mk1.

It was about 5-10 seconds after I pulled the trigger, and I was staring at it because it went "click" which it shouldn't have if I had forgotten to chamber another round. Anyway, it went off full power and was most unpleasant :)

The full power discharge makes me think the powder was okay, so I'm down to 3 possibilities:
1) primer (winchester large rifle)
2) firing pin (have never taken pin out because it needs a tool if I recall correctly)
3) safety was not 100% disengaged and hung it up a bit.


Any ideas with the info given? This old girl is one of my most favourite shooters. She is kept very clean except for the bolt (I'm just now looking for a tool to disassemble it). Thanks guys.
 
No real need to remove the firing pin. Get a can of degreaser remove the bolt head and lay waste to whatever gunk is inside the bolt body.

I would lean towards the primer being faulty.
 
Since you are using WLR primers I assume you are reloading. A defective primer is possible in a single case. If you have multiple incidents using different primer lots then perhaps there is something more. Military primers are much harder than commercial versions and the firing strike is more energetic from a military rifle.
In my case (Mosin) I had multiple hang fires and 2 squibs using CCI LR 200 primers. When I de-primed I found that the anvils were loose. The force of the firing pin had dislodged them and driven them into the flash hole. I switch to WMLR primers and have had no issues.
Try this link for useful information http://ingunowners.com/forums/ammunition-reloading/174704-choosing-right-primer.html
 
Somerset Bar

I take all my Enfield bolts apart for cleaning and inspection when I get them, "BUT" there is a chance by removing the firing pin it will become a loose fit in the cocking piece. If the firing pin was a loose fit the armourers would peen a few threads to make it a tighter fit in the cocking piece.

You can boil the bolt to clean out any dried oil or cosmoline and re-oil or use any type cleaning solvents and let the bolt soak and just work the cocking piece back and forth and re oil.

Bottom line, I have spare parts and take my bolts apart, if you do not have spare parts your safer using the above methods.
 
Thanks for the tips guys.

They are reloads, winchester large rifle primers, PPU cases. Projectiles and powder are reclaimed from 7.62x54r corrosive rounds (I couldn't find .311 projectiles anywhere and I had already been cannibalizing 7.62x39 corrosive rounds with much success).

I do everything in batches of 200 and mark them (in case I have problems like this), this was round ~180 of this batch. The only loads I have ever run through this rifle have been 37grains of Varget or 38 grains of the ruskie surplus.

I would guess that I am probably 1000 rounds of reloads through this gun, and 60 rounds of federal. Never once has given me as much as a hiccup. She was "old faithful" until today, so I want to get to the bottom of it...although I am right now wondering if my wife would notice me boiling gun parts.... :)
 
marc_j said:
Since you are using WLR primers I assume you are reloading. A defective primer is possible in a single case. If you have multiple incidents using different primer lots then perhaps there is something more. Military primers are much harder than commercial versions and the firing strike is more energetic from a military rifle.
In my case (Mosin) I had multiple hang fires and 2 squibs using CCI LR 200 primers. When I de-primed I found that the anvils were loose. The force of the firing pin had dislodged them and driven them into the flash hole. I switch to WMLR primers and have had no issues.
Try this link for useful information http://ingunowners.com/forums/ammunition-reloading/174704-choosing-right-primer.html
Click to expand...

bookmarked, good read...
 
If it has only happened once, not a big issue, other than you got a valuable lesson to do a 15 second count before loosening up on the rifle or worse yet, opening the bolt. I have had some hang fires with poorly stored surplus ammo but with reloads, it's either a complete dud or something faulty with the bolt or its components.

I have had broken springs giving light strikes and pitted firing pin faces. In the case of a P14 the firing pin looked like it had been washed away with a torch. The first shot with it was a hang fire.

My guess is a faulty primer. Problem with hand loading is that there are so many variables and all it takes is a bit of something to change the parameters.

One fellow I used to know insisted he had to waterproof his primers by smearing a light coating of nail polish around the inside edges of the primer pocket. He used to have several hangfires but nearly as many as he should have had.
 
Can also occur from a primer not being fully seated and pre-pressurized. Firing-pin then seats the primer and tries to set it off, but too much energy has been expended in seating the primer, so you get a light strike.

Primers should be seated to very slightly BELOW flush.
 
I'm looking into a primer pocket swager as indeed some of the pockets on "new" brass can definitely be a bit of a fight to seat a primer.

I honestly have always thought a true hang fire was sort of like the boogey man, I've had a few over the years on rimfire, but nothing ever like this, I am quiet glad I stared at it for a bit instead of opening the bolt, I am just dismayed that I had it angled up over the berm when it went off. A very good reminder about waiting out a "click" and definitely controlling muzzle direction in such cases. I don't think I'll ever forget it (I can remember hang fires from .22's from 30 years ago, so likely this will stay with me too).
 
If you had opened the bolt the magazine would have been blown out of the rifle, the bullet would be lodged in the bore and the front part of the case would have been sucked into a black hole. The shooter of this round was not injured in any way other than the brown stains in his underwear. The rifle was repaired but, the fore stock in the rear was shattered from the expansion of the magazine, the trigger guard was ruined and the magazine was half buried in the ground.

headspace-1_zps97d95b60.jpg
 
The army had/has various immediate action drills (IAs) for weapons malfunctions, but for civvy shooters who experience a hangfire or suspected hangfire the best approach is to keep the muzzle downrange and slowly count to 10 before opening the bolt to investigate further.
 
Somerset Bar said:
I'm looking into a primer pocket swager as indeed some of the pockets on "new" brass can definitely be a bit of a fight to seat a primer.

I honestly have always thought a true hang fire was sort of like the boogey man, I've had a few over the years on rimfire, but nothing ever like this, I am quiet glad I stared at it for a bit instead of opening the bolt, I am just dismayed that I had it angled up over the berm when it went off. A very good reminder about waiting out a "click" and definitely controlling muzzle direction in such cases. I don't think I'll ever forget it (I can remember hang fires from .22's from 30 years ago, so likely this will stay with me too).
Click to expand...

Try using a case chamfering tool (normally used after cutting cases to length) to cut the pocket burr. I use a chamfer tool to allow reloading of crimped primer military brass (0.223) - works well and costs nothing extra
 
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