Legalities of bringing components back to Canada from U.S.
- Thread starter supahdave
- Start date
Outlawpilots
CGN Regular
- Location
- Niagara, ON
I'm guessing that's going to require an export permit, which generally speaking isn't worth getting for the casual firearms owner.
If you can get it to the border you can bring it in within the CBSA limits, 8lbs. for powder, etc. However, if US authorities catch you, you're doing prison time as it is illegal for an alien to transport firearms, powder, and ammo within the US without the proper paper work. Check with the ATF about transport forms and CBSA about import quantities.
To legally export components out of the USA, you need to obtain an export permit, and you have to be a licensed exporter to get a permit. Homeland Security sets up checkstops to search people leaving the USA with ammunition, components, or other controlled goods.
Then even if you make it through the good ol’ USA to the Cdn gate there is still the remote chance of the individual attitude of the officer at the window. They have a turnaround back to US customs for use at their discretion. I’m thinking not all cbsa agents are Conservatives.
Where can we go to read the sections of law/regulations that say CBSA can deny a Canadian citizen entry into Canada and compel them to leave Canada to return to the USA?
Which they have just left, as that Canadian citizen is now standing on Canadian soil while talking to that CBSA officer?
rommelrommel
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Yeah, that’s not a thing. If you’re a citizen/PR/status Indian you have the right of entry.
Actually it is. I got refused entry into Canada from the USA once. We had done nothing wrong except to disagree with an authoritarian CBSA agent. His boss admitted we had done nothing wrong and still sent us back to the USA. That resulted in a fairly interesting conversation with the US guy. We drove down to the next crossing and entered there.
rommelrommel
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
He had zero authority to do that, if it's in recent history you should sue them for a gross violation of your rights.
It was the Port Commander who sent us back.
I got a pretty memorable and funny story out of it and in the end no harm, no pack drill.
About four years ago I was coming up to the Pembina/Emerson Mb port. A car had passed me a couple of miles back and was parked in a booth, I did my usual clearance and was just pulling out when 4 US CBP came running up to the car at the Cdn booth . Two had carbines and the other one had hands on their holsters. I didn’t stick around to see if the driver pleaded his sovereignty on not but I’m pretty sure he was making a short trip south again.
And it had Mb plates.
And it had Mb plates.
I wasn't satisfied with the information here so I dug myself. Obviously not legal advice, mileage may vary with individual circumstances.
You can subvert issues with ATF so long as you entered for sporting or hunting purposes, have a state or Indian Band hunting license, or are government employeee ect. You can also purchase with that too. (Is u enter USA w/ Form 6 details blah blah blah, enter and leave US with ammo on your form, u can buy more but can export with your imported cash.)
Almost anyone internationally can apply for an export permit with the U.S. Bureau Industry and security.
There are some obligations to keep records and report qualities twice a year... whatever, easy.
I submitted an application that is pending for exports of ECCN A0505 ammunition and reloading components. But I suspect I won't even need one as the "end user" with my limited purchasing power. but I want one for purchasing and possession. They advise getting a license and or permit ahead of time.
However, the export License exception value is $3000 per export (for A0505 ammunition and reloading components) repeatable up to 12 times one year. More than my budget, and the CDN import limit is 5000 pieces before needed to deal with department of natural resources for an explosives permit.
So this has been an intriguing case of how things we all want are gatekept with bad or dated information, or buried under pages of multi-departmental legal documents, or under myth and legend.
Also any muzzle loading components and parts are now EAR99 including percussion caps. Meaning you can export no problem. Which seem pretty available stateside. Rustywood trading told me they hadn't seen CCI #10 caps in 6 years. I think I scooped the last 400 in the country locally but many available in US. Especially useful for anyone who bout BP C&B pistols in the handgun run.
You can subvert issues with ATF so long as you entered for sporting or hunting purposes, have a state or Indian Band hunting license, or are government employeee ect. You can also purchase with that too. (Is u enter USA w/ Form 6 details blah blah blah, enter and leave US with ammo on your form, u can buy more but can export with your imported cash.)
Almost anyone internationally can apply for an export permit with the U.S. Bureau Industry and security.
There are some obligations to keep records and report qualities twice a year... whatever, easy.
I submitted an application that is pending for exports of ECCN A0505 ammunition and reloading components. But I suspect I won't even need one as the "end user" with my limited purchasing power. but I want one for purchasing and possession. They advise getting a license and or permit ahead of time.
However, the export License exception value is $3000 per export (for A0505 ammunition and reloading components) repeatable up to 12 times one year. More than my budget, and the CDN import limit is 5000 pieces before needed to deal with department of natural resources for an explosives permit.
So this has been an intriguing case of how things we all want are gatekept with bad or dated information, or buried under pages of multi-departmental legal documents, or under myth and legend.
Also any muzzle loading components and parts are now EAR99 including percussion caps. Meaning you can export no problem. Which seem pretty available stateside. Rustywood trading told me they hadn't seen CCI #10 caps in 6 years. I think I scooped the last 400 in the country locally but many available in US. Especially useful for anyone who bout BP C&B pistols in the handgun run.
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It has happened to me as well.
"It's my decision", she said. "There is no appeal." Even while I was still there, sitting on the ground (per the CBSA officer's order), I was thinking "I'm going to have to submit a complaint." So later, at home, I did.
The first response from the Minister was business-like. It told me that they'd conducted an investigation, that I'd been in violation of the law, that the officer had been correct, that the officer's conduct had been appropriate. I wrote back, with many verifiable details, asking that they re-investigate.
It took a long time, but the second letter from the Minister had a very different tone, compared to the first. It apologized. It told me that they'd re-investigated, and that it had included the video and audio recording of our interaction. It informed me that my account (of what happened) was consistent with the evidence, the officer's account was inconsistent with the evidence, that the officer had been informed of their findings, and that a memo had been generated, CBSA-wide, to educate their staff.
The next time I was through, and I recognized the officer in the booth, I was thinking "Okay... here we go.." but nothing happened. If she remembered anything, she didn't let it show.
This guy gives you an example that shows that they can refuse entry..
Many believe that a Canadian citizen can’t be refused entry but that’s not 100% correct as you pointed out. My friend was importing a car and wouldn’t listen to us about getting a US clearance from the border control first and he was denied entry into Canada and turned around to go back. There’s more that a few reasons for a denied entry…
You need to be a bit careful there with terminology, mfgrs require an export license to start with, retailers also require one, then there are now LVS shipments exemptions which are at either a 500 or 3000.00 level, above that level requires an export permit, for which you need an export license to be able apply for, then it has to be exported via a licenced FFL broker or the mfgr/retailer has to have an in-house one as I understand it tricky to determine if firearms and ammo components fall under the same requirement there. They apparently did not change the requirement for an exporter under the ITAR regs for an exporter wanting a permit, to be a US citizen, aliens cannot apply for an export permit, no go on that still, in what I am seeing.
Stiill haven't deciphered exactly what the difference is in 0A0505 on the 500-3000.00 split, other than it exists, have to go back and read 0A018b, if it is still available to see, not sure about the "except" in there. There are also some tricks to the evaluation of what is contained in the LVS and how to come up with the amount allowed being in compliance or not, with the "limit", because you can apparently have a total invoice value, that is more than the "limit", it may be due to individual line item pricing totals? But, you are not allowed to split shipments to achieve values within the limit., that may be pertaining to just one line item, I think, need an interpretation on that one and the definition they are using for the LVS value.
It's confusing, it is supposed to be.
Stiill haven't deciphered exactly what the difference is in 0A0505 on the 500-3000.00 split, other than it exists, have to go back and read 0A018b, if it is still available to see, not sure about the "except" in there. There are also some tricks to the evaluation of what is contained in the LVS and how to come up with the amount allowed being in compliance or not, with the "limit", because you can apparently have a total invoice value, that is more than the "limit", it may be due to individual line item pricing totals? But, you are not allowed to split shipments to achieve values within the limit., that may be pertaining to just one line item, I think, need an interpretation on that one and the definition they are using for the LVS value.
It's confusing, it is supposed to be.
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https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/csj-sjc/rfc-dlc/ccrf-ccdl/check/art6.html
This is in our charter of rights and freedoms.
Just because some border guard and/or his supervisor tells you something doesn’t make it right or legal. Many people aren’t very good at their job or know it well.
When a citizen has his or her feet on our soil you cannot be simply told to leave and you cannot be denied repatriation. You may be detained and not free, under our laws, but you simply can’t be told to leave.
rommelrommel
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
The car was refused there, not the person.
It’s 100% a grievous charter violation to be refused entry to Canada as a Canadian. What do you think is going to happen if you refuse? Get picked up and tossed across?
