Thanks for the info guys. I often wonder about this also and the explanations are varied.
Using your above analogy fiddler, does a bull/heavy barrel or stainless make that much of a difference in burning out?
life span of barrels
- Thread starter mike Crawford
- Start date
Thanks for the info guys. I often wonder about this also and the explanations are varied.
Using your above analogy fiddler, does a bull/heavy barrel or stainless make that much of a difference in burning out?
machine guns can eat up barrels too. Lots of machine guns shoot pistol calibers too which are much lower velocity.
eaglesnester
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Depends on how and when you clean your firearms. If U clean after shooting even if U shoot only 1 round and use a proper bore cleaner and copper, brass remover your firearm should last for thousands of rounds. Dont clean and u will be buying new barrels long before u should. I have over 1000 rounds through my Norinco ChiCom M305 and there has been no accuracy degradation. There are many articles on the net that covers this very subject. Also as a previous poster said, bullet velocity has much to do with barrel life. The big over bored magnums with have a shorter barrel life than a 30/06
- Location
- West Quebec
That makes a lot of sense to me low velocity low power ammo should result in little wear.
Ranger Dave
Regular
I shot 6000 rounds through a Winchester M70 Ranger in 30-06. The throat was very worn. I had to seat bullets so far forward but accuracy was still decent for a hunting rifle. It was constantly a 0.75 MOA rifle from new to 2500 rounds. After that it slowly opened up. At the end it was a good 2+ MOA rifle. It shot mostly 56.0gr IMR-4350 and 180gr Hornady's.
hometownhero
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Toon Town, Sk
Touch it and you will find out. Depends on the load. If its +30 outside and you are shooting in the direct sun its always going to be warm.
I have a lot of experience in wearing out 308 barrels. I used to replace about one a year.
A Blue (chrome moly) barrel wears differently than a stainless barrel. A blue barrel wears slowly in the throat. You can watch the rifling get shallower and the throat moves forward. At 2000 rounds there is a quarter inch of freebore that was not there to begin with. If you can seat the bullets longer, there is not much change in the barrel. A target shooter would have to change the barrel at round 2500 rounds because the group would be slightly bigger, and he needs the best he can get. If the barrel has a section of straight shank, he can shorten the barrel 2 inches, cut new threads and chamber, and have an almost new barrel, good for another 2000 rounds.
In a chrome moly hunting rifle, the practical life is in the order of 5,000 rounds and I expect few 308 hunting rifles get anywhere near that many.
Stainless barrels also wear in the throat and first few inches of the barrel, but the wear pattern is very different. The barrel will go about 5,000 rounds with no appreciable change in accuracy. That is, it lasts twice as long as a blue barrel.
And if you look at the throat, the rifling does not appear to erode away like it does in a blue barrel. This gives the impression it is not wearing out. With a borescope you can see little cracks forming. It looks like the cracks you see in drying mud. As it wears, the cracks become more numerous, more close together, and deeper. But the accuracy is not affected. Until one day a piece of metal between adjacent cracks flakes off. Then, with that shot, the accuracy goes in the crapper. That happens between 6,000 and 9,000 rounds.
Once again, if the barrel has a straight shank, at 5000 rounds you can move the chamber forward 3" and have an almost new barrel.
An over-bore caliber, like 26-06 would wear the same way, but faster.
In the 308 case family, a 243 would wear faster and a 358 would last longer.
I once built a 22-250 Ackley for sniper shoots. I burned through 4 stainless barrels before I finally realized the barrel life was about 1000 rounds, max.
A Blue (chrome moly) barrel wears differently than a stainless barrel. A blue barrel wears slowly in the throat. You can watch the rifling get shallower and the throat moves forward. At 2000 rounds there is a quarter inch of freebore that was not there to begin with. If you can seat the bullets longer, there is not much change in the barrel. A target shooter would have to change the barrel at round 2500 rounds because the group would be slightly bigger, and he needs the best he can get. If the barrel has a section of straight shank, he can shorten the barrel 2 inches, cut new threads and chamber, and have an almost new barrel, good for another 2000 rounds.
In a chrome moly hunting rifle, the practical life is in the order of 5,000 rounds and I expect few 308 hunting rifles get anywhere near that many.
Stainless barrels also wear in the throat and first few inches of the barrel, but the wear pattern is very different. The barrel will go about 5,000 rounds with no appreciable change in accuracy. That is, it lasts twice as long as a blue barrel.
And if you look at the throat, the rifling does not appear to erode away like it does in a blue barrel. This gives the impression it is not wearing out. With a borescope you can see little cracks forming. It looks like the cracks you see in drying mud. As it wears, the cracks become more numerous, more close together, and deeper. But the accuracy is not affected. Until one day a piece of metal between adjacent cracks flakes off. Then, with that shot, the accuracy goes in the crapper. That happens between 6,000 and 9,000 rounds.
Once again, if the barrel has a straight shank, at 5000 rounds you can move the chamber forward 3" and have an almost new barrel.
An over-bore caliber, like 26-06 would wear the same way, but faster.
In the 308 case family, a 243 would wear faster and a 358 would last longer.
I once built a 22-250 Ackley for sniper shoots. I burned through 4 stainless barrels before I finally realized the barrel life was about 1000 rounds, max.
The longest-used barrel I ever had was a Husqvarna 270. It was their entry level 22" Husky model, and I used it for hunting woodchucks in Ontario more than anything else. It had over 4000 handloads with 62 gr of surplus H4831 down the factory tube, when I traded it to a guy up here for a brand new vacuum cleaner, of all things. 
That rifle and would still put a magazine full into less than 5" at 300 meters, and as far as I know the guy is still hunting with it.
Also had a 270 Wby that drove 130 gr Partitions at 3500 fps, and 150 gr A-frames at 3200 for many years. When I sold it top a fellow up here a few years ago, it had fired over 700 rounds, and would still shoot very close to an inch at 100 yd.
Ted
That rifle and would still put a magazine full into less than 5" at 300 meters, and as far as I know the guy is still hunting with it.
Also had a 270 Wby that drove 130 gr Partitions at 3500 fps, and 150 gr A-frames at 3200 for many years. When I sold it top a fellow up here a few years ago, it had fired over 700 rounds, and would still shoot very close to an inch at 100 yd.
Ted
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
My M70 300WM probably only made it 1500 rounds before the barrel was done. Barely got a serviceable load worked up (it took a lot of fooling around to get there) and the accuracy started to drop off. Was never shot fast or allowed to get hot but c'ést last vie. The. Old Man burned the barrel out of a 270 WBY many moons ago. Harry Selby's 416 Rigby was so badly shot out the bullets were tumbling like a bugger. It happens. Some guns, especially the mind mannered, ones will go on seemingly forever.
I've read reports of match grade 5R barrels maintaining 1 MOA for 10,000 rds of .308. If I'm correct this was something the US Army had done to prove the effectiveness of their 5R barrels in the M24. Seems possible, as one pistol manufacturer has stated their pistols have a service life of 10 years or 20,000 rds. This is why I carry a SIG P226 for a duty pistol!
Cracking in the throat is how stainless barrels wear. Read and learn something. Or buy a borescope and see for yourself.
Here is a picture of what stainless throat wear looks like. I described it as looking like dried mud:
http://2.bp.########.com/_7jT01FlNt...k/s1600-h/###Corlane-throat-pictures-00x4.jpg
Ganderite....I agree with your description of how various steels react to the ravages of hot burning gases and powder grains.
SS does show a difference in the way it erodes, compared to C-Moly.
I do own a borescope, and have looked inside many a barrel, both fairly fresh, and well-worn.
My personal experience with C-M vs SS as to barrel life has been different than yours, however.
I have not seen a great difference in the accuracy life of a SS barrel and a Chrome-Moly one.
I had a C-M 220 Swift barrel that maintained stellar accuracy for some 2500 rounds.
Also had a 6.5x55 SS barrel that was pooched by right around 2000 rounds. By all factors, the latter should have outlived the former by a noticeable margin.
This same 6.5x55 is now on it's 3rd barrel, and is about 450 rounds in so far.
When I was shooting the 6mm Remington in competition, I tried both SS and CM.
The SS usually outlived the CM by about 4-500 rounds, but certainly not double the life.
Our shooting situation may have been considerably different, and I cannot speak for the 308,
since I have never been enough of a fan to own one long enough to toast a barrel in one.
Don't want you to think I am challenging your experience here, just giving a glimpse of my own experience.
Regards, Dave.
Eagle - Most of my experience with barrels is 308 target rifles. The barrels get replaced when the accuracy drops off. I have no doubt most hunting rifles in 308 would go another 1000 rounds at least.
I could not believe my 22-250 Ackley was pooched in 1000 rounds, so I re-barreled it. Same thing. Same thing 2 more times. 4 McLennan stainless barrels shot out in 1000 rounds. This was a case full of powder behind a 80 gr Sierra at 3400 fps.
I have only worn out one 6.5-55. It was a heavy Shilen stainless used as my first F class rifle. It lasted 5,000 rounds. Bullets were almost all moly coated.
Our differences in experience may be based on differences in when we decide the barrel is toasted.
I could not believe my 22-250 Ackley was pooched in 1000 rounds, so I re-barreled it. Same thing. Same thing 2 more times. 4 McLennan stainless barrels shot out in 1000 rounds. This was a case full of powder behind a 80 gr Sierra at 3400 fps.
I have only worn out one 6.5-55. It was a heavy Shilen stainless used as my first F class rifle. It lasted 5,000 rounds. Bullets were almost all moly coated.
Our differences in experience may be based on differences in when we decide the barrel is toasted.
I'm thinking it will not extend barrel life at all!! Dave.
