light weight big caliber bolt

[Brutus]

H+H brass makes perfect 350RM brass as well, no special dies just once through the FL sizer and trim, did several when I was bored one evening just to see how it would work. Come to think I might have gone through the 358 norma first trimmed and then down to the Rem. Turned out perfect. You can also use any of the 2.5" belted discards.

I gather you don't think too highly of the 350 RM, Brutus, I didn't either for a long time until I actually used it and I have gotten 5 feet of penetration on a black bear shot point blank using 225 accubonds with the tip cut off flush at the jacket. I have now killed 6 blackies with it and all but one rib shot were literal bang flop kills. I would have no qualms taking a grizzly with it, front on, broadside or quartering either way. It kills all out of porportion to it's diminutive appearance.
This is one cartridge that has truly impressed me, that I used to scoff at.

I offered my opinion as a better option for self-defence only as the OP's stated purpose in his first post.
If you feel the 350 is the bee's knees for black bear hunting, then more power to you.
Don't take my opinion as some kind of personal attack on Your Majesty. It is not and was never meant to be.

take a pill buddy

 

[AG]

I offered my opinion as a better option for self-defence only as the OP's stated purpose in his first post.
If you feel the 350 is the bee's knees for black bear hunting, then more power to you.
Don't take my opinion as some kind of personal attack on Your Majesty. It is not and was never meant to be.

take a pill buddy

wow, unless you two have been exchanging nasty pm's behind the scenes I think it's you that need to take the pill
c-fbmi hasn't been out of line in this thread by my take. I can't see why or where you would come out taking a poke at him like that

 

[c-fbmi]

I offered my opinion as a better option for self-defence only as the OP's stated purpose in his first post.
If you feel the 350 is the bee's knees for black bear hunting, then more power to you.
Don't take my opinion as some kind of personal attack on Your Majesty. It is not and was never meant to be.

take a pill buddy

Whoa, no personal attack perceived, I was just relating my own personal experience with the 350. Not attacking your opinion at all, just highlighting the 350RM. May I suggest it's you who needs the pill, nothing argumentative in my post at all.

 

[whitetailwoodsarcher]

ruger 77/44

 

[caramel]

ruger 77/44

Light and with 270 gr Speer, very lethal... JP.

[/IMG]

 

[remington jim]

Bolt Action Bear Defence rifle

In a dire situation and time for only one shot in self-defence, maybe the larger bullet could make a difference.

Whatever, to each his own..............

I love the 350 rem mag cartridge - but as only a short range bear defence only cartridge - I would want something more powerful ! and throwin a bigger chunk of Lead too ! But that jmho !~ RJ bcheers:

 

[Big Jon]

I can't understand what is wrong with the 45-70? No way a bolt can be faster over that? An 870 Norinco 12 guage with 14" barrel will save you weight and still diliver the power and speed.

Personally, I can get a bolt into action and cycle it faster than the handful of lever guns I've owned/shot. If I used levers alot than that would likely be different...I find them almost awkward though. My giant paws not fitting inside the dang lever overly well doesn't help either.

 

[c-fbmi]

I love the 350 rem mag cartridge - but as only a short range bear defence only cartridge - I would want something more powerful ! and throwin a bigger chunk of Lead too ! But that jmho !~ RJ bcheers:

No denying bigger is better when defence is only pupose, how much more though in a 6 lb carbine is actually controllable and would get shot enough to gain profiency, would be my concern. The 350 loaded to max is already a handful.
I have always liked the thought of a .458 2" though. A good friend and gunsmith killed the project years ago when I was going to build one on a short Ruger action I had, by saying "good luck" getting it to feed anything close to reliable. Apparently he had played with a couple years earlier and encountered this problem, I've since, also read of similar situations with this cartridge.

 

[gunrunner8]

No denying bigger is better when defence is only pupose, how much more though in a 6 lb carbine is actually controllable and would get shot enough to gain profiency, would be my concern. The 350 loaded to max is already a handful.
I have always liked the thought of a .458 2" though. A good friend and gunsmith killed the project years ago when I was going to build one on a short Ruger action I had, by saying "good luck" getting it to feed anything close to reliable. Apparently he had played with a couple years earlier and encountered this problem, I've since, also read of similar situations with this cartridge.

That's very true, short and fat cartridges don't feed as slick as thin and long ones. With reliability in mind forget the all the AI as well. In tight corners the 458WM will do you no good either if you have to slap the trigger in anticipation of heavy recoil and shot recovery in dumpster after the muzzle points straight in to the sky! 35 Whelen, 9,3x62 or better jet 375 Whelen with heavy for caliber premium bullets (b/c penetration matters a lot) in lightweight, slick Mauser action is the ticket for heavy bush hunting either for big critters or small.

 

[toebako]

I agree with the 9.3x62 etc as fast easy backup. I dont agree with the barrel of a 458 pointing up at the sky. As fast as one can work a bolt after the shot you would be back on target. Being able to shoot whatever the choice is more important than caliber.

 

[whitetailwoodsarcher]

Light and with 270 gr Speer, very lethal... JP.

[/IMG]

yup, i have barnes solid copper hp loads for mine and they are crazy powerful! never tried the speer.

 

[caramel]

The Speer 270 is very accurate in my first 77-44, i cant speak for the second one , did not shoot i yet but here is a target of a good group, they run a tad over 1900 fps with 25 gr of Littl'e Gun... JP.

[/IMG]

 

[Boomer]

That's very true, short and fat cartridges don't feed as slick as thin and long ones. With reliability in mind forget the all the AI as well. In tight corners the 458WM will do you no good either if you have to slap the trigger in anticipation of heavy recoil and shot recovery in dumpster after the muzzle points straight in to the sky! 35 Whelen, 9,3x62 or better jet 375 Whelen with heavy for caliber premium bullets (b/c penetration matters a lot) in lightweight, slick Mauser action is the ticket for heavy bush hunting either for big critters or small.

Sorry, but I disagree with your assessment of the .458, although if one is chosen for defensive purposes you had better shoot it enough so as not be intimidated by the recoil. The .458 Winchester has made a pretty good name for itself in bear country from Alaska to Hudson Bay.

In the willows the .458 is very comforting

Now that I have lots of components I don't carry anemic factory ammo any more, but it does make an interesting size comparison doesn't it. The other track to the left is from my 90 pound Shep.

 

[RememberTheSomme]

Trying to stay in your 6 lb weight range and speak with authority on large bear is a challenge indeed.


Older Model 70 lightweight carbine in .30-06 with 20" bbl and rifle sights, or the Ruger 77 RLS at 18.5" and rifle sights as well.

These were made in the 1980's @ 6lbs or less and with 5 rounds in the mag, plus one up the spout, this rifle will handle your defense requirement.
Hey if you don't want to wait for the in your face encounter, and like a little standoff capability, give it to him at 100yds, a 180grain XP3 will penetrate and disrupt the bears day at this range with authority. You still have 5 more to go.

Don't worry about the push feed versus CRF bulls**t,...... while he's shuddering from the first 180- 220grainer premium bullet that just connected,.. just calmly chamber a second and standby should he request more.

 

[toebako]

So far we have less than a handfull of candidates. What action is light and easy to build on? I hate to say it but Savage comes to mind. A short action in 450 Marlin with a light stock and slim barrel. Sturdy open sights.
I went this way to keep cost low. I guess a Husky in 9.3x57 with the barrel bobbed to 18" would be light and handy too. I am interested in this now.

 

[Atlas308]

If it doesn't have to be a bolt, I would go with a marlin guide gun (pre-Remington of course) or a browning BLR...it's a lever but locks up almost likes bolt. You get faster repeat shots, if necessary, you get the lightweight (6lbs), and shorter barrel.

 

[1899]

B&M Rifles and Cartridges has a very neat setup. You need a M70 chambered in a WSM cartridge as a donor. The B&M cartridges are based on shortened RUM cases and are available in 9.3mm, .375", .416", .458", .475" and .500" versions.

The .458 can launch a 450gr bullet at +2200fps out of an 18" barrel. That compares very well to a .458 Win Mag. You can also launch a 500gr bullet at over 2100fps out of an 18" barrel.

The .416 will hit 2400fps with a 350gr bullet out of the same length barrel.

These rifles have an OAL of 38" and weigh 6.5lbs with a Winchester Ultimate stock.

http:// www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/

 

[D-Man]

I'm not a bear hunter but I have several large calibre rifles, one of which may be of interest. It is a Rem M660 re-barrelled to .416x2". With scope it weighs about 7-1/2lb with a 23" #5 contour barrel, but if you are intent on making it lighter you could shorten the barrel and go with a lighter contour. 46gr. IMR3031 behind 400gr Hornady RN gives approx. 1750fps.

 

[remington jim]

416 - 2" rem m600

I'm not a bear hunter but I have several large calibre rifles, one of which may be of interest. It is a Rem M660 re-barrelled to .416x2". With scope it weighs about 7-1/2lb with a 23" #5 contour barrel, but if you are intent on making it lighter you could shorten the barrel and go with a lighter contour. 46gr. IMR3031 behind 400gr Hornady RN gives approx. 1750fps.

Well i am a bear hunter and i think this Beauty rifle should be tested out this spring ! Watch ya think now Mike ?

Cheers RJ

 

[remington jim]

lw big cal

Model: 116 Alaskan Brush Hunter, a little over on the weight (advertised 7.6lbs) but 18" barrel chambered for 338 win mag or 375 ruger in stainless/synthetic.

I think after looking over all the factory rifles you are correct- this is the one - i would get it in 375 Ruger and shoot 300 Swift Aframe Bullets out of it ! Very bad news for even the biggest of bears ! JMHO of course !

Cheers RJ