Loading for a 357 Carbine

Ganderite

Ganderite

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I recently bought a 20" Rossi 357 M carbine. It works well, but the open sights don't suit my old eyes. I replaced the rear sight with a peep and now have a fairly accurate sight picture.

In theory, any good handgun ammo will work in the carbine. In practice, shooting the carbine at 50 yards seems to show up ammo problems that I don't see at handgun distances.

I did a survey (4 different powder charges) with Win 572 and 2400 using CamPro 159 RNFP bullets. 572 is a new powder. I would call it a slower 231 or a faster HS6.

With both powders I saw vertical 4" groups at 50 yards.
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This got me to thinking about ignition.

8 gr of 572 in a 357 case leaves a lot of airspace. 14gr of 2400 almost fills the case, but it is a sow powder, so the little pistol rimer might be inadequate. I have a quantity of Remington 6 1/2 small rifle primers on hand, so decided to try those. Small Rifle and Small Pistol are the same size, and I had no doubt the Rossi hammer had the energy to fire the rifle primer.

For the test I loaded 5 rounds of each load with the Ginex small pistol primer and the Rem small rifle primer.

I tested 8 gr of 572, 12gr of 2400 and 14 gr of 2400

8 gr of 572

SP 1403 fps ES 157 SD 69 (ES = Extreme spread)

SR 1397 fps ES 46 SD 18 (Conclusion - similar velocity, but much more consistent)


12gr 2400

SP 1426 fps ES 343 SD 127

SR 1427 fps ES 74 SD 26


14 2400

SP 1606 fps ES 133 SD 43

SR 1595 fps ES 35 SD 13

I like the big improvement in ES, but the results are still not very good. I have just bought 500 pieces of new brass and will see if a more consistent crimp will help.

I assume a Small Pistol Magnum primer would have produced a similar improvement. All that airspace, plus a ball powder does not help ignition.
 
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G_Alan said:
Ganderite How did the 572 group in 357? I've thought about trying it, but I bought it for my 20ga and didn't get around to trying it
Interesting on the SD and ES numbers
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The 572 looked like a very good plinker velocity powder. 8 gr is lots of velocity (1400 fps) and it looked like it wanted to group. In two days I will try the 572 with the rifle primes and see how it groups.
 
VICIOUS said:
HI; I use the CamPro 158 RNFP, but stay with fast powder like Titegroup for Marlin Microgrove. At 50 yards no stringing.
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The TG would be a good plinker velocity powder. But I am looking for more velocity than TG would produce because I hope to use it in 100 matches where I have to shoot from the standing position.
 
Big bore dinosaur said:
How do the primers sit in the pocket?
A little proud ,, would be my concern
Plinkin single feeding ammo would be an exception
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SP and SR primers have the same dimensions, so SR primers shouldn't sit proud.

I didn't have satisfactory experience with Ginex primers, by chance I came across abunch of CCI, Winchester and Federal primers.

Also was gifted 7 lbs of 2400, and will try it in the 357.
 
H110 benefits greatly from the extra barrel. I would get a little over 2200fps with 125XTPs and something like 1800 with 158s. That was from a 16'' gun too. I used a lot of Longshot which is considered very close to HS-7 and got good velocity with smaller charges. I can't recall the specifics though.
 
I have Longshot, HS7, AA9, H110, 296,Blue Dot and some others. When I get around to loading some jacketed bullets (I have some XTP's) I will try those slow powders.

But right now I have a bucket of CamPro plated bullets, so can't do Mach 2. I have 8 pounds of 2400, so that seemed to be the powder to use. I just got an 8 pounder of the 572 and was looking to try it on something. No loading data for it.

The Ginex primers may be at fault. I have 5000 Rem 6 1/2s, so this might be the perfect application. They are intended for mild rifle calibers.
 
Campro 158 did just fine for me over max charges of H110, and went just as fast as the true jacketed speer and XTP JHPs I buy. I rarely do formal group testing but the 8" gong at 150 was easy enough. I have thousands left I am still shooting through my revolvers since I sold the rifle.
 
B said:
Campro 158 did just fine for me over max charges of H110, and went just as fast as the true jacketed speer and XTP JHPs I buy. I rarely do formal group testing but the 8" gong at 150 was easy enough. I have thousands left I am still shooting through my revolvers since I sold the rifle.
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Thanks. Good to know. I will try some H110 or 296
 
What do your fired cases look like? Mine would come out quite swollen. Supposedly due to a tampered chamber but when I looked online st seemed like some people had blown brass while others didn't. Many who had the issue claimed to have factory warranty work done to fix it. I never could pin down whether it was actually normal or not.
 
I've loaded 17gr of H110/W296 with the exact same CamPro 158gr bullet with SRP and they performed well for me in my Henry levers (albeit a little sooty/dirty but that's H110/W296 for ya). I guess the worry is ripping off the "jacket" at high(er) velocities? You'll know if that's happening because they'll start to tumble and you'll see keyholes at the target.
 
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I have also had ignition issues with primers over the years. I'm a firm believer in SPM or SR with slower powders in 38 Special +P+ or 357 Mag for my lever rifles. I like LPM with 44 Mag and 45 Colt +P for my rifles.

While I was pleased that stores stocked Ginex primers during the shortages, I have had issues with SP in my 38 Special revolvers (hard primers) and LR with ball powder. I bought a lot of BLC2 when it was on sale and issues with Ginex LR in 303 British, 7.62x45, and 7.62x39.

I have not had any problems with Ginex SP with my 9mm loads (handguns and rifles) or Ginex SR in my 223, even with BLC2 powder. Ginex LR appears to work (for me) with IMR and Alliant powders.

YMMV
 
My CAS load in my Rossi 92: 30grains of Trail Boss behind a 140 grain TCFP Missouri all lead, Ginex small pistol primers, 38spl brass.
No problem and cheap.
 
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