loadmaster issue

[acrashb]

If you place no value on your time or safety or where you place in a match then fiddle with your lee junk to your hearts' content.

Sandroad is right.

The only thing valid here is time - the LM takes relatively longer to produce ammo because of fiddling and the "lee rythm". This is a dollar / time tradeoff.

Safety? The quoted incident was using primers - Federal - that Lee specifically and loudly says "don't use". It was also on a Pro 1000. On the LM, using a $5.00 blast shield protects the user in the extraordinarily-unlikely event that there is a gang-fire.

Placement in a match? I won many speed shoots using Lee-produced ammo. I wouldn't load benchrest ammo with Lee equipment, but Mysticplayer has done very well in F-Class with Lee dies. And not everyone needs benchrest-quality ammo. For speed shooting, hunting, and plinking (and F-Class ! ) Lee works fine.

 

[easyrider604]

I stand by my statement, throw it in the trash and buy a Dillon. You will never regret buying quality.

Anything I have bought from lee in the last 55 years has been JUNK! From moulds to dies all are a pos.

There was a post with pics last year of someone who had the entire primer system of his lm blow up shredding his face with plastic schrapnel. Luckily he was wearing glasses or he would now be BLIND! Cheap, dangerous junk!

Any lee junk I am given goes to Goodwill or in the trash.

If you place no value on your time or safety or where you place in a match then fiddle with your lee junk to your hearts' content.

Sorry to hear your misfortune with all Lee Products, I find it hard to believe your claim that all Lee Products are junk, but everyone is entitled to his opinion.

First of all, if a person does not possess the common sense, patience or intelligence required to read and comprehend instructions (I mean that with all respect, no insult intended here...just laying it down straight...not everyone was born equally in the brain department), or are simply not willing to read instructions and/or too stubborn to heed warnings or take the time to google, he should stay away from Lee Products.

That gentleman in the Lee 1000 primer kaboom incident admitted he did not follow the manufacturer's Federal primer warning. http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=523075&highlight=primer+explosion
While he thought the machine was partly at fault (it wasn't...the manufacturer specifically cautioned against the use of Federal primers), he was not bashing the Lee 1000 at all. I can respect a man like that. He made a mistake and admitted it. That is a gentleman deserving of respect.

I have cast/lubed and sized many, many thousands of bullets using Lee molds, sizers and LLA, loaded them with my Classic Cast, Classic Turret and Loadmaster. Ammo made with my Lee equipment shoot well enough that I have no regrets selling all my Dillon 550Bs, (I had three at one time) the last of which was sold two years ago. Lee works for my needs now as I shoot much less than 20 years ago (500-700 rounds three times a week at the time), and as stated the first paragraph, Lee is not for everyone.

 

[ted_dent]

set up loadmaster again today. indexing seems rough, sometimes will not index without presure on the ram.
primer seater is kinda off center to me.

tried a few rounds, 2/5 had no primer in....

how do I fix that piece of crap? throw away and buy dillon?

If you decide to throw it away please throw it my way. I have two LMs (one for large primer rounds & one for small primer rounds) and they work well. The key is to keep them CLEANED and LUBED. The primer feed chute accumulates residue so every 500-1000 rounds I take it apart & clean it. It's only a five minute job but makes a world of difference in the primer feed efficiency and virtually eliminates flipped primers. I just wipe the channel in the chute with a q-tip. Stay away from solvents like brake cleaner as they may attack the plastic. I consider the primer sliders a throw away part and replace them periodically as part of regular maintenance.

Make sure you lube EVERY contact point including the grease fittings, the round indexing lugs on the bottom of the shell plate and the indexing key where it contacts the lugs. Remember that all presses accumulate residue (powder, dirt & dust, etc.) so keeping the machine clean is a MUST.

As others have noted there are some really good instructional videos online and the manual is basically crap so check out the videos. I found a few features on the videos (like a ball bearing oil lube fitting for the ram) that weren't even mentioned in the manual.

Is the LM as good as a Dillon? In honesty I would have to say probably no but with a little patience and experience (the LM does have a learning curve) and using good maintenance techniques they do nearly as good a job for FAR less money and replacement parts are cheap.

Don't give up on it because once you have it running smoothly you will be happy with it.

 

[Bearcat]

Anytime a user posts a question asking for advice about a LEE product, the ANTI LEE people should just not bother reading the post or IF they do read and DO NOT bother posting your drivel about toss it in the garbage and what junk it is !!! It is nuthin but a waste of time wading thru your #### !!!

 

[Opcx6]

Anytime a user posts a question asking for advice about a LEE product, the ANTI LEE people should just not bother reading the post or IF they do read and DO NOT bother posting your drivel about toss it in the garbage and what junk it is !!! It is nuthin but a waste of time wading thru your s**t !!!

I'm so happy you enjoy it!

 

[Opcx6]

Sorry to hear your misfortune with all Lee Products, I find it hard to believe your claim that all Lee Products are junk, but everyone is entitled to his opinion.

First of all, if a person does not possess the common sense, patience or intelligence required to read and comprehend instructions (I mean that with all respect, no insult intended here...just laying it down straight...not everyone was born equally in the brain department), or are simply not willing to read instructions and/or too stubborn to heed warnings or take the time to google, he should stay away from Lee Products.

That gentleman in the Lee 1000 primer kaboom incident admitted he did not follow the manufacturer's Federal primer warning. http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=523075&highlight=primer+explosion
While he thought the machine was partly at fault (it wasn't...the manufacturer specifically cautioned against the use of Federal primers), he was not bashing the Lee 1000 at all. I can respect a man like that. He made a mistake and admitted it. That is a gentleman deserving of respect.

I have cast/lubed and sized many, many thousands of bullets using Lee molds, sizers and LLA, loaded them with my Classic Cast, Classic Turret and Loadmaster. Ammo made with my Lee equipment shoot well enough that I have no regrets selling all my Dillon 550Bs, (I had three at one time) the last of which was sold two years ago. Lee works for my needs now as I shoot much less than 20 years ago (500-700 rounds three times a week at the time), and as stated the first paragraph, Lee is not for everyone.

Oh nooooo.......those deadly dangerous Federal primers again! No wonder the lee junk blew up in his face, everyone knows Federal primers are prone to spontaneous detonation. Aren't they???
The only primers I use are Federal; they work just fine in my 550B and 1050 Dillon.
I don't hate lee junk, I like equipment that works and doesn't blow up. I like bullet moulds that I don't have to j@rk-off to produce decent bullets. I like dies that don't strip their threads the FIRST time the decapping pin nut is backed out (undersize .38 super sizer, $28 +shipping POS!)). I like loading machines that have a no-bull#### lifetime warranty and parts are FREE, including shipping. That ain't lee!
I have never had a lee junk loading machine, the experience with the bullet moulds was warning enough. The powder measure is activated by a lamp pull chain??? Really?? Matel would have done better.
I didn't have time for that, I needed ammunition (.45 acp then) so I could learn to shoot (1983). My first three years in IPSC I was shooting 40,000+ rounds a year. (Loaded on a Dillon RL-450 with Federal primers! Egads! It didn't blow up!).
The Colt 1911 pistol (and any semi-auto pistol) will only work with perfect ammunition. We learned this very fast in the early days of IPSC. If your gun doesn't work in a match, whatever the reason, you're not gonna like the results. No alibis! NOBODY won with lee! I wonder why? Neither did they win with the Ransom or CH straight-line loaders (never heard of them?) Because they weren't reliable, too many (one is too many) sqibs. One of our early shooters was famous for blowing up two Browning High Power 9mm barrels from sqibs from a Ransom loader.
In the early '90s my loading bench was quite impressive, if I do say so myself; three Dillon RL-1050s, two Dillon 550Bs, two Dillon Square Deals, one Lyman Comet C press (my first press, still have it, hasn't blown up with Federal primers yet), Lyman All American turret press, and a Lyman Spartan C press. ALL worked with FEDERAL PRIMERS, each was dedicated to a caliber. That's right, seven Dillons.
The first RL-1050 paid for the other two from custom reloading (one customer ), the first 550B was updated from the original 450, all the rest were PRIZES, none of which would have happened if my ammo wasn't perfect, just bragging a bit, but true.
That's why I throw lee junk in the trash, it doesn't work for me. I am obviously too dumb to understand the instructions to make it work for me, just a simple truck driver.
Have fun with your lee-junk and be careful of those dangerous Federal primers, be sure to wear a face shield and ear plugs!

 

[SandRoad]

And over the years I recall a couple people have posted on here chain fires in Dillon primer tubes, using Federal primers too. So I guess because someone posted that, it would make Dillon equipment junk too because it tried to kill them. Your own words, not mine.

Since you believe that you could only produce "perfect" ammunition on ### equipment, and destroy equipment the first time you use it, you apparently lack basic mechanical skills.

Still comes down to you have NOTHING constructive to add to this thread.

A LoadMaster is priced at less than $250 in the US, including dies. It is a progressive press, with a basic case feeder that works. Sure it takes more mechanical aptitude than you have, to tweek it, but there are no problems once it is running. I can vouch that it doesn't take much to get and keep one running.

How much Dillon equipment do you get for $230? With dies and a case feeder?

BTW, you do drive a Toyota Landcruiser or Mercedes G wagon, don't you? Everything else is just junk, you should just have it towed to the scrapyard and save yourself the hassles.

 

[Colin]

Dillion is very good stuff, but it comes at a significant price. I doubt any of the manufacturers would be able to make a better press at the same price point. My main issue with the LM is the method of adjusting primer depth, it needs to be improved so you can return the setting to the same place when changing shell plates.

As for Federal primers Lee is very clear that they are not to be used in the LM or any of their presses that use a auto feed. They don't say they are bad, just incompatible. You will also notice that federal uses a significantly large package to ship their primers in. They don't do that for no reason.

 

[Opcx6]

And over the years I recall a couple people have posted on here chain fires in Dillon primer tubes, using Federal primers too. So I guess because someone posted that, it would make Dillon equipment junk too because it tried to kill them. Your own words, not mine.

Since you believe that you could only produce "perfect" ammunition on ### equipment, and destroy equipment the first time you use it, you apparently lack basic mechanical skills.

Still comes down to you have NOTHING constructive to add to this thread.

I find it fascinating the lengths defenders of lee junk will go to justify their choice of equipment when someone states an opinion based on experience contrary to their beliefs, including vitriol and personal denigration.

The Dillon primer magazine explosion you refer to was mine, with the same RL-1050 I now load on. It didn't try to kill me it saved my eyesight! The primer feed had been crushing a few primers which I ignored wanting to finish a batch of .45 acp match ammo for the Provincials the next week-end. The crushed primers left priming compound powder around the primer shuttle bar and the track in which it travels. My face, without eye protection, was inches away from the machine when the magazine tube of about 80 large pistol primers (Winchester IIRC) detonated. It was VERY LOUD! So loud that I went into shock and briefly lost consciousness (my wife was there to help). A tiny piece of anvil/primer cup? caught the corner of my right eye. Very slight cut. Was I stupid to continue loading when there was a problem crushing primers? Yes, absolutely. Was I stupid for not wearing eye protection? Yes, absolutely. The point of all this is that the only thing destroyed was the aluminum inner primer magazine tube, the steel outer shield contained the explosion completely. The rest of the machine was not damaged. I was not damaged. I keep the destroyed inner magazine tube taped to the case feed upright as a reminder not to ignore warning signs. A blast of compressed air would have prevented the incident in the first place. Live and learn. What great equipment Dillon makes!

The lee junk press that exploded was destroyed.

I went on to win the Ontario Provincials that year. Oh yeah, and five more out of the ten years I was in competition. 1985 to 88, '91 and '92. In baseball that is batting 600. Not bad for someone who is mechanically inept.

 

[SandRoad]

I find it fascinating the lengths defenders of lee junk will go to justify their choice of equipment when someone states an opinion based on experience contrary to their beliefs, including vitriol and personal denigration.

No, not at all. It is in response to people who have NEVER owned or used the piece of equipment in question, and arbitrairly claiming it is junk.

Defending Lee equipment? Nope, just balancing out sweeping, dismissive statements.

I have a LM, but also a full Hornady setup. Each has its place. Instead of denegrating a person for their choice without adding one single constructive comment about the equipment they have, why not help them get the most out their equipment.

And how does boasting about 30 year old accomplishments help?

 

[easyrider604]

I went on to win the Ontario Provincials that year. Oh yeah, and five more out of the ten years I was in competition. 1985 to 88, '91 and '92. In baseball that is batting 600. Not bad for someone who is mechanically inept.

Well, I can respect your shooting skills.

But shooting champ or not, you really gotta admit to your lack of mechanical skills. If thousands of us can make the Loadmaster work well, albeit with some tweaking, why suggest the OP to junk it just because you can't? Richard Lee has made a fortune building and selling reasonably priced reloading equipment. He has helped many more shooters enjoy reloading and shooting because of it. Not all of us are made of money, and some of us are just frugal and do not see the value in Dillon equipment vs Lee equipment...but that is the beauty of living in this free country. We all have a choice.

Like I said in a previous post, all men were not born equal.

Sure you may be a great shooter, but mechanically, you ain't got it, brother. Just face it, or just do not post in these Lee threads. Your silly and bigoted remarks that are a total waste of bandwidth will elicit strong responses.

A man's got to know his limits and you gotta see yours...you shoot good but you cannot get Lee stuff to work for you. We may not shoot as good as you, but we can get our Lee stuff to work great. So that evens things out, doesn't it?

I don't care if you have been IPSC world champion every year for the last 50 years. That is not what this thread is about.

Why not stick to the issue in this thread. The OP needed help with his LM is all.

 

[tjhaile]

too many choices with dillon..... i feel like i would get a poor mans dillon and I hate that
i want auto indexing, auto case feeder, 9mm and 223...

The 650 is the one you want if you want a case feeder.

I wouldn't say that there is a "poor man's Dillon," just different presses for different requirements. A 650 with casefeeder is faster than a 550, but the 550 is a bit more flexible in terms of ease and cost of calibre conversions.

As far as cost goes, the difference in price between a Dillon and Lee press is trivial compared with component costs in the long run. I think the up front cost difference for something you should only have to buy once is well worth it in terms of saving on fiddling with a Lee press over the years. I have been reloading with my Dillon 550 for just over four years and it has paid for itself many times over.

 

[Opcx6]

Well, I can respect your shooting skills.

But shooting champ or not, you really gotta admit to your lack of mechanical skills. If thousands of us can make the Loadmaster work well, albeit with some tweaking, why suggest the OP to junk it just because you can't? Richard Lee has made a fortune building and selling reasonably priced reloading equipment. He has helped many more shooters enjoy reloading and shooting because of it. Not all of us are made of money, and some of us are just frugal and do not see the value in Dillon equipment vs Lee equipment...but that is the beauty of living in this free country. We all have a choice.

Like I said in a previous post, all men were not born equal.

Sure you may be a great shooter, but mechanically, you ain't got it, brother. Just face it, or just do not post in these Lee threads. Your silly and bigoted remarks that are a total waste of bandwidth will elicit strong responses.

A man's got to know his limits and you gotta see yours...you shoot good but you cannot get Lee stuff to work for you. We may not shoot as good as you, but we can get our Lee stuff to work great. So that evens things out, doesn't it?

I don't care if you have been IPSC world champion every year for the last 50 years. That is not what this thread is about.

Why not stick to the issue in this thread. The OP needed help with his LM is all.

I am meerly stating my opinion. These threads are full of people complaining about lee junk they have bought and how to get it working. My solution is throw it in the trash and buy something that works. I value my time too much to waste it trying to fix cheap shyt.

You are equally as bigotted towards Dillon, admit it.

Richard Lee has indeed made himself a fortune, selling cheap junk to shooters for many years. Many people are attracted solely by the price of a thing then are bitterly disappointed it doesn't work as well as advertised. They are Richard Lees' lawful prey. These forums are full of them.

I mention some of my accomplishments in response to the accusation I am mechanically inept; that may be so in comparison to you and other lee junk users who must certainly be gifted in order to derive any satisfaction from them. I refuse, I don't have the time, I'd much rather be done with loading and get to the shooting.

Perhaps shooting matches of any type should have a category or division recognizing high shooter using lee equipment? I'm sure Richard would be proud. But, maybe not, as I believe they would all cluster around the bottom.
See the perfection.

 

[SandRoad]

Funny that for 20 years Dillon was paying Richard Lee for rights to have a powder through expander die. It was Lee's patent. A huge number of reloading equipment developments were pioneered by Richard Lee....

As for quality, none of the people dismissing Lee equipment ever commented on how Mysticplayer was able to assemble ammo to shoot one hole groups at 300 yards. And he even used bottom line Lee equipment, not the Clasic Cast press.

Would you care to comment?

 

[Freedom Ventures]

FWIW, I'm very mechanically inclined, but I got tired of having to use that inclination with my Loadmaster....

I had a LM - one of the first - upgraded from the pro 1000 to it - loaded somewhere in the 100K round range on it. Replaced every part with the exception of the frame - some multiple times. I could tell you in a split second what that strange feeling in the lever was and very quickly adjust the press to fix it.

Then a buddy told me about a good deal on a big Dillon. Got it; started using it and after a couple thousand rounds, couldn't understand why I had put up with the LM for so long. I wasn't doing anything other than making bullets. Then I thought about it - maybe you shouldn't have to frig with the press constantly to make bullets come out... I don't have to fix my car every ten miles to go another ten and I don't have to research all the tricks and tips on the interent to make it run smoothly.

I'll be more kind on this that Opcx6 - Lee's progressive presses are just not made to a standard that a competitive shooter needing 10K+ rounds a year can put up with. Their time is too valuable. Some of thier products are not bad.

Today, I have a $3K motorized 1050 with bullet feeder - I turn on the switch and toss in components and 40 cal bullets come out. While it's making bullets, I'm cranking 38 super on the Dillon 1000 at 2K rounds an hour out next to it. I don't have time to reload - but I need 35K plus rounds a year...so I've got some of the best gear. Not what everyone needs, but trust me - no LM could do the job.

My dies on the two top of the line Dillons - are - Lee! - I like them. The factory Crimp die is good at fixing my blunders and the bullet seat/crimp die - when properly set up - allows me to run a powder checker and the bullet feeder. My 38 super and 40 cal dies were ordered a little undersized, so the cases tend to crimp the entire round, not just at the mouth. I do have a Turret for small jobs; like 454 Casull. Nothing wrong with this stuff for me.

My Lee Single stage frame snapped while making 45-120s - very short in it's life - but the RCBS rockchucker that replaced it never will.

OP; decide on your reloading needs and your available time to do it and in my experience, you'll very likely be looking at another brand of press than your LM.
There you go - another opinion...from someone who has had both and is mechanically inclined. Take it and a buck fifty and you can get a can of coke...

 

[easyrider604]

You are equally as bigotted towards Dillon, admit it.

What? Did I ever tell anyone to trash his 550B? It is quite evident that your problems are not limited to the mechanical.

I had three 550Bs, sold my last one two years ago to buy Lee because I didn't need the speed of the 550B anymore (400 rds per hour...I actually did a timed run once).

All I needed now was a set up that will allow me more flexibility since I wanted to reloaded 30-06 and more pistol calibers, in limited quanties. I haven't compete in the pistol games for a long time. I did not want to sink in more cash into my hobby than I have to. The Lee line of reloaders fit the bill perfectly. Simple as that. Just because I sold my Dillons to buy Lee doesn't make me a Dillon bigot.

No major complaints with my 550Bs or maybe I am not a whiner. I had one 550B primer tube explosion years ago, by the way with Winchester primers IIRC, but no big deal, that's what the outer steel primer tube is there for.

Takes me longer to change calibers/primer size with the 550B than with either the Classic Turret (10 seconds), or the LM (one minute), and adjusting the primer feed on the 550B took too long for me. Have I ever complained? Have I ever told people to junk their Dillons?

I won't even bother addressing your other comments as they are too way out of topic.

 

[easyrider604]

OP; decide on your reloading needs and your available time to do it and in my experience, you'll very likely be looking at another brand of press than your LM.
There you go - another opinion...from someone who has had both and is mechanically inclined. Take it and a buck fifty and you can get a can of coke...

Now there is a reasonable reply, from a reasonable man. Thank you FV

 

[Opcx6]

What? Did I ever tell anyone to trash his 550B? It is quite evident that your problems are not limited to the mechanical.

I had three 550Bs, sold my last one two years ago to buy Lee because I didn't need the speed of the 550B anymore (400 rds per hour...I actually did a timed run once).

All I needed now was a set up that will allow me more flexibility since I wanted to reloaded 30-06 and more pistol calibers, in limited quanties. I haven't compete in the pistol games for a long time. I did not want to sink in more cash into my hobby than I have to. The Lee line of reloaders fit the bill perfectly. Simple as that. Just because I sell my Dillons to buy Lee doesn't make me a Dillon bigot.

No major complaints with my 550Bs or maybe I am not a whiner. I had one 550B primer tube explosion years ago, by the way with Winchester primers IIRC, but no big deal, that's what the outer steel primer tube is there for.

Takes me longer to change calibers/primer size with the 550B than with either the Classic Turret (10 seconds), or the LM (one minute), and adjusting the primer feed on the 550B took too long for me. Have I ever complained? Have I ever told people to junk their Dillons?

I won't even bother addressing your other comments as they are too way out of topic.

I am so happy you enjoy my posts!

 

[SandRoad]

Now there is a reasonable reply, from a reasonable man. Thank you FV

I agree, that is a through and articulate reply.

Nobody has ever said that a Lee setup is equivalent to a Dillon setup costing 10 to 15 times as much. Nor is everyone willing or able to spend the money for that Dillon.

It is easy to say to just spend the extra money, it will save in the future.....

No different than saying to someone to forget about buying a domestic truck because they are all junk, just spend the $ on a Landcruiser or G Wagon, and you will save it in the future on fewer repairs and headaches. Great thought, but it doesn't work for everyone.