Locktite not Locktiting!

SIGP2101 said:
Your problem is loss of friction on the screw threads itself. You need to establish it again throughout the whole length of the screw, not just on the had of the screw.
Stop reading labels on products and apply logic
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This is what I'm talking about. I fail to see how the problem of the screw becoming loose is in any way related to your comment. What do you mean by 'just the head of the screw'?

The second point is why you are stating to 'apply logic'... I don't get it.

ANYWAY... I do now understand your concept of the smaller screw holding the big screw in place - kinda like the detent on the muzzle of a VZ-58... basically, a pin which prevents the rotation of whatever muzzle attachment..

However, I would say that's overkill. Loctite on a screw should be more than enough on an ARMS 18 mount.
 
Try putting a small smear of the blue on the underside of the bolthead where it applies the clamping force to the mount. Afterall you want it to stop turning, it doen't matter where the lock it does it?
 
Did you call like I suggested? The company I work for sells over 500 Loctite products. Eamonn should be able to answer any question you have. I'm no expert.. I just ship the stuff.. but he is.
 
I have found when blue isnt enough..mix 50-50 blue with red...ussually works.. the locktight superglue is expensive but good..you can use it to glue metal.
 
When dealing with tapped holes that are problematic,a thurough cleaning will help determine if the thread itself has been comprimised or damaged,comprimised meaning that it is entirely possible for the tap drill to have been too large or cut oversize thus reducing the percentage of effective thread,or damaged by the use of a tap to clean the threads proior to flushing the hole free of contaniments such as caked-up locktite or dried up oils.If and when the threads are found to be in good condition then further assessment can be made towards the use of a threadlocker.When pro gunsmiths install bases for sights or scopes,they usually tighten the threads to a specific torque with a threadlocker such as "Guntite" or equivalent and finish the torque by means of a moderate "hammer assist" to the screw driver.If the threads are good this method has worked for me 35 years now with few failures
jackpine
 
PoFF said:
I've been trying to install an ARMS #18 mount on my Nork M14S with very little success so far. Even with strong tightening, the main bolt somehow always manage to loosen and the hole scope/mount assemble is moving after a few shots.

I tought locktiting the main bolt and all screws would solve the problem, but even after cleaning the reciever, screws, bolts and mount with brake cleaner to get the oil & grease out, the locktite doesn't seem to grip at all, even after a couple of days of cure. My stuff is genuine Blue Locktite brand (not the Permatex brand they're selling at CT). The tube is a couple of years old (3-4 years), would it be too old, hence the failure to grip?
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Very possible about the age of the loctite... I recently bought a new bottle because I don't remember how long I had my old tube for (and didn't want to risk wasting time).

I also find that 99% rubbing alcohol should be applied to both sets of threads to be fastened. Shake tube well and apply a drop (or two) and crank it down then wait.

Never had a problem.

So the most important part is the cleaning of threads as I have had problems with oil contamination not allowing the loctite to cure (I suspect this was your problem as well).

Good luck~

*Note: Loctite cures and works best the tighter the area it is being applied to - if the threads are very loose and not a good fit, then no amount of loctite will help.
 
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G37 said:
*Note: Loctite cures and works best the tighter the area it is being applied to - if the threads are very loose and not a good fit, then no amount of loctite will help.
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Exactly, as above damaged threads maybe at fault here, if the bolt is stretched it maybe to loose...try another.

Perhaps a lock washer will help the situation!

Funny how if we were talking about something like exhaust header bolts we would be having the opposite problem :rolleyes:
 
What size threads?

If these are bigger than 4-40, use the red. The blue stuff is "temporary" or non-permanent in nature, and I only use it on stuff that really has no stress on it and I just don't want it to fall off...

Gunnar
www.armco-guns.comn
 
red and blue loctite are anaerobic compound.They need metal to metal contact and no oxygen to cure correctly.look at this link:http://www.loctite.com/int_henkel/loctite_us/index.cfm?&pageid=249&layout=1.In the FAQ ,clic on anaerobic and look answer.You can use primer to help curing.If you know someone working for Loctite distributor(or bearing supplier like Kinecor),ask for catalog.You will find a lot of usefull informations and technical stuff.hope this help
 
Use Ether. At the shop, whenever we loctite something, we must clean it with ether first, and let it dry. Don't blow it our with compressed air unless your sure the air is dry. Most compressor air is to damp, and brings you back to the same problem. Also, and don't quote me on this, the blue loctite is more for fasteners I think. I know that's what your trying to do, but in my experience, it doesn't stand up well to vibration or shock. The lower or medium strength loctite in red or green should fix you up, but you'll need about 500 degrees F to break it afterward. I won't go any further than to suggest ether. The rest was just FYI.




Southpaw.
 
I forgot to advise that black oxide is considered like inactive material for anaerobic compound:

Q: How long does it take for an anaerobic adhesive to dry?

A: Anaerobic adhesives do not contain solvents, which must dry. For an anaerobic adhesive to cure, it must be in contact with active metal ions and contact with oxygen eliminated. Outside of a bonded joint, anaerobic materials will not completely cure. Inside the joint, cure rates can be controlled by changing product and primer. Heat can be used to accelerate cure rate.

Q: What are materials that are considered "active" and "inactive"?

A: The list is as follows:

ACTIVE:
Iron
Plain Steel
Nickel
Copper
Manganese
Kovar
Commercial Aluminum
(with copper content e.g. 6061)
Brass
Monel
Bronze
INACTIVE: Plated Parts
Anodized Aluminum
Titanium
Stainless Steel
Galvanized Steel
Zinc
Pure Aluminum
Cadmium
Magnesium
Magnetite Steel
Iconel
Silver
Gold
Natural or Chemical Black Oxide






Q: Why does Loctite only fill half of their anaerobic 50-ml and 250 ml bottles?

A: Actually, there is exactly 50 ml and 250-ml adhesive in each package. We fill bottles halfway because air is needed in the package to prevent our Anaerobics from solidifying. Our 50-ml and 250 ml bottles also allow our Anaerobics to breathe by allowing air to permeate through the bottles.

Q: What do colors mean?

A: Many times Loctite anaerobic materials are called " the red or the blue stuff". With threadlockers, colors designate strength. Generally red means high strength and blue means moderate strength, and purple is low strength. Other colors do indicate strengths in relative areas.


Q: Should I use a primer for curing Loctite Anaerobics?

A: Almost all Loctite products will cure on metal surfaces without a primer. Therefore, primers are recommended for use on non-metallic surfaces with Anaerobics to achieve a practical cure speed.
 
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