long range rifles

whoever said that wounded animals happen, you're right. but when they happen to me at a reasonable range, and they have I have the option of a follow up shot, you are going to have a hard time convincing me that at 700 yards that's an option for you on running game. Those of you that really know ballistics know that time of flight, wind drift, and bullet drop are significant factors at those type of ranges and that while you SOMETIMES get nice groups at big ranges it is usually after a couple of test shots to see just exactly where in the F**k that thing is hitting way out there. You also know that a puff of wind will drive that bullet 11 inches to the left...So I think as hunters we have enough problems keeping our sport going without having some hotshot gut shooting an elk and having it die slow, and go to waste just because he didn't have the skill to get within four hundred yards or the respect for the animal to pass over the shot. I'm not trying to start a flame war but my experience has not been the same as Cat's. Inuit subsistance hunters , gotta concede that point I guess, I know nothing about that.
 
Wow! Some great discussion here :( I am going to sum this thread up with two quotes by Clint Eastwood:

1. "A man has got to know his limitations"

2. "I'm interested in the fact that the less secure a man is, the more likely he is to have extreme prejudice."

Flame on! :D
 
How about the .408 Cheytac, according to an article in Outdoor Life a marine shot a 16" group @ over 2400yrds., which is supposedly the vital zone of an elk.....

EDIT: NVM, it was a 16 5/8" 3-shot group @ 2,321yrds.
 
vic777
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverado7
... i spend a ton of time up a tree with my bow!

Seriously, does this require any skill? Please explain

i was replying to a statement about not being a "true hunter" for inquiring about a rifle adequate enough to take a 700 yrd kill shot.
as for skill... none! just screw a few pegs into a tree, hang your stand, haul your bow up then sit there and freeze. thats it, thats all!
 
The question is are you skilled and experienced enough to determine whether the wind is blowing the same direction here as it is at 1500, or as you now say, 2000 yds away?

It can be done. Do you know how?

Can you determine how many times and how much it changes direction in between?

Now that you have the wind direction figured out, are you able to determine the velocity of that wind.............all the way from here to there?

Do you know that just a ten mile per hour wind, which is just a slight breeze on the side of your face, has the same effect on a bullet as gravity?

How far does gravity pull a bullet down at 1500 yds? The same distance a ten mph breeze pushes it sideways, unless of course, the angle of the wind isn't ninety degrees to the path of the bullet, or is it?

A high BC 30 cal bullet takes one and a quarter seconds to reach 1000yd. Do you have any idea how long it takes a bullet to travel 1500 yds, even one with an exceptionally high ballistic co-efficient, launched at very high speed, say 3400 fps?

If you can determine all of that, then are you absolutely certain the animal will stand still for that long....... or will it take a step?
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am i capable of these no
but i do know a few people that are
I know my limits and thats what i shoot (if their big enough i will strecth that limit) but who are you to sit there and tell every one that they have no buisiness hunting cuz they shoot over 500 yards
I think your jealous
come shoot on the praries and some times good luck getting that close
practice abit more and maybe youll be able to shoot past 100 yards too
 
daniellybbert said:
am i capable of these no
but i do know a few people that are
I know my limits and thats what i shoot (if their big enough i will strecth that limit) but who are you to sit there and tell every one that they have no buisiness hunting cuz they shoot over 500 yards
I think your jealous
come shoot on the praries and some times good luck getting that close
practice abit more and maybe youll be able to shoot past 100 yards too
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Sorry, I thought I had made it clear, but you miss the entire point of my post. Here's the part that you didn't quote.

Why not? said:
With all due respect, the odds of wounding an animal at your 1500-2000 yds are many orders of magnitude higher than the originator of this thread with his 280 Rem at 200 or even 500 yards.

Respectfully,
Ted
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Not saying it cant be done at 500 yds or even longer, but as the distance increases, the odds go up big time.

Being certain of one shot, one kill at 1500 - 2000 yd? I just can't see that.

As far as shooting on the prairies, I would love to do that some time. As far as shooting long distance, come on up caribou or sheep hunting, but not at 1500 yds. ;)

Again, respectfully,
Ted
 
Why not? said:
Not saying it cant be done at 500 yds or even longer, but as the distance increases, the odds go up big time.
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Especially in a hunting situation where you may not have very much time to figure out the particulars.
 
The shame of it all is that if we were doing this over beers we'd all be friends, we'd all be shooters, and we'd all be hunters. We'd talk about this for twenty minutes, none of us would be convinced by the others, it might get heated, we'd all enjoy ourselves , we'd all be right (at least in our mind) and the topic would soon shift to something else controversial and I'd piss off more people and the cycle goes on.

Silverado...you have to understand that in my hands the internet is a clumsy instrument and I did not mean that you were not a hunter for asking the question, I kind of have a picture in my mind of those Colorado 50 bmg 1500 yard elk hunters, and that isn't even in the same ballpark as what you were asking about.

I don't know where I draw my own line, it would probably depend on a lot of factors but with practice, and familiarity it could probably be extended.

I'm kind of tainted by an experience I had a few years ago where a friend of mine shot a ruffie off a round bale at about 450 yards with a seven mm mag with one shot, marksmanship?certainly...sportsmanship?certainly not..

Silverado...that aint you either, so excuse my biases and enjoy your hunt.

If any of the rest of you ever find yourselves in this part of the country and want to show off your stuff and make me take my hat off, I'll set up a gong at 1000 yards for you..... in my backyard, and you can prove to me that you can ring in on the first shot. Just in case you don't make the shot bring beer, mine is always in the fridge.

cheers to all, sorry to some

milo
 
Its a 30 meter fun zone for archers, and a 375 meter range for rifle shooters. Their are extreme cases with both, I see it as for the normal hunting ranges. :D
field-of-red-poppies_13300.jpg
 
Another option is to get a long range bolt action with lots of power , this will allow a practiced person the ability to shoot a critter a long ways off , :rolleyes: now thats hunten fun eh! :D Better yet clear a path from the house out to 1000 meters. Set out some bait , and you can shoot a deer right off the ####ter drinking a coffee , and having a smoke. :D
 
I have a 280 rem that i'm not afraid of shooting 400yrds (hunting). but i think that anything after that would really pushing it. I would like to own a rifle that would be accurate and still powerful enough to drop big game at 500-700yrds. what would you guys recomend?
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Depends on the size of big game. Deer, elk, moose? I know that some LR hunters put a limit of 1000 ftlb energy on their range for deer, some use 2000 or 1500 ftlb energy for larger ungulates. I am also currently thinking of changing to a magnum :)eek: ) for much of the same reasons.

Using the above criteria with the 300wsm or the 300win mag deer could be shot at 1000 yards, and elk at about 700 yards. One shot kills on deer at 1k are outta my realm of can-do! Some LR hunters prefer larger calibers. This has to be thoroughly investigated by every LR hunter.

This endeavour requires much practice with the right load, and the brains to pass up a shot when conditions are not right.
 
that's kinda what i was thinking... also ackley improving my 280 has passed through my head.
i don't think i'd be looking for a 1000m shot but 5-700 with still enough hitting pwr to do the job.
didn't mean to start a war... but if you have the equipt. and talent to take a 1500m shot go for it. i don't have either.
thanks for the input tho! good to see all different views!
 
none of you guys are REAL hunters ! I hunt with a knife and a club like my caveman relatives!

pfffff rifles bows ....

:D

f7
 
I love Shooting and hunting, and I do shoot 1000 yards, but not at game. Practicing at 1000 yards leads me into the camp of those who are a bit negative about shooting at an animal that far away (or farther) I have seen some real eye-openers just shooting paper at 1000 yds. Light conditions, breezes, drizzles, etc, etc, all change the point of impact of our projectile. Reading all these factors correctly is indeed a challenge, too large of a challenge for me to try to take game at those ranges. My personal limit is about 600 yards, with conditions being ideal in every respect. Beyond that I am uncomfortable, and will always try to close the distance a bit. Some may be able to go beyond that comfortably, but I suspect that there is always a bit of trepidation when one touches off a shot at game at 1000 or beyond. Another problem I see in this is one has about a kilometer to go before he gets to where the game was standing when the shot was made. If wounded, how easy will it be to find this animal? For sure you will need a spotter along to help you locate the exact spot the game was at when you arrive. If the game is seriously wounded, it should be lying close by, but with a less serious wound, it could travel a long way by the time you even arrive at the scene, this reducing the chance of recovery. While I am not prepared to "diss" those who subscribe to long range hunting, It is not for me. I cannot ethically justify it for myself. I would hope that those who do take these extremely long pokes at game do a tremendous amount of long-range practice, and also educate themselves in the art of reading wind and light conditions very well. Additionally, I would hope that they will know when such a shot should NOT be taken, period. How one takes game is largely a personal decision, but we owe our animals a lot more than to allow them to escape with a bullet hole in them, whether that happens at close range or far. Regards, Eagleye.
 
Eagleye said:
We owe our animals a lot more than to allow them to escape with a bullet hole in them, whether that happens at close range or far.
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There in lies what gets my tempers up. Cat's talking about 2000 yd shots that are a: completely with out any elevation probs, crisp clear arctic morning air, and b: where the Caribou have no where to run and hide. In the case of a wounding only, another hunter (uncle) is sitting there with the same animal targeted and ready to go. Rare case he does not put the animal down. the first shooter is ready to go again. The animal has nowhere to go, they can finish the animal quickly. My money says that if we ask Cat if he would take the same shot in poor vis, 15 kts of wind, and off the top of an ice peak, he'd tell you to shove off on the next ice flow. Now if we are talking valleys and such, where there are elevation probs, probs detecting true wind direction and velocity, you are asking to wound the animal, and when you do, and it takes of into the bush, it will take you a ludicris amount of time to get to its last position, plus you will have to track it.

This is of course the worst case sceanario, but my personal feeling is that if I or a fellow shooter can't garauntee to finish the animal before it figures out that it needs to be scared, then a: the meat will SUCK, and b: its just too damd far to walk:runaway:
 
It does take ALOT of skill to make a well placed long shot.(400 yards+)

I think these hunters in USA taking 1000+ yard or more shots on ELK are missing out on the true meaning of hunting....?

1038 yard Elk shot:

http://longrangehunting.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=126678&page=2&fpart=1&vc=1&nt=4

1302 yard Elk:

http://longrangehunting.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=122140&an=0&page=4#122140

To me shooting an Elk after you have called him into close range would give more of a "rush" and a "sense of accomplishment" ....?

To each their own I guess....
 
I own a Weatherby Accumark in 300 Wby Magnum..

that would work..

another alternative would be this gun in 300-378 Wby Magnum.

I get 3200fps with a 180gr bullet with my 300. The 300-378 Mag is reputed to get 3400+ with the same bullet.
 
catnthehatt said:
Some bow hunters say that ANYONE hunting with a rifle is not hunting.
Some lever hiunters say that ANYONE hunting with a scope is not hunting.
I remember some arespick hunting with an inline saying "I would be a sin to "snipe " that animal with a modern rifle"!
Still others say that anyone hunting from tree stand with a compund is not hunting.
I've also heard that " anyone can shoot tiny little groups with a benchrest"

I'm tired of all this self rightous CRAP!!:mad:
Stay away from this type of conversation , if all you want to do is preach.you type of hunting , shooting , whatever.

BTTW, I hunt with single shots, Muzzle loaders, stick bows, and long range rifles, and if it is of any interest to you, have seen more animals wounded by people at short range than I have by true long range hunters who pratcice diligently.

If you want to start a flame war ( which I guess you have) take it somewhwere else, Partner.
This is the last I will speak about this, BBTW, so the moderators can do what they want with it.
Cat
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Well said. As for "Americans" hunting elk at 1500 yards with a .50, I think that's an enormous load of crap. Long range hunting takes a lot of skill, especially tracking the thing if it darts off into the bush.

-Rohann
 
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