Low powered .223 reloads

nickorette

nickorette

BANNED
BANNED
BANNED
Rating - 100%
18   0   0
Location
Port Perry/Toronto
How low can you go?

(I use varget so it's impossible to double charge as the case overflows before it exceeds the charge limit)

I was toying with the idea the other day about trying out some low powered .223. I've got the emergency gas setting on the swiss arms to take care of excessive fouling, but I could use that to make up for a lack of pressure to cycle the action.

What is a safe amount to go down to? Obviously I don't want bullets getting stuck in the barrel or whatever-its-called when you have too much case volume and not enough powder.
 
be carefull too low is as dangerous as too high, look on the web for subsonic 223 loads but your turning your 223 in a 22lr
 
The .223 caliber rifles were built to shoot within certain perameters. By "downloading" the carts you are taking away the performance of the rifle just to save powder, what little difference that would be in such a small casing. Shoot the gun as it was meant to be loaded and buy a .22 for the fun shooting.

I have just learned the performance of my savage.223 by being given a 69 grain bullet ..powder combination by a friend and last outing, at 100 yards, i was sub 1 inch. before that, the 55 grain FMJs were a "pepper pattern".... it is risky to play with lighter powder loads than specified.
 
Reduced loads not a problem and perfectly safe, simply use a faster powder and lower the charge.
Personally I like the .223 at 100fps below max velocity for best accuracy- depends on what you're using it for.
Go on-line and look up "Silhouette" data for the .223

The following is from an older Alliant data book:
55gr Sierra Spitzer, Fed 205m, 15.9grains of 2400 = 2430fps.
 
I did something similar to this in my Mini 14. I needed a reduced load for varmit shooting in a close to town area.

Some things to note:

pushing a 55 grain amax Hornady bullet and Varget powder


23 grains nice load
21 grains smooth...i liked it
19 grains reduce velocity less crack bullet drop 2"
18 grains first no cycle of action 1 out of 4 rounds fired
17 grains no cycle of action, more residue in gas system
16 grains no cycle of action, dirty action barrel.
15 grains same as above and I stoped. Chrony was at 1200 fps.

I ended up using the 18.5 grains. nice load action worked and I achieved around the 2000fps mark.

these are my experiences.

Dont start by cutting the powder in half reduce for your gun by 1 grain and test fire. You will find what works well.
 
I have a real concern for the phenomena of 'detonation'. I'd sooner look to a cheaper powder such as the surplus ones Higginson's sells than risk that.
 
Don't get me wrong. I'm not doing interested in this for the purposes of saving money. More of a curiousity thing.

Red bird dog: I like the idea I might give it a shot.

I will have to look into detonation. I agree -not worth the risk. I want to know where to draw the line.
 
nickorette said:
Don't get me wrong. I'm not doing interested in this for the purposes of saving money. More of a curiousity thing.

Red bird dog: I like the idea I might give it a shot.

I will have to look into detonation. I agree -not worth the risk. I want to know where to draw the line.
Click to expand...

The definition of detonation, is explosion. With that in mind, take a look at what was in a 1970s issue of the Speer reloading manual.

P001.jpg

Sorry, but there you have it. Smokeless powder means no explosions (detonations).
I am sure you are aware that smokeless powder is world wide classified in the dangerous goods catagory for transportation, as flammable, and not explosive.
If loading a light load in a cartridge would make it explode, do you think it would be classified as flammable and not explosive?
 
Smokeless powders are made from explosive chemical formulations which could experience detonation would it not be for the extruded shapes, deterrents and coatings which slow the process down below detonation speeds.

Will loading light loads change the burning speed of powder 'X' so that the burn rate is altered to a point of becoming unsafe? Improbable, but not impossible.
Is the 'detonation phenomena' a complete myth? Maybe in most cases, and maybe not in all.
 
Blue Dot seems to be a popular powder for .223 reduced loads. It likely won't cycle a semiauto action due to its pressure curve.

Care must be taken not to double charge cases with this powder.
 
The issue with "detonation" is mostly a concern with significantly reduced charges of slow burning powder in large capacity cases. This was delt with in great detail in an Article in Handloader magazine several years ago--if I ever locate the reference again I will post it.

44Bore
 
Years ago this idea of less than full loads of slow burning powder, in particular 4831, causing extra high pressure came up. Bruce Hodgdon, founder of Hodgdon's powder, tried in their lab to see if there was any truth to it.
The following is a portion of his report, which I have copied.
P1020737.jpg

Note that in the example with the 30-06 he gives, every single reduction in powder results in a reduction in pressure. Just as it should!
I have also read that of the many lab tests done on this subject, no examiner, anywhere, has ever had a case where a reduction in powder has resulted in higher than expected pressures.
P1020738.jpg
 
I would think if it is possible, it would be a small amount of fast burning powder that has been modified in some fashion from it's original form, and therefore the burn rate being increased considerably. I wonder if they ever tested loads that had a reduction of powder that was tampered with (like crushed up ball powder or similar)
 
One difference is speed of ignition in the reduced loads, you can have flash over - which I doubt would cause dangerous conditions (as the previous posts have already argued) but it may lead to inconsistencies in impact point.
 
Look for reputable load data using pistol powders. You want to have reasonably full pressure developed, so that the powder can burn cleanly and completely. Obviously, when using a powder in which a double charge is feasible, be careful.

If you use extremely reduced loads of regular rifle powder, there will be substantial amounts of unburned powder left; this can be dirty, and it might even foul your trigger group, gas system, etc.
 
I recall a load using Titegroup that one of the guys on GlockTalk cooked up. It was something like four grains and it got a 55 grn. bullet up to a whopping 900 fps.:D

I'll try and find the thread and relate the info here....

Edit: Found my file where i store reloading suggestions...No joy on the real thread though

Here is what I was talking about. Apparently the OP claims this is listed Hodgson data from their site:

"As an aside, has anyone else noticed Hodgdgdon lists a frickin load under 223 for Clays? 55g fmj + 3.2g = 1060 fps @ 3,700cup.
The Titegroup load kicks its arse though, 3.1g = 1064fps @ 4,000 cup."
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom