Lyman vs Traditions

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Pig_Dog

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Keeping in mind i'm left handed.

I've been toying with the idea of getting another Muzzleloader and slowly moving away from the in-line's.
Lyman has one called the "Trade Rifle" 1:48 twist
Traditions has the "Hawken Woodsman" 1:48 twist

Now my question is if you own one of these how do you like it and what sort of groups can i expect from these two smokepole's

The other 2 I have in mind are the "Great Plains" 32 in barrel 1:60 twist for patch and ball hunting load's. With double set trigger's.
The other is the "Great Plains Hunter" 1:32 twist. Both of these are from Lyman.
Any in put on these two would be appriciated as well.
 
I don't own either but I have handled many of the Lymans. I would never spend good money on one because frankly the fit and finish on these does not meet my standards - not even close.

The cheekpiece is generally left rough and undefined before sanding - like they never shaped it after they took it off the duplicator. I like scalloped edges, or even - GASP! - a shaddow line. The fittings and buttplate on the Lyman stock are usually not cast and polished brass, but rather cast blued steel. I prefer the brass. The stocks themselves are a very utility grade beech, not walnut or fiddleback maple as should be the case on a Hawken clone. Forget about a patchbox - not in that price range I guess.

The barrels are octagonal, but the flats are unpolished and very rough like the grasping grooves on a Norinco 1911A1 :shock: . I doubt human hands had anything to do with the finish on the Lyman's barrel. Probably was just run through a steel plane 8 times and left at that. The hammer was a rough casting with the casting seam left on it - not poilshed off before blueing.

In terms of a VERY economical way to get into black powder - it is that. In terms of a rifle you will enjoy to own and shoot - I'd keep saving pannies a bit longer. I imiagine the Traditions gun is about the same at that price point.

Oh, and did I mention the UGLY Century International Arms style dot-matrix electro-pencil markings on the barrel??? YUCK! :?
 
Don't buy Traditions, they are crap. Thompson Center are the way to go. I don't own one but just about everyone I know does and they sing T/C praises. With T/C any part that breaks they replace, they have good resale value. Ask Nessy or Mooncoon.

SW
 
Claven2 said:
In terms of a VERY economical way to get into black powder - it is that. In terms of a rifle you will enjoy to own and shoot - I'd keep saving pannies a bit longer. I imiagine the Traditions gun is about the same at that price point.
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Any other suggestion's for a manufacture. Price is not really an issue, high quality is. Keeping in mind I am left handed, I went to Thompson's site and did not see a left handed Hawken. This Muzzelloader just wont go to the range, it will hunt too.

While were on this subject I haven't seen any manufature's making 58 cals ???
 
Armi Sport and Pedersoli make .58's - call Marstar.

As for left handed, I'm a lefty and I have no problem shooting righty muzzle-loaders. I just make sure I wear a long sleeved shirt to avoid powder burns on caplocks ;)
 
I have a Lyman Deerstalker and love it. My wife has a Traditions Deerhunter with the same length of barrel [24"], and the same 1 in 48" twist. They both shoot about 1 1/2" to 2" groups at 80 yards. The Lyman is a far better rifle IMHO, and the Greatplains is said to be a very good replica of what was used. I have also heard that the Lyman flintlock is the best one to be had in the lower priced rifles. My Deerstalker has for the past 14 or 15 years, put meat in on the table every year, and has won several 1st place plaques. I would not hesitate to get another Lyman rifle.
 
Agreed what everyone else said.I would put my money on the T/C, but that's my preference.How does the Lyman hold for you ? versus the T/C ?They both pobably shoot just as good.
I'm a lefty,and shoot right handers easily.
Have you considered a 54cal? Easier to get ball and sabots.
In the Lyman the GPH is the better rifle IMHO.
Any gunstores in your area carrying M/L ?
Hope that's some help.
Cheers nessy.
 
snowshoe said:
They both shoot about 1 1/2" to 2" groups at 80 yards.
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What type of a load are you shooting in order to obtain this group, just for future reference for my self :?:
 
nessy357 said:
Agreed what everyone else said.I would put my money on the T/C, but that's my preference.How does the Lyman hold for you ? versus the T/C ?They both pobably shoot just as good.
I'm a lefty,and shoot right handers easily.
Have you considered a 54cal? Easier to get ball and sabots.
In the Lyman the GPH is the better rifle IMHO.
Any gunstores in your area carrying M/L ?
Hope that's some help.
Cheers nessy.
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I'm going to e-mail T/C to find out if they come in "Left handed" model's, I'll let you know what they say.. If it's not left handed, I don't concider buying no matter how good a product is anymore. I'm starting to see more companies cater to lefty's, the price is a little higher but i don't mind.

I have an in-line 54 cal right now and conical's and sabot's are hard to come buyand the selection limited, i'm going to have to start making my own.

As for gun store's in my area i have to go to Saskatoon, but there have been quite a few at the gun shows in the area and in left hand.

Ther are quite a few Black Powder shoots in Saskatchewan, so I'll have to go to a couple and see the the different make's and model's, maybe I'll even get a chance to shoot a couple.
 
Pig Dog, I am using 80g of Pyrodex RS, a .495 ball, and a lightly lubed 15 th pillow ticking patch. I also got very good accuracy using a paper patched 380g Lee Mini, but the recoil was more than I wanted. It is a good idea to handle and shoot if you can, as many muzzleloaders as you can get your hands on. I loved the look of the Greatplains rifle, but after shooting one, I did not like it. It was too heavy, and was a poor fit for me. I also liked the T/C Renagade, but I didn't like the sights, and it didn't shoulder as well as my Deerstalker. So try what you can, and good luck.
 
That's for that input again Snoeshoe. I just got back from the range and was shooting .445 gr Lyman Shockers in my 54 cal in-line. Best grouping I've ever had 1in at a 100yrds :shock: .
I tend to like a heavier rifle then most, I find my in-line too lite. So when you said the Greatplains was too heavy, I thought to myself gotta get one in my hands to feel it. The 32 in barrel is also appealing as well.
Have you ever tried the peep/target sight's on you Muzzle loader. I saw T/C make's one for the renegade as well??
 
I have a Lyman Great Plains Rifle and the fit and finish on it is as equal if not better than any other production muzzle loader on the market. As far as accuracy goes, I think they are all comparable after you have figured out the right load combination. If you look at the other muzzleloading forums on the internet you will find that the Great plains Rifle is a highly regarded firearm and is the rifle of choice among those who are looking for a period correct rifle. I know that Wholesale Sports sells them.
 
I don't know what Lymans Claven's talking about, but this is my Trade.

LTR1.jpg


Has nearly the nicest piece of wood in my collection. No beech here. Very solid gun. Barrel could have been more highly polished (bluing is fine - just that draw marks are a bit evident). Shoots very accurately in the right hands (not necessarily mine :x )

Not seen in the picture - it does have a cheekpiece for RH shooter's, which might bother a lefty. Can't remember if they make a lefty version. When I bought this, I was going to pick up a T/C Hawken. Other then the set trigger, there was nothing about the Hawken that made it a better gun then this Lyman, and it was somewhat more money. The Trade has an oiled wood stock - the T/C is varnished - shows scratches easily.
 
I have a Lyman Great Plains Rifle and love it. It has steel furniture on it. The furniture and barrel was never blued or browned and it was allowed to brown on it own. It has the 1840's era look, which is what I perfer.
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