M-14 Bolt Jammed Open at Range!

R

rishi65

Member
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
2   0   0
**PHOTOS IN PAGE 2 POST**

Hello all,
I just purchased my second M-14 type rifle (something to compliment my M-305), and took the rifle to the range this afternoon.
After about 60 rounds I had a strange failure which I've never experienced. The bolt seems to have ridden back BEHIND the bridge in the receiver (which connects the two legs of the receiver together).
Once it rode that far back, the front end of the bolt then dropped just low enough to become lodged behind the bridge area.
I removed the barreled action from the stock, and first tried giving the op. rod a good whack, nothing. I found the op. rod still had play rearward, so I relieved the tension from the op. rod spring, and removed the spring and guide.
Once I did that, I was able to work on dislodging the bolt without worrying about holding the op. rod back. I figured out what was stopping the bolt from traveling forward (as I said, the front of the bolt had dropped just below the level of the bridge). As a result, all it took was applying upward pressure on the bottom of the bolt, and forward pressure on the back of the bolt to dislodge it.
I then removed it and compared it to the bolt from my M-305 to make sure there were no obvious deformities, and reassembled the rifle.
It cycled the next 100 rounds flawlessly.

The ammo was milsurp, copper washed, ChiCom steel (same stuff available from SFRC, but not bought from them), stamped '93'. I did find one casing where the neck had cracked, but the casing was not obviously deformed in any other manner (burn through perhaps?). I'm not sure this was the casing which caused the jamming.

Why did this happen?

I haven't cleaned this rifle until it was bare, so it still had SOME assembly grease on it, but I did clean it and lubricate it fairly well, with a combination of white lithium and synthetic bearing grease before heading to the range.

Any insight would be appreciated, as I'm not any sort of expert (at all). Thanks in advance!


P.S. It's worth noting that the op rod on this rifle is much harder to install than on my other M-14. The clearances involved in installing and removing it just seem tighter. Perhaps this is because the rifle is so new.
 
Last edited:
Is there a good rule of thumb for checking the indexing? It's been some time since I've read up on it?

Any way to check the op. rod for tweaks?
 
Dont trust your sights for indexing as the Nork sight splines are casted wrong. You can look at your op rod position against the piston to see if its alined, but a loose op rod guide can give a false reading.

Are you in Ontario?
 
Last edited:
Unfortunately I'm in Nova Scotia.
If we had the resources near Halifax I would, as a matter of course, take all my Norc product to be inspected by a smith before I began shooting it regularly. Unfortunately I'm stuck newbie-ing my way though.
 
Rishi, i have no idea what could have caused this failure. But I had a bolt issue two days ago too! My bolt came completey disassembled for no apparent reason. Luckily nothing was broken and I was able to reassemble the bolt using an allen key to push in the extractor plunger while my buddy used a screw driver to push on another little spring loaded plunger. It was super difficult but alas the fun continued. But what could possibly cause this to happen?
 
NewAgeRanger said:
Rishi, i have no idea what could have caused this failure. But I had a bolt issue two days ago too! My bolt came completey disassembled for no apparent reason. Luckily nothing was broken and I was able to reassemble the bolt using an allen key to push in the extractor plunger while my buddy used a screw driver to push on another little spring loaded plunger. It was super difficult but alas the fun continued. But what could possibly cause this to happen?
Click to expand...

I had my USGI TRW bolt disassemble itself at Match 5 the 300 yard Deliberate stage about 19 years ago when I inserted a cartridge into the magazine, with the nose of the bullet on the feed ramp, then I yanked back the op rod to release the bolt stop and let the bolt chamber the round.

The cartridge was pushed forward and as the first half entered the chamber, the last half pivoted upwards putting tension on the extractor. In short , I "rode" the op rod handle slowly and did not let the spring speed take over the cartridge loading. :(

This upward motion of the rim slowly pushed the extractor upwards, thus disassembling the bolt. Luckily I had spare bolt innards and reassembled my rifle for the Match 6 300 yard Snap match.

Hope this helps,

Barney
 
Thanks for the info barney! And good story, keep a spare bolt handy! This happened on the third round in the magazine so I'm still mesmerized as to how this happened. Time to check the ee for a backup bolt.
 
Hello Rishi . Is the rifle a new Socom18 ? I had to exchange the first Socom 18 I got because the bolt would continue to jam with the round halfway inserted into the chamber .
I believe it may have been an issue with the receiver bridge . As DSIWY mentioned check to see if the op rod aligns with the gas cylinder .Then see if it will pass the tilt test with the op rod spring guide and spring removed. The bolt should go into full battery and the op rod should move back and forth freely with no binding .
The copper washed Norinco ammo works well in these so I don't believe that was the problem.
 
Last edited:
I had a problem with my 2007 with the bolt getting jammed all the way back. I was shooting 150gr Winchester hunting ammo. I used a brass rod to tap it forward and that worked. My oprod guide was loose and you could see on the face of the oprod that it was touching the piston tail only on one side. After aligning and tightening the oprod guide it hasn't happened again in 200rds. Luckily my barrel indexing was ok.
 
The op rod guides on both my Norcs are loose, that is to say, they have some side to side play. My M-305 hasn't had any issues at all in 1000+ rounds.

I've checked the op rod alignment and it seems okay. That said, I've done some playing around with the bolt, and swapped the bolts between my M-305 and my troubled M-14. I think I've found the problem:

I'm going to try to post some photos, but essentially the rear right hand guide ear on the bolt (if you're looking down at the rifle with the receiver turned upside down) slips out of the guide groove in the rear of the receiver. The bolt then gets jammed in the rearward position as a result.

When I tried to repeat this with my M-305 bolt, I cannot. The right rear guide ear seems lager or longer, and cannot be forced free of the guide groove.

I suppose this means I need a new bolt?
 
Last edited:
Here's what the offending tab or guide ear I'm talking about, on my M-305 bolt (which works fine).

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t1.0-9/1157470_10153901411575317_1291554076_n.jpg

Here's what it looks like when it's in the fully rearward position (this is what my M-14 should look like as well).

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd....0-9/1939700_10153901411750317_422589928_n.jpg

Here's my M-14 bolt, in the same rearward position, with some pressure applied to it. The ear was easily forced free of the groove. This is the state I found the bolt to be in when the rifle jammed.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd....40/1912430_10153901411900317_1598555977_n.jpg

Here's how the same bolt looks, fully rearward, with no pressure applied.

https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net...40/10001570_10153901412050317_481075068_n.jpg

Here is the ear on the offending bolt (M-14), with the bolt removed from the rifle.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd....40/1001550_10153901412195317_1196700956_n.jpg
 
Last edited:
For poops and giggles I used a vernier to measure some of my spare bolts on the area that you pointed out. On the stamped serial numbered bolts the average was 1.104 with a couple at 1.111. Electro pencilled bolts averaged 1.115 (only 3). Don't know if these measurements help (or if this is even the problem) but they were easy to do and may help to establish a base line. Who knows
 
rishi65 said:
Here's what the offending tab or guide ear I'm talking about, on my M-305 bolt (which works fine).

1157470_10153901411575317_1291554076_n.jpg


Here's what it looks like when it's in the fully rearward position (this is what my M-14 should look like as well).

1939700_10153901411750317_422589928_n.jpg


Here's my M-14 bolt, in the same rearward position, with some pressure applied to it. The ear was easily forced free of the groove. This is the state I found the bolt to be in when the rifle jammed.

1912430_10153901411900317_1598555977_n.jpg


Here's how the same bolt looks, fully rearward, with no pressure applied.

10001570_10153901412050317_481075068_n.jpg


Here is the ear on the offending bolt (M-14), with the bolt removed from the rifle.

1001550_10153901412195317_1196700956_n.jpg
Click to expand...

There you go

Shawn
 
Thanks Shawn!
MillWright, I don't have a vernier handy, but I can only assume that there is a fairly significant difference in the measurements between these two bolts.
I'm pretty sure my best best is going to be replacing it...?

Anyone else ever experience this?
 
Dsiwy said:
I would stone it while keeping the original contours the same until it stops binding.
Click to expand...

I'm concerned though that removing any material will make it worse. As it stands, the binding only occurs when the bolt jumps free of the receiver's guide, and actually binds against a part of the receiver with which it should never normally have contact. Like a train jumping the tracks, and getting stuck.

When it stays in the grooves it runs just fine, and is smooth as can be expected.

Maybe I should be trying to get a hold of Hungry...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom