M-14 in Afghanistan

I am a big guy. I can lug around weight without much difficulty and the weight of the M14 always seems pretty negligible to me.

HOWEVER...if I am kicking in doors and swinging a rifle around in a room I don't care how strong I am, I want the lightest, shortest, fastest tool available. Preferably a carbine with the shortest barrel that will still give me enough jam to kill people effectively.

But kicking in doors and clearing rooms is such a small part of my daily routine in Vancouver that I feel comfortable with my choice of the M14. My goal is to never need a room-clearing rifle.

I love the gun like I love my Snap-On sockets...but there are times when I use my wrenches because the socket/ratchet is just too big to effectively manouver inside some part of an engine bay. I could probably get it in there, but I can just get the job done faster and with less frustration using my wrenches.

Still like the snap-on sockets best though, and the fact that I sometimes use my wrenches instead doesn't take anything away from them.
 
I had to see what all the fuss was about...........so I grabbed my M-14 and kicked down my bedroom door and swept the room....all clear. Then I grabbed my 10.5" CQB AR and kicked down the door to my guest room.....Hiding behind the corner was a God damn teddy bear.....took 2 rounds center mass and one more to the head and that ####er was down for good. No way I could have moved that fast wth the M-14.....no way.

........I gotta go guys, I sense the world needs me elsewhere :p
 
I have to agree with Morpheus,

The M1 at the time was the weapon majority the troops had...and they used it effectively with the tacics of the time (Europe)...with new challanges on the battle field, and mordern tacics developed to deal with these challanges, the M1 (then) and M14 (now) would not be the proper fit for ICQB. The way we train now the longer heavier platforms would be ineffective for thoses purposes. Fighting in close quarters, at night with the PAQs, lights etc..adds to that. This is the reality of 50+ years of lessons learned.

I am not saying at all that the M14 has no place, it does definately with no doupt.The CF is actually getting an AR10 version to fill our void in this area where longer harder hitting engagements are required. The need was for a gas gun effective for 300-500m as a bolt was to slow for some applications...and thay are already in the system.

The majority of troops interviewed that had actual close engagements and desired the greater stopping power of the 7.62 rd did not actually hit the threat in vital areas at first (extremities). New doctrine and more concentration on shot placement has become paramount during training during the last few years to help deal with that issue.

All are excellent weapons in battle (at the time the M1) and the M4 and M14 for the US and our good old C7/C8...hopfeully soon our own AR10.

Just tools in the tool box, apply as necassary. Oh and this is just my opinion.

PS...yes they are weapons
 
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USMC after actions on Project Metropolis et al defined the DMR and they asked for an AR10 type platform, which the CF now use. They and the US Army use lots of M14s because its available not because its so much better.

So much for us being behind the curve on technology or money for DM guns. We're doing just fine thx.
 
Morpheus32 said:
Try clearing a room with an M14....add an PEQ2/PAC 4 and try humping it. It is the right tool for specific applications however it is not a replacement for the AR series. I have to disagree with your generalization....
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I like more firepower than the gopher guns put out.Too many bad guys are taking too many hits from the M16 type rifles and still walk around to keep shoting at the good guys.
Any Marine that can't pack an M14 should look back at what their fathers did with less.
 
sf said:
What happen to their M24s? Have they ditched it?
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not as far as i know- the m24 is/was the SNIPERS weapon, used to make single shots on targets out to 1k yards- the m14 et al are DESIGNATED MARKSMAN WEAPONS- similar to the sniper,somewhere in between the average infantry and the sniper- ie the best shot in the unit( supposedly)
 
303carbine said:
I like more firepower than the gopher guns put out.Too many bad guys are taking too many hits from the M16 type rifles and still walk around to keep shoting at the good guys.
Any Marine that can't pack an M14 should look back at what their fathers did with less.
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OK. Glad you have it all figured out from reading gun mags and the internet. Lots of bad guys are dying from 5.56mm therapy. Maybe ask the guys who have been down range if this is even an issue. You will find it is not. I can say that from first hand experience. Platoons and companies fight with a mixture of weapons rather than just one type or configuration. Machine guns win battles.

Try humping ammo, armour, your weapon, radios....it adds up. Nice bit of emotional imagery there though. It all adds up. The marines are doing very well and have no problems with the M16s they are using. Again, first hand experience. Most of this is hype from gun mags and guys who can't let go of the 60s.

If you on your lonesome want to hump an M14....knock yourself out. But there is a big difference in what you use in battle and what you use out for a days shooting.

You might have some bias from your experiences....so am I biased on my operational experiences overseas.
 
diamondcutter13 said:
USMC after actions on Project Metropolis et al defined the DMR and they asked for an AR10 type platform, which the CF now use. They and the US Army use lots of M14s because its available not because its so much better.

So much for us being behind the curve on technology or money for DM guns. We're doing just fine thx.
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Well said. The M14 is being used since it is already in the system but is being replaced by the M110 SASS. We are using the AR10 in a similar manner but not as a designated marksman but rather by our snipers.
 
Notice how these threads always turn into a debate between people who have actually done the job with the tools in question and those who "know what's best" for the troops based on TV/magazines/chain emails...
 
The M110 is a SEMI-AUTO SNIPER SYSTEM.
It goes to snipers, and it was the only weapon to pass the SASS trials that the uS military had, be it M-14, AR10, etc

Some may call that a clue ;)
 
billybob said:
"Clearing rooms" what do you think grenades are for!
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You realize that some operations involve entire neighborhoods having to be cleared at times with no enemy being found? You can't 'frag' every room you come across.

Professionals are trained to discriminate legitimate targets from non combatants.
 
Morpheus32 said:
The M14 is being used since it is already in the system but is being replaced by the M110 SASS.
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The M14 is being used because it is already in the system, it's paid for,
it works, it costs thousands less than the M110 and above all... it works.

The US military can put $2K or $3K into modernizing and enhancing an old M14
and field an exceptional rifle for nearly $10K less than each new M110 SASS.
 
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I thought this thread wasn't supposed to turn into another which is better thread. :D

They all have their uses I'm just thankful I don't have to depend on a gun to save my life everyday so I will listen to the guys who do on this one.
 
Morpheus32 said:
OK. Glad you have it all figured out from reading gun mags and the internet. Lots of bad guys are dying from 5.56mm therapy. Maybe ask the guys who have been down range if this is even an issue. You will find it is not. I can say that from first hand experience. Platoons and companies fight with a mixture of weapons rather than just one type or configuration. Machine guns win battles.

Try humping ammo, armour, your weapon, radios....it adds up. Nice bit of emotional imagery there though. It all adds up. The marines are doing very well and have no problems with the M16s they are using. Again, first hand experience. Most of this is hype from gun mags and guys who can't let go of the 60s.

If you on your lonesome want to hump an M14....knock yourself out. But there is a big difference in what you use in battle and what you use out for a days shooting.

You might have some bias from your experiences....so am I biased on my operational experiences overseas.
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I prefer more range and firepower that the M-14 offers,of course the smaller sized rifle and rounds have some advantage close in.
 
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