The M1 carbine apparently got a bad reputation in the cold weather in the Korean War, especially at Chosin Reservoir, in November 1950, when the temperature plunged to -35 degrees below, reports of the action jamming , and poor performance of the .30 carbine round in frigid cold, was the lubricant being used on the carbine not suited for this cold of a temperature, and does ammo loose it potential in very cold temperatures, the M1 Garand was more reliable in this cold weather , thanks for all your input ,
M1 Carbine in Korean War
- Thread starter x westie
- Start date
Comparing the 30 carbine cartridge to the 30-06 Springfield cartridge of the M1 Garand is hardly realistic in any sense. The 30 carbine is more comparable to a pistol cartridge (.357 Mag) with a muzzle velocity of just under 2000 feet per second and the 30-06 cartridge is a full sized rifle cartridge with a muzzle velocity just over 2700 feet per second. The two rifles were designed with entirely different purposes in mind so any comparison between the two is really not a fair evaluation.
I think a lot of the bad reputation originated with S.L.A. Marshall's reports on small arms use in the Korean war. It seems his reporting and methods garner a lot of controversy. I guess all you can do is read them yourself and decide how valid they are. It is certainly interesting reading for a MILSURP buff.
Overall it seems the carbine was generally liked by a lot of soldiers, especially in WWII. The first hand accounts I've read tend to focus on how light and handy it was and not on its reliability. My own beat up and well used Inland carbine is certainly very "range reliable", but that isn't the best measure.
Overall it seems the carbine was generally liked by a lot of soldiers, especially in WWII. The first hand accounts I've read tend to focus on how light and handy it was and not on its reliability. My own beat up and well used Inland carbine is certainly very "range reliable", but that isn't the best measure.
Actually we are discussing the M1 carbine and its performance in the harsh cold Korean winter , nothing to do with Vietnam
I had two vet bring backs from Korean war. A Canadian Army artillery officer came home with his M1 Carbine (with folding stock) and a Rem Rand 1911. I gather his unit was supplied by Americans.
He came home on compassionate leave and his batman packed his guns in his kit. He was surprised to see them. he sold them to me.
He came home on compassionate leave and his batman packed his guns in his kit. He was surprised to see them. he sold them to me.
#1bcshooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- North Of The DMZ (US border)
Too bad it wasn't an M2 .
#1bcshooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- North Of The DMZ (US border)
I had one before the Gov 12x CA crap .
As anyone who knows the carbine knows the M1 & M2 receivers are identical other than the markings .
M1 receiver OK M2 receiver Bad . lol
As anyone who knows the carbine knows the M1 & M2 receivers are identical other than the markings .
M1 receiver OK M2 receiver Bad . lol
M1 was issued in place of Stem guns and the 1911 fought along sude the Browning with Canadian troops in Korea.
Ethiopan fought in the Korean War, using US leftovers. They toughed out the winters and their efforts were acclaimed.
Here is the caption for this photo:
"(Typical gear of the Kagnew battalion. Except for the then-new M26 hand grenades, their entire kit is WWII-era American equipment. Both officer and enlisted have M1 steel pot helmets. The officer has a M1911 (.45ACP) sidearm and a M12 ballistic vest. He is armed with a M1 carbine, with two 30-round “crook” magazines “jungle-styled” (duct taped together). The enlisted man has a M1 Garand rifle with the optional M2 flash hider cone fitted. They are wearing US Army OD green fatigues but with Ethiopian rank insignia.)"
View attachment 235636
Here is the caption for this photo:
"(Typical gear of the Kagnew battalion. Except for the then-new M26 hand grenades, their entire kit is WWII-era American equipment. Both officer and enlisted have M1 steel pot helmets. The officer has a M1911 (.45ACP) sidearm and a M12 ballistic vest. He is armed with a M1 carbine, with two 30-round “crook” magazines “jungle-styled” (duct taped together). The enlisted man has a M1 Garand rifle with the optional M2 flash hider cone fitted. They are wearing US Army OD green fatigues but with Ethiopian rank insignia.)"
View attachment 235636
My great uncle was a radio operator US army Korea he being not "normal" combat soldier was issued an M2 carbine (told me it was an IBM) (which I know did NOT make m2 but the us army did convert many to M2) anyways he never complained about it working he did complain about lack of range his M2 did not have the range of the Garand but again you cant compare the 2 rifles
fingers284
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Alberta Cowboy Ranges
I think lots of the complaints against the carbine originate from this reason. I have read reports that G.I.'s complained that the .30 carbine cartridge was so under-powered that it wouldn't penetrate the cold weather clothing the Chinese were wearing at "Chosen"...and at 400 yrds I might believe them but I can tell you that my carbine will penetrate a deer side-to-side at 100 yrds without fail, within their originally "planned for" operational usage they would be completely suitable for me to carry.
Most of the controversy surrounding the M1-M2 carbine happened during the Korean Conflict.
Ballistics tests on Korean era G.I. Ammo showed the rounds produced velocity figures that barely made spec, if at all. Introduce the extreme cold of the Korean Winter, which will cause a further reduction in velocity and pressure and you get a perfect storm for problems. Stories of Carbines having to be "Manhandled" for several rounds until the Carbine warmed up before functioning correctly were true according to field action reports submitted to SLA Marshal. The cold weather caught many of the American Troops off guard, and without a re-supply for proper winter gear, and cold weather lubricants, it was a bad time for awhile if you're primary weapon was the Carbine.
Ballistics tests on Korean era G.I. Ammo showed the rounds produced velocity figures that barely made spec, if at all. Introduce the extreme cold of the Korean Winter, which will cause a further reduction in velocity and pressure and you get a perfect storm for problems. Stories of Carbines having to be "Manhandled" for several rounds until the Carbine warmed up before functioning correctly were true according to field action reports submitted to SLA Marshal. The cold weather caught many of the American Troops off guard, and without a re-supply for proper winter gear, and cold weather lubricants, it was a bad time for awhile if you're primary weapon was the Carbine.
Was your carbine and ammo exposed to those temps for days on end under combat conditions before firing?
I learned in Churchill that the FNC1 with a much more powerful round could not reliably function under arctic conditions. Yeah, I know, Churchill is just above the 58th, but -30C on the tundra during a howling wind is still bloody cold. The slightest bit of oil on the breechblock carrier, gas piston or cocking handle and you had a club with a pistol grip.
I read what Peter Worthington, the newspaper columnist wrote when he was a platoon commander in Korea , he and his men went into a dugout , to warm up,the weapons had condensation on the bolts , later when they were out on patrol, they had a contact with a Chinese patrol, the Lee Enfields , and Brens were froze up, the only weapons firing was the sloppy fit Sten gun
Last edited:
