M1 Garand Springfield Armoury British Proofed January 1942

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Pocketfisherman

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Finished another project:

January 1942 SA
Mostly original with original correct parts down to the flush nut rear site
Uncut oprod
Minty correct original barrel

Rifle was in great shape except for the high gloss blue job applied by some knucklehead sometime in its past. The stock was a dogs breakfast so it had to go. Any way it's all good to go now.

(The white in the pic is just a little grease)

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Aesthetically it's a very nice rifle, you did a great job refinishing it but it's technically not "all original" ... it's mostly original.
 
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Sorry, when I say all original I was referring to the all original parts still with the rifle with the exception of the stock...

No cartouches on the replacement stock. I have always avoided that with previous builds, but it would it be fun to do, even taking it a step further and giving it the Lend Lease red stripe on the hand guard. Of course with the intention of a offering it as a restored representation and not passing it off as a fake original.
 
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Here is his brother. Another British Lend Lease proofed SA from November 1941 again all original parts and barrel. This one again had a damaged stock and the hand guards were missing.

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tadam05 said:
That unit sure does look sharp! Is there any cartouches stamped into those replacement stocks?
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When people start stamping gun stocks and metal with new made dies, it enters the realm of fakery, humped rifles and pimpshining.

We see enough of that BS on the US online auctions where a fake is trying to be passed off as an original for a high price. (IE: Garands, M1 Carbines, K98's,....)

And apparantly there is a guy in Canada doing the same with Enfields, etc, as he is busy "Stamping Away" on his forgeries.
 
Coyote Ugly said:
When people start stamping gun stocks and metal with new made dies, it enters the realm of fakery, humped rifles and pimpshining.

We see enough of that BS on the US online auctions where a fake is trying to be passed off as an original for a high price. (IE: Garands, M1 Carbines, K98's,....)

And apparantly there is a guy in Canada doing the same with Enfields, etc, as he is busy "Stamping Away" on his forgeries.
Click to expand...

I completely agree that these rifles should not be sold as true originals, but I haven't seen anyone actively trying to do that yet and don't see any need to be too concerned.

Considering the bright parkerizing and new boyds stocks I don't think these restored Garands many members are building would trick collectors. I doubt even freshly stamped cartouches could change that, unless someone was really inexperienced. They are simply aimed at a different market.

I could be wrong but I thought these restorations are aimed toward being really nice quality shooters, I'm a little confused at the choice to use an uncut op rod - Considering this detail cannot even be seen without taking the rifle apart, wouldn't it be better to use a cut op rod to avoid the risks of breaking while at the range?

-Steve
 
Steve1987 said:
I completely agree that these rifles should not be sold as true originals, but I haven't seen anyone actively trying to do that yet and don't see any need to be too concerned.

Considering the bright parkerizing and new boyds stocks I don't think these restored Garands many members are building would trick collectors. I doubt even freshly stamped cartouches could change that, unless someone was really inexperienced. They are simply aimed at a different market.

I could be wrong but I thought these restorations are aimed toward being really nice quality shooters, I'm a little confused at the choice to use an uncut op rod - Considering this detail cannot even be seen without taking the rifle apart, wouldn't it be better to use a cut op rod to avoid the risks of breaking while at the range?

-Steve
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It only has the Original Finish Once, and that goes for all Guns.

Lot's of people get burned by not knowing what they are buying and trusting the seller and not doing any research.

The fakery and pimpshining on "real and repro" rifles is quite active on the US auction sites and has been for years with all the repro dies being sold.

Just look at Mitchell's Mausers, Miltech, and some real untrustworthy sellers pimping their wares on Gunbroker. Those rifles have been sold for more than top dollar to a rookie at gunshows and on Gunbroker.

All forms of Pimping-It deceives the new collector who doesn't know what he is buying, other than he likes it because it looks new and pretty!
But it has zero collectable value and scores it's points as excitement and shooter grade for a good range gun. Much like a reblued or rechromed 1911, Luger or K98 with renumbered parts, say like a butt plate, or a bolt assembly. But it lures the buyers in like a fly to a steaming pile of sh/t.

Fake serial numbers, Fake SS Runes, Fake Single Rune,.....Fake GAW/SA dies...just follow the money.

And you see it quite a bit on original rifles where someone dicks with it trying to "enhance it" and make an extra buck but they usually screw up with errors and ruin a good rifle.


http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odk...573.m570.l1313&_nkw=cartouche+garand&_sacat=0

http://www.trfindley.com/pgsnstmpsm1.html

As always, Buyer Beware.
 
I agree with the comments regarding fakery and "improving" historical pieces. I only restore or repair those items in need of help in the first place. For example every component on the 1942 was highly polished blued and the stock had been sporterized, but all of the original correct parts were still there. In my opinion this rifle needed to be restored. The result is a newly stocked rifle with it's original correct parts with the correct metal finish.

The 1941 pictured above was a similar but worse story, where bubba had got to the receiver and tried to make it a scoped rifle. The receiver was again repaired, and the original parts to the rifle (that had somehow survived and stayed with the rifle during all the shady gunsmithing) were refinished and put back to correct configuration with a new stock added.

I of course would never dream of doing this to a rifle that was in good original condition to begin with...

I recently built another 1941 SA from a group of rusted Garand barreled actions. I sent it to Nick at Vulcan to repair the pitting and rust, then built the 1941 receiver with 1952 rebuild stamp into a mint .308 shooter for fun at the range. Again in my book it was righteous to undertake the project because it was a scrap heap receiver otherwise.
 
Agreed Steve,

If I was to shoot any of these, I would swap out the oprod to a postwar that I had kicking around keeping the uncut version safe. This is good advice for anyone with an early Garand with an unrelieved oprod. Post war or Italian oprods are still plentiful so better to use those if you plan to shoot it a lot.

Steve1987 said:
I completely agree that these rifles should not be sold as true originals, but I haven't seen anyone actively trying to do that yet and don't see any need to be too concerned.

Considering the bright parkerizing and new boyds stocks I don't think these restored Garands many members are building would trick collectors. I doubt even freshly stamped cartouches could change that, unless someone was really inexperienced. They are simply aimed at a different market.

I could be wrong but I thought these restorations are aimed toward being really nice quality shooters, I'm a little confused at the choice to use an uncut op rod - Considering this detail cannot even be seen without taking the rifle apart, wouldn't it be better to use a cut op rod to avoid the risks of breaking while at the range?

-Steve
Click to expand...
 
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Pocketfisherman said:
Agreed Steve,

If I was to shoot any of these, I would swap out the oprod to a postwar that I had kicking around keeping the uncut version safe. This is good advice for anyone with an early Garand with an unrelieved oprod. Post war or Italian oprods are still plentiful so better to use those if you plan to shoot it a lot.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the heads up on uncut op rods.
 
Pocketfisherman said:
No cartouches on the replacement stock. I have always avoided that with previous builds, but it would it be fun to do...Of course with the intention of a offering it as a restored representation and not passing it off as a fake original.
Click to expand...

I'm still sitting on the fence on this one. I have a replacement stock for my '43 SA so as to not damage the original stock which still has its cartouches well showing.

I thought about sending the replacement stock stateside to a business that offered adding original cartouches. The owner apparently acquired the actual sets of dies and stamps that were used at the Armory. However I know this practice is very frowned upon on U.S. Garand forums and in threads on Milsurp.com.

Great restorations Pocketfisherman!
 
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