Hello all I am new to Canadian gun nuts and was wondering if anyone has done a tactical rifle course or a cqb course or match with a norinco m14? I understand is has some shortcomings but I really like the rifle. I was just wondering if it was a good idea to try it with the m14 or I would get more out of the course with an AR?
M14 in tactical rifle or CQB
- Thread starter AGrant580
- Start date
- Location
- Richmond, BC
Do they have a heavy metal class in Tac Rifle or CQB? If they do, why not give it a try 
I have used the Norc in CQB several times.
CQB uses a lot of rifle ammo. The Ontario version is about 200 per session, I think. Expensive compared to 5.56 in an AR.
CQB requires some rapid fire. The M14 has a lot more recoil and is more difficult to get back on target for an aimed shot.
CQB requires a lot of mag changes against the clock. AR is easy to change mags quickly. The M14 requires a rocking motion to load the mag. Somewhat slower.
The AR is the single best platform for CQB. You can use an M14. If you have one, use it, to get more familiar and proficient with it, but do so knowing you are giving up being competitive.
CQB uses a lot of rifle ammo. The Ontario version is about 200 per session, I think. Expensive compared to 5.56 in an AR.
CQB requires some rapid fire. The M14 has a lot more recoil and is more difficult to get back on target for an aimed shot.
CQB requires a lot of mag changes against the clock. AR is easy to change mags quickly. The M14 requires a rocking motion to load the mag. Somewhat slower.
The AR is the single best platform for CQB. You can use an M14. If you have one, use it, to get more familiar and proficient with it, but do so knowing you are giving up being competitive.
You can use the AR, or you can further challenge yourself by using the M14.
I have a new Blackfeather RS customer in California that runs heavy metal 3-gun with a basic M1A.
He will be upgrading his stock with the BF-RS and the new MBSA butt stock adapter... I'll share his comments & videos later this year.
I have a new Blackfeather RS customer in California that runs heavy metal 3-gun with a basic M1A.
He will be upgrading his stock with the BF-RS and the new MBSA butt stock adapter... I'll share his comments & videos later this year.
Phat Eagle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley, BC
My sentiments exactly... That said, my FIL uses his Garand when he comes out and does quite well for a 70 year old man with a 70 year old rifle!
ThatM305Guy
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- North Texas
Is there such thing as just a rifle course? Or maybe a rifle and shotgun course? I dont have my restricted, and not too keen on the idea of getting it.
I've done CQB and a season of Service rifle with the M14 clone. I very much like the M14 platform.
M14 is doable but will never be as fast as an AR for CQB. For mag changes you do what I have heard called an Israeli mag change where you use the new mag in your left hand to swipe down at the mag release and into the empty mag in the well knocking it clear then insert the new mag. An extended bolt release speeds things up cuz then you grab the rifle by the mag with your left hand and use the thumb on the bolt release dropping the bolt like you would on an AR.
The M14 is heavier and needs more mags for Service Rifle matches due to the limit of 5 rounds.The ammo is also heavier to lug all day. It is more expensive to feed.
I will say to try the matches with the M14. That way when you go to an AR you will really appreciate the AR.
M14 is doable but will never be as fast as an AR for CQB. For mag changes you do what I have heard called an Israeli mag change where you use the new mag in your left hand to swipe down at the mag release and into the empty mag in the well knocking it clear then insert the new mag. An extended bolt release speeds things up cuz then you grab the rifle by the mag with your left hand and use the thumb on the bolt release dropping the bolt like you would on an AR.
The M14 is heavier and needs more mags for Service Rifle matches due to the limit of 5 rounds.The ammo is also heavier to lug all day. It is more expensive to feed.
I will say to try the matches with the M14. That way when you go to an AR you will really appreciate the AR.
If you want to shoot CQB and don't have/want a pistol, just arrange with someone to bring an extras pistol and holster. You bring the ammo.
Warning. You will have so much fun you will buy your on pistol.
notsorichguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- The city that rhymes with fun
I've done tactical style shoots with a M-14. I used a forward mounted T-1 on an ultimak rail and reloaded with stripper clips.....
Mag changes were not a problem, quicker than some fellas with ARs....
I did not finish in the top 5.... Nuff said!
Would be easier/cheaper with an AR....
Cheers!
Mag changes were not a problem, quicker than some fellas with ARs....
I did not finish in the top 5.... Nuff said!
Would be easier/cheaper with an AR....
Cheers!
I would just like to try it out with with my m14 then think about buying an AR and where have you done CQB matches I am from wasaga I seen Borden has some but is there other ranges that put on matches in Ontario?
And what ammo would you suggest? I have heard that some ranges don't allow or don't recommend using norinco or other bulk/surplus ammo...
The ORA runs CQB matches which were run at Borden. Recent insurance issues have made it necessary to buy an ORA membership to even try a match.
If you have an interest, PM dink27 on these forums. He coordinates these matches. They can be lots of fun and I hope that the insurance issue can be worked out.
If you have an interest, PM dink27 on these forums. He coordinates these matches. They can be lots of fun and I hope that the insurance issue can be worked out.
Done a few of these courses, each time with a different rifle. My 18" m305 dressed in an Archangle stock and a couple of A1A mags was the clumsiest of the rifles. It was fun but I do not think I got as much as I could out of the course because I was too distracted by the size and weight of my rifle. These courses seems to me to be designed around the AR platform. Problems with my ARs is that they are restricted and unlike my m305, I can not legally benifit from additional training on private land/private range.
I have recently gotten into bull pups and after one course, I found the ergonomics of the Tavor and Type 97 awkward and un natural. I think I prefer the heavier and larger m305 over either of these bull pups but a bit more training might change my mine. And now entre the dark horse... PCCs. Ran a couple of CQB courses with my son's restricted cx4 and all I could say is, wow! I paired it up with his 92fs and several Mec Gar 96 Mags and for me this is perfection. The fact that the Mec Gar legally holds 15, it shares the same mags as the 92fs, it is the lightest of the platforms mentioned, ammo is relitively inexpensive, over penitration is not as bad as a .308 and most pcc such as the cx4 also comes in a non restricted verson, I say give PCC a thought for CQB.
The above post is the bottom line. I had the pleasure of attending a service rifle competition introduction, and I was the only non-AR platform shooter. The disadvantage of using the M14 / 305 platform was noticeable. At CQB it would only be further polarized.
I have two M305's, all tricked up as I like, and for CQB I would personally steer completely clear of the M14 platform. And I am a really big fan of it too. The speed of follow up shots are slow, tricky to control (and that's with aluminium chassis / tuned ammo + compensator). I am also big enough to soak up the recoil and lug one around.
Go AR and compete with confidence. Using an M14 would be like training for 100 metres sprint with a weight lifter belt. Not the best move to excel at or enjoy a sport.
Candocad.
(Although if you like shooting steel at 100-500m with an affordable and highly tuneable 308 cal then the M14 is right up there. (But so is an AR with a 308 upper?) For me, it was the unrestricted status that made the M14 / 305 work for me. I am not interested in shooting 5 rounds down the club, I love the bush.
