M14 not always stripping the rounds out of mag

Due diligence first

cbabes said:
The other thing I just noticed is the gas piston on the one with the issue is not moving easily when I tilt the barrel. It definitely needs to be cleaned!
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cbabes, I would have hoped that before you came on this forum asking for help with your problem, you would have preformed all the basic tests first. There are plenty of stickies telling you how to check, clean, lube, and grease the M-14. Now you tell us you probably needed more lube or needed to clean things better. Please do your research first and plan on attending a clinic soon. Your rifle might be perfectly fine. But how would you know if you just go online rather than doing your homework first ?
 
MustangFrank said:
cbabes, I would have hoped that before you came on this forum asking for help with your problem, you would have preformed all the basic tests first. There are plenty of stickies telling you how to check, clean, lube, and grease the M-14. Now you tell us you probably needed more lube or needed to clean things better. Please do your research first and plan on attending a clinic soon. Your rifle might be perfectly fine. But how would you know if you just go online rather than doing your homework first ?
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You got me there. I did that with my new one and should have did it with the traded one. I had a reason to believe she was good to go though but that's no excuse.
 
cbabes said:
You got me there. I did that with my new one and should have did it with the traded one. I had a reason to believe she was good to go though but that's no excuse.
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Hey no worries, you may have noticed there are a lot of armchair quarterbacks who love to tell people how to fix a problem without even thinking about what they are saying. I was very intimidated by the M-14 when I first got it and now I think it is one of the simplest designs there ever was. I'm realy getting into this platform thanks to people like SATAIN and M-14 DOCTOR. Keep up all the good work boys. Now can we please see some measurements of the gas port in the barrel. Only takes a few minutes to strip it down to that point. Please.....
 
Gas port in the barrel of one of mine is 0.078". to get that drill bit in, it had to be spun to remove some carbon and it was a tight fit. A 0.081 will not go.
 
I know you said it can't be the mag, but humour me for a second. If your mag/mags are the older ones with the long metal follower which runs down in the middle of the spring/mag to the bottom, strip the mag and check to see that the follower/pinning piece is not bent or at an odd angle.
I hade the exact same problem.
What was happening with mine was the piece was bent at a wierd angle AND slightly curved. So when I put rounds into the magazine, the piece would jam up between the spring and the wall of the magazine preventing the follower from pushing the rounds into the top of the mag. Not all the time but randomly which caused it to not pick rounds up into the chamber.
I straightened it with a pair of pliers and have not had a single problem since.
Just a thought on something to check if you haven't already stripped them yet to verify.
 
Travis Bickle said:
I know you said it can't be the mag, but humour me for a second. If your mag/mags are the older ones with the long metal follower which runs down in the middle of the spring/mag to the bottom, strip the mag and check to see that the follower/pinning piece is not bent or at an odd angle.
I hade the exact same problem.
What was happening with mine was the piece was bent at a wierd angle AND slightly curved. So when I put rounds into the magazine, the piece would jam up between the spring and the wall of the magazine preventing the follower from pushing the rounds into the top of the mag. Not all the time but randomly.
I straightened it with a pair of pliers and have not had a single problem since.
Just a thought on something to check if you haven't already.
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Thanks. I am going tomorrow to shoot them both again. If the proper cleaning and lubing didn't work I will come back to this but the mags do work fine in the new shorty. I will also swap parts at the range if the one is still not stripping.
 
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cbabes said:
Thanks. I am going tomorrow to shoot them both again. If the proper cleaning and lubing didn't work I will come back to this but the mags do work fine in the new shorty. I will also swap parts at the range if the one is still not stripping.
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Just "Remeber" you will hear an autoable "CLICK" noise when the magazine is properly seated. Also please ensure your op-rod guide retainer pin is in the closed position before atteching the barreled action to the rifle stock. These are the simple things to check for. Along with the lining up of the gas port whole with the barrel & making sure that the gas system has been turned in the on position. The enlagering of 1's gas vent whole should be done as a last resort after ensuring that all other "Uncle Mao" issues have been dealt with.
Here is a youtube vid on the of an M14 to help you make sure that everything is done right and that you will understand the mechanic's of this rifle platform.
[youtube]eUMV1E8iiC0[/youtube]
[youtube]svJ-j9v_5pI[/youtube]
[youtube]XuX_xPPfjBk[/youtube]
 
:( I tried American Eagle, S&B, Core Lokt, and Nosler Balistic Silvertip. All these stripped fine with the bad M14. Again the Norinco stuff wouldn't grab at least one round every mag this time.

My CanAm shorty had zero issues with the Norinco ammo. I had to leave so never got a chance to change parts between the two M14s.

I don't know the round count but I shot a lot of rounds today. Next step will be exchanging springs.

Cleaning and lubing wasn't the issue.
 
Clarification

cbabes said:
:( I tried American Eagle, S&B, Core Lokt, and Nosler Balistic Silvertip. All these stripped fine with the bad M14. Again the Norinco stuff wouldn't grab at least one round every mag this time.

My CanAm shorty had zero issues with the Norinco ammo. I had to leave so never got a chance to change parts between the two M14s.

I don't know the round count but I shot a lot of rounds today. Next step will be exchanging springs.

Cleaning and lubing wasn't the issue.
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Just to be clear. All ammo works fine in the modified Shorty except the Norinco ammo ? Sounds like the gun is working o.k. Humour me now and measure the size of the gas port in the barrel of both guns. Please. I would like to know if Norinco changed the size for the factory shorties. Might destroy my theory though. Can you Crony the different ammo ?
 
Ammo ?

cbabes said:
Depends as if o.k. means I get frustrated as hell shooting Norinco ammo out of one M14 while it's a pleasure using the same ammo and mags in the other M14. :)
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It would be nice to solve the mystery of the Norinco ammo. Someone has to Crony the Norc stuff and pull a few bullets to mike them. That might answer the low pressure question....or not. There seems to be plenty of gas volume available with the longer barrels even with the Norc ammo. Makes sense if the Norc ammo is a little on the light side.
 
I had a chance to do a little more testing and I think Norc ammo is a tad short of oomph.
I had some problems with stripping a round but a gas cleaning seemed to have solved that.
Only a couple of mags through.

Yesterday it began again after a couple more mags, just the odd time. Fired Federal and MFS without a hitch. Then back to the Norc and it was short stroking every now and then.
 
MustangFrank said:
It would be nice to solve the mystery of the Norinco ammo. Someone has to Crony the Norc stuff and pull a few bullets to mike them. That might answer the low pressure question....or not. There seems to be plenty of gas volume available with the longer barrels even with the Norc ammo. Makes sense if the Norc ammo is a little on the light side.
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Oct 25/08 5C M305

Norc 308 2672'/s 2705'/s
SA 308 2649'/s 2697'/s

May 02/09 10C M305

Norc 308 2785'/s
SA 308 2723'/s
 
gnmontey said:
Oct 25/08 5C M305

Norc 308 2672'/s 2705'/s
SA 308 2649'/s 2697'/s

May 02/09 10C M305

Norc 308 2785'/s
SA 308 2723'/s
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Thanks. I will crony some of my ammo for a comparison. Does this mean you fired ammo out of a Norc, and a Springfield Armory rifle? What does the 5C and 10C stand for. I know I will feel stupid later.
 
Satain said:
Just "Remeber" you will hear an autoable "CLICK" noise when the magazine is properly seated. Also please ensure your op-rod guide retainer pin is in the closed position before atteching the barreled action to the rifle stock. These are the simple things to check for. Along with the lining up of the gas port whole with the barrel & making sure that the gas system has been turned in the on position. The enlagering of 1's gas vent whole should be done as a last resort after ensuring that all other "Uncle Mao" issues have been dealt with.
Here is a youtube vid on the of an M14 to help you make sure that everything is done right and that you will understand the mechanic's of this rifle platform.
[youtube]eUMV1E8iiC0[/youtube]
[youtube]svJ-j9v_5pI[/youtube]
[youtube]XuX_xPPfjBk[/youtube]
Click to expand...


Thanks! Never saw these vids on my iPhone.
 
cbabes said:
Can someone who has a shorty from CanAm and a regular M14 compare the OP rod springs to see is there is a difference in length?

TIA
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My M14 with the longer spring is in a USGI fiberglass stock. I was just informed that the USGI OP rod spring is half an inch longer than the Norinco. That is probably what I have in that M14 a USGI spring.
 
MustangFrank said:
Thanks. I will crony some of my ammo for a comparison. Does this mean you fired ammo out of a Norc, and a Springfield Armory rifle? What does the 5C and 10C stand for. I know I will feel stupid later.
Click to expand...

10C = Temperature
M305 = rifle
Norc 308 = Norc 7.62X51 ball ammo
SA 308 = South African 7.62X51 ball ammo
 
Humour me and take the trigger group from the canam shorty and try it in the chop mod rifle. Then try your norc ammo. Be sure to verify safety checks first though to be sure there is no hammer follow.

Question: when it fails to feed, it is NOT grabbing the round at all?
If so this means the bolt is not going back far enough. You can rule out the spring right off the bat.
MANY things could be causing this that are not related to the ammo being underpowered.
Norinco 147gr FMJ has and will continue to be one of my all around favorites for use in these rifles.
 
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