maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Did the grumpy old guy with the apron behind the counter make you pay by the 100gr too?
M14 pounds Troy vs Sage EBR vs stock
- Thread starter sani0308
- Start date
Did the grumpy old guy with the apron behind the counter make you pay by the 100gr too?
maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
My objection to these rails is self-preservation. Anyone who has carried a service rifle or automatic weapon in the field knows that there are sharp edges and abrasion surfaces that end up nibbling on bare skin. In and out of vehicles. Stand up, lie down, change hands. The M14 chassis' have bite points everywhere, especially the fashionable equipment rails right where I want to put my left hand. (Why are sporting rifle stocks so smooth?)
I am not knocking the experimenters for trying to improve a bedding system descended from John C. Garand's solution to a design problem of the 1930's, just I am not convinced.
I found the TROY Generation 2 to be less accurate than the SAGE/AKM design due to the loose front ferrule system of the TROY. It was a bad move to change the original locking system. But even so , the SAGE/AKM op rod guide locking and free float barrel design is superior to TROY Generation 1.
The JAE second generation is good as it improved on the original M14 design philosophy - it gives you superior receiver bedding with superior front ferrule lip pressure , superior to a full match conditioned standard M14 because of no bedding wear,and adjustable ferrule lip pressure.
Agreed!
The TROY is still a good choice for the SOCOM 16, but the SAGE and AKM stocks are best for M14s with 18" and 22" barrels.
You forgot
Leaving a SAGE out in the sun in the sand pit -
Quite a surprise when you pick it up without gloves !
As far as sharp edges - those are mostly the picatinny rails - I cover mine with rubber rail fillers - no sharp edges
My favorite are the LARUE tactical index clips .
Leaving a SAGE out in the sun in the sand pit -
Quite a surprise when you pick it up without gloves !
As far as sharp edges - those are mostly the picatinny rails - I cover mine with rubber rail fillers - no sharp edges
My favorite are the LARUE tactical index clips .
Though I am in the pre-production stage of an all new Canadian M14 aluminum chassis stock, I will still choose the M14Doctor, fiberglass M14S-CQB.
Like Vltor, I use quality USGI fiberglass as the base. Where the similarity ends is the grip/buttstock mount. I utilize 7075 T6 aluminum and have my adaptors made by a company who manufactured AR15 receivers.
I would put my stoocks up against the Vltor any day of the week.
Nothing beats a quality fiberglass stock made ridgid by a full bottom rail. Lighter, faster and ergonomically superior.
But... If I had to choose an aluminum stock from what is currently availlable it would be a Sage EBR with stripper clip rail accesssory.
Like Vltor, I use quality USGI fiberglass as the base. Where the similarity ends is the grip/buttstock mount. I utilize 7075 T6 aluminum and have my adaptors made by a company who manufactured AR15 receivers.
I would put my stoocks up against the Vltor any day of the week.
Nothing beats a quality fiberglass stock made ridgid by a full bottom rail. Lighter, faster and ergonomically superior.
But... If I had to choose an aluminum stock from what is currently availlable it would be a Sage EBR with stripper clip rail accesssory.
300Spartans
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Canada of course
I am looking forward to the production of your new Canadian-made stock. I just hope it's affordable for my budget.
I am also involved in a couple of fancy new uberrailed M14 ALLOY stock projects,
BUT,
my personal favorite M14 stock is still the good old USGI Fiberglass stock front,
with a side folding skeleton butt and pistol grip.
Just like the one I posted the DIY instructions for in the stickies at the top of the battle rifle section.
No matter how good these fancy new alloy designs look,
the BALANCE and FEEL that I personally prefer on my 14 shorties,
is best achieved with my K.I.S.S. GI side folder.
Of course,
YPMMV
[;{)
LAZ 1
BUT,
my personal favorite M14 stock is still the good old USGI Fiberglass stock front,
with a side folding skeleton butt and pistol grip.
Just like the one I posted the DIY instructions for in the stickies at the top of the battle rifle section.
No matter how good these fancy new alloy designs look,
the BALANCE and FEEL that I personally prefer on my 14 shorties,
is best achieved with my K.I.S.S. GI side folder.
Of course,
YPMMV
[;{)
LAZ 1
with an M14 SHORTY,
accuracy is not as important as good ergonomics, fast handling, and great balance.
With an M14 TARGET build, while it is possible, with luck, skill, and lots of money, to achieve an M14 that is "ALMOST as accurate as any cheap, run of the mill .308 bolt action hunting rifle" , this is NOT a cost effective solution to achieving an ACCURATE rifle.
You can buy a TIKKA, or SAVAGE, or REMINGTON bolt action rifle, to shoot along side your M14, and any of these bolt action rifles will be more CONSISTENTLY accurate than any M14 ever built, and you will have money left over, for what it costs to turn your M14 into a Mediocre "target" rifle.
However, for those who for some reason prefer to spend money on tarting up their M14 BATTLE RIFLE into some semblance of a Target rifle, optimum accuracy with an M14 can THEORETICALLY be best achieved with some of the new alloy/composite designs. Improved receiver to stock tension through things like the JAE trigger guard screws are one way.
Improved barrel rigidity or achieving more consistent barrel harmonics through a free floated op rod guide and forearm adjustable tensioning, are other ways.
But realistically, many MOA M14s have been built with the good old techniques.
For those of you who won't heed my advice on trying to build an M14 into an "ACCURATE RIFLE".... I have a spare Kreiger SS 22" target barrel available, along with the use of the pull through .308 reamer.
And NO, I don't want to do this little project for you.
[;{)
LAZ 1
accuracy is not as important as good ergonomics, fast handling, and great balance.
With an M14 TARGET build, while it is possible, with luck, skill, and lots of money, to achieve an M14 that is "ALMOST as accurate as any cheap, run of the mill .308 bolt action hunting rifle" , this is NOT a cost effective solution to achieving an ACCURATE rifle.
You can buy a TIKKA, or SAVAGE, or REMINGTON bolt action rifle, to shoot along side your M14, and any of these bolt action rifles will be more CONSISTENTLY accurate than any M14 ever built, and you will have money left over, for what it costs to turn your M14 into a Mediocre "target" rifle.
However, for those who for some reason prefer to spend money on tarting up their M14 BATTLE RIFLE into some semblance of a Target rifle, optimum accuracy with an M14 can THEORETICALLY be best achieved with some of the new alloy/composite designs. Improved receiver to stock tension through things like the JAE trigger guard screws are one way.
Improved barrel rigidity or achieving more consistent barrel harmonics through a free floated op rod guide and forearm adjustable tensioning, are other ways.
But realistically, many MOA M14s have been built with the good old techniques.
For those of you who won't heed my advice on trying to build an M14 into an "ACCURATE RIFLE".... I have a spare Kreiger SS 22" target barrel available, along with the use of the pull through .308 reamer.
And NO, I don't want to do this little project for you.
[;{)
LAZ 1
Putting an M14 BATTLE RIFLE in a tarted up USGI synthetic stock that has a side folding skeleton
butt stock and pistol grip makes no practical sense to me, but it's your money... do as you please.
I much prefer the simple, robust SAGE M14ALCS/CV stock or a tight fitting USGI synthetic with RRM and it's unaltered butt stock.
butt stock and pistol grip makes no practical sense to me, but it's your money... do as you please.
I much prefer the simple, robust SAGE M14ALCS/CV stock or a tight fitting USGI synthetic with RRM and it's unaltered butt stock.
Ketchup
You say tomahto
I say tomayto
They both make ketchup.
The best ketchup is made with metal receiver bedding, oprod guide locked to a non flexing stock, and adjustable front barrel tensioning - (ferrule lip plate or barrel)
YUM !
You say tomahto
I say tomayto
They both make ketchup.
The best ketchup is made with metal receiver bedding, oprod guide locked to a non flexing stock, and adjustable front barrel tensioning - (ferrule lip plate or barrel)
YUM !
