Interested in this info as well. I was under the impression that the parts in and of themselves were OK to own as long as they are not installed to actually make a full auto firearm. Looking for a trustworthy link, not just someones say so.
M16 Selector on Semi AR15
- Thread starter t_102
- Start date
Interested in this info as well. I was under the impression that the parts in and of themselves were OK to own as long as they are not installed to actually make a full auto firearm. Looking for a trustworthy link, not just someones say so.
They have all the fun parts, auto sears, burst cams and burst triggers. I'm tempted to order all of the stuff just cause I know a few people who would have a stroke if I told them I have all the evil killing machine parts.
IMPORTANT!!!! Just remember, any full auto specific part can get you in trouble if you encounter a dink of a law enforcement officer. I was bringing an AR15 collapsing stock back from the US. I added it to my written list of declared items (we were driving back). I encountered an absolute dink of a CBSA officer who decided that it was not acceptable to declare it in writing as that was only acceptable at an airport - since I did not declare it verbally, he decided it was a prohibited part (his "logic" was that it was a part for a restricted weapon; since I "did not" declare it, that made it a prohibited item). This was, and is, completely incorrect. however, I ended up detained, handcuffed and in a jail cell for 5 hours. My wife was also unlawfully detained for 5 hours. At the end of the day, after $1500 and one lawyer and 3 months, I got my parts back with no charges etc. We are now at 1 year later and we are involved in an appeal, a complaint that no one at CBSA will accept, and a pending lawsuit.
My point is that, technically, any part specific to a fully automatic weapon is illegal. This includes an M16 bolt carrier. I know these are sold in Canada, however, if you encounter a f*&khead of a dink, you will be in for a wild ride.
Just my 2 cents worth.
PS If anyone knows of a good civil lawyer in Calgary, please let me know.
My point is that, technically, any part specific to a fully automatic weapon is illegal. This includes an M16 bolt carrier. I know these are sold in Canada, however, if you encounter a f*&khead of a dink, you will be in for a wild ride.
Just my 2 cents worth.
PS If anyone knows of a good civil lawyer in Calgary, please let me know.
I just looked myself and could not find it. I do, however, remember reading it in what I thought was the list of prohibited weapons/devices. I thought it was in the same section as suppressor and bulpup stocks but I don't see it there now...
I am 100% sure that AR15 auto sears were specifically noted as prohibited devices in SOME legal document at some point, at least in the past.
I'm going to give it a shot once they re-stock on all the parts. Minus the auto sear though. I feel like having everything and the auto sear might be pushing it. They use M16 parts in commercial AR's. The M16 fire control parts are basically the same as AR15 parts except with little cutouts, notches and pieces of metal sticking out in certain spots.
As long as you don't have the actual full auto sear then I say you're in the clear, the gun still won't go full auto even if you rotate the selector in the third spot. Many other guns that are not AR15's have all the fire control parts of their select fire counterparts the only difference being the absence of the auto sear.
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How do you figure that? All those USGI parts from M14's are illegal then? A collapsible stock is not specific to a FA M16. AR15 FA bolt carriers are also sold freely in the US.
Don't get me started about customs (CBSA) "officers"....
PART 4
PROHIBITED DEVICES
Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 9
1. Any electrical or mechanical device that is designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi-automatic firearm for the purpose of causing the firearm to discharge cartridges in rapid succession.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/sor-98-462/page-2.html#docCont
“prohibited device” means
(a) any component or part of a weapon, or any accessory for use with a weapon, that is prescribed to be a prohibited device,
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C%2D46/page-42.html#h-38
99. (1) Every person commits an offence who
(a) manufactures or transfers, whether or not for consideration, or
(b) offers to do anything referred to in paragraph (a) in respect of
a firearm, a prohibited weapon, a restricted weapon, a prohibited device, any ammunition or any prohibited ammunition knowing that the person is not authorized to do so under the Firearms Act or any other Act of Parliament or any regulations made under any Act of Parliament.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C%2D46/page-48.html#docCont
PROHIBITED DEVICES
Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 9
1. Any electrical or mechanical device that is designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi-automatic firearm for the purpose of causing the firearm to discharge cartridges in rapid succession.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/sor-98-462/page-2.html#docCont
“prohibited device” means
(a) any component or part of a weapon, or any accessory for use with a weapon, that is prescribed to be a prohibited device,
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C%2D46/page-42.html#h-38
99. (1) Every person commits an offence who
(a) manufactures or transfers, whether or not for consideration, or
(b) offers to do anything referred to in paragraph (a) in respect of
a firearm, a prohibited weapon, a restricted weapon, a prohibited device, any ammunition or any prohibited ammunition knowing that the person is not authorized to do so under the Firearms Act or any other Act of Parliament or any regulations made under any Act of Parliament.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C%2D46/page-48.html#docCont
When it makes the gun go bang more then once with one pull of the trigger. Which even with full M16 fire control parts it wont.
1. Any electrical or mechanical device that is designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi-automatic firearm for the purpose of causing the firearm to discharge cartridges in rapid succession.
Under Canadian law that does not matter. An M16 trigger mechanism - the automatic sear or the selector are "designed" to make a semi-auto mechanism fire automatic. Whether you agree with the law or not does not matter. We have all seen how broadly the firearms laws are interpreted. DIAS and even the auto sear are illegal to possess.
If it is designed for an automatic mechanism it is a prohibited device. If you possess or manufacture a prohibited device you get to go to jail. Don't pass go, don't keep your guns.
So how do I explain the M16 carrier in my Colt AR? The M16 carriers in various other manufactures (probably around 60% +) ARs?
The M16 bolt carrier has about a 2" closed section at the rear that actually trips the auto sear in full-auto fire. Semi-auto versions have either a reduced closed bottom section, or a completely open bottom.
The M16 bolt carrier is "designed" for all intents and purposes for full auto fire and almost every manufacture of milspec type AR's uses one.
In the U.S. they can use a certain number of "full auto parts" before it becomes "Constructive Intent", we don't have these laws.
You are getting dangerously close to discussing illegal activities.
Not sure why you insist on arguing this when the illegality of those parts has been static for years. You will not convince me, the SFSS or any importer to try to get you these parts.
The BCG is in the upper. The upper is not the firearm, and under our current laws modification is not necessary. The barrel was designed for an automatic rifle and is also unmodified. But keep pointing it out and you just might get that changed for us.
The laws in the US are irrelevant. The defence of "americans do it" is not yet valid in our court system.
The question at hand is are the automatic mechanism parts illegal? The auto sear is. The criminal code is quite clear and it is a prohibited device.
An auto disconnect is. The selector is - designed to enable automatic fire. The selector and an unmodified disconnect will fire bursts. Doesn't matter if you actually fire them or not.
Most AR-15s use an M16 trigger any way. There is no different feel. The surfaces in an auto and semi auto that affect trigger feel are identical. The disconnect spring has more effect on trigger pull than any of the other components. The M16A2 burst mechanism is different, not in a good way, and prohib.
There is no good reason to have any of these parts and - once again - we have all seen how the courts and the RCMP interpret the CC.
Not sure why you insist on arguing this when the illegality of those parts has been static for years. You will not convince me, the SFSS or any importer to try to get you these parts.
The BCG is in the upper. The upper is not the firearm, and under our current laws modification is not necessary. The barrel was designed for an automatic rifle and is also unmodified. But keep pointing it out and you just might get that changed for us.
The laws in the US are irrelevant. The defence of "americans do it" is not yet valid in our court system.
The question at hand is are the automatic mechanism parts illegal? The auto sear is. The criminal code is quite clear and it is a prohibited device.
An auto disconnect is. The selector is - designed to enable automatic fire. The selector and an unmodified disconnect will fire bursts. Doesn't matter if you actually fire them or not.
Most AR-15s use an M16 trigger any way. There is no different feel. The surfaces in an auto and semi auto that affect trigger feel are identical. The disconnect spring has more effect on trigger pull than any of the other components. The M16A2 burst mechanism is different, not in a good way, and prohib.
There is no good reason to have any of these parts and - once again - we have all seen how the courts and the RCMP interpret the CC.
Don't take this the wrong way.
Only reason I'm pushing is because I wanna get down to it and actually find out what is and isn't illegal. I'm not advocating for anything but I'm not contempt with status quo.
I'm confused myself because I've seen dewats of the real deal with basically all the fire control components. Not once but many times. So the owner would be in possession of prohibited device would he not? The best I've seen is that there are mechanical blowback airsoft guns with M16 parts made of plastic because the way it works is the same.
Not trying to instigate or promote doing anything illegal. It seems that thus far the law is extremely vague and open to interpretation and that it could almost be argued either way.
Anyway I'm going to stop here because it isn't the first time a mod has misinterpreted what I was saying and come down hard on me for it.
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Our laws are dumb. Not like, "a little silly here and there." They are full-on ridiculous.
Actually....
"Prohibited device" is not the same as a" Prohibited Firearm".
The criminal codes clearly define "Prohibited Device", "prohibited firearms" and "prohibit weapon" differently. They mean different things.
This is a prohibited device
What this clause refers to are the lightning link and Drop in Automatic Sear (DIAS). Factory full auto hammer, selector switch and disconnector are not designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi automatic firearm. DIAS and LL are designed to make semi automatic AR15 to go full automatic. As a matter of fact, LL will not work will full automatic BGC and DIAS cannot fit into real full automatic lower.
However, if you drill a hole and mill out the lower shelf so that you can put an automatic sear into a semi receiver, then you have just created a full automatic firearm per definition of "prohibited firearms 1(c)
A full automatic firearm is a "prohibited firearms". It is not a "prohibited device". Therefore, only the receiver of a FA firearms is prohibited. You can have AK mags, AK stock... it does not matter. This is because AK is a "prohibited firearm", not a "prohibited device" and therefore it is not under the jurisdiction of the definition of "prohibited device.
However, components or partd of a Lightning Link or DIAS are prohibited devices. This is because DIAS and LL are "prohibited devices" on their own.
In my humble non-lawyer opinion that you should read with a grain of salt for your own entertainment purpose and by no means should take this as legal advice. , you can have all the FA parts your want, as long as your receiver cannot accept these parts to go full automatic, or even if it can accept these parts, it cannot go full automatic. If you modify your receive to take these parts, by simply taking a file to remove 0.05mm of materials, you could be in a lot of legal problems.
Personally, I will not bother. It is not like it is a cool thing to do to put a FA selector in your AR. No one can tell, it does not do anything and why deal with the potential headaches due to misunderstanding?
"Prohibited device" is not the same as a" Prohibited Firearm".
The criminal codes clearly define "Prohibited Device", "prohibited firearms" and "prohibit weapon" differently. They mean different things.
This is a prohibited device
What this clause refers to are the lightning link and Drop in Automatic Sear (DIAS). Factory full auto hammer, selector switch and disconnector are not designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi automatic firearm. DIAS and LL are designed to make semi automatic AR15 to go full automatic. As a matter of fact, LL will not work will full automatic BGC and DIAS cannot fit into real full automatic lower.
However, if you drill a hole and mill out the lower shelf so that you can put an automatic sear into a semi receiver, then you have just created a full automatic firearm per definition of "prohibited firearms 1(c)
A full automatic firearm is a "prohibited firearms". It is not a "prohibited device". Therefore, only the receiver of a FA firearms is prohibited. You can have AK mags, AK stock... it does not matter. This is because AK is a "prohibited firearm", not a "prohibited device" and therefore it is not under the jurisdiction of the definition of "prohibited device.
However, components or partd of a Lightning Link or DIAS are prohibited devices. This is because DIAS and LL are "prohibited devices" on their own.
In my humble non-lawyer opinion that you should read with a grain of salt for your own entertainment purpose and by no means should take this as legal advice. , you can have all the FA parts your want, as long as your receiver cannot accept these parts to go full automatic, or even if it can accept these parts, it cannot go full automatic. If you modify your receive to take these parts, by simply taking a file to remove 0.05mm of materials, you could be in a lot of legal problems.
Personally, I will not bother. It is not like it is a cool thing to do to put a FA selector in your AR. No one can tell, it does not do anything and why deal with the potential headaches due to misunderstanding?
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You need to read the prohibitied device regulations with this in mind:
"1. In these Regulations, “semi-automatic”, in respect of a firearm, means a firearm that is equipped with a mechanism that, following the discharge of a cartridge, automatically operates to complete any part of the reloading cycle necessary to prepare for the discharge of the next cartridge."
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/sor-98-462/page-1.html#h-1
Even automatic firearms meet this definition. Automatic firing is dealt with separately and above this.
Now read the regulation as the SFSS does:
PART 4
PROHIBITED DEVICES
Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 9
1. Any electrical or mechanical device that is designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi-automatic firearm for the purpose of causing the firearm to discharge cartridges in rapid succession.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/r...2.html#docCont
“prohibited device” means
(a) any component or part of a weapon, or any accessory for use with a weapon, that is prescribed to be a prohibited device,
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...e-42.html#h-38
99. (1) Every person commits an offence who
(a) manufactures or transfers, whether or not for consideration, or
(b) offers to do anything referred to in paragraph (a) in respect of
a firearm, a prohibited weapon, a restricted weapon, a prohibited device, any ammunition or any prohibited ammunition knowing that the person is not authorized to do so under the Firearms Act or any other Act of Parliament or any regulations made under any Act of Parliament.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...8.html#docCont
"1. In these Regulations, “semi-automatic”, in respect of a firearm, means a firearm that is equipped with a mechanism that, following the discharge of a cartridge, automatically operates to complete any part of the reloading cycle necessary to prepare for the discharge of the next cartridge."
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/sor-98-462/page-1.html#h-1
Even automatic firearms meet this definition. Automatic firing is dealt with separately and above this.
Now read the regulation as the SFSS does:
PART 4
PROHIBITED DEVICES
Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 9
1. Any electrical or mechanical device that is designed or adapted to operate the trigger mechanism of a semi-automatic firearm for the purpose of causing the firearm to discharge cartridges in rapid succession.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/r...2.html#docCont
“prohibited device” means
(a) any component or part of a weapon, or any accessory for use with a weapon, that is prescribed to be a prohibited device,
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...e-42.html#h-38
99. (1) Every person commits an offence who
(a) manufactures or transfers, whether or not for consideration, or
(b) offers to do anything referred to in paragraph (a) in respect of
a firearm, a prohibited weapon, a restricted weapon, a prohibited device, any ammunition or any prohibited ammunition knowing that the person is not authorized to do so under the Firearms Act or any other Act of Parliament or any regulations made under any Act of Parliament.
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/a...8.html#docCont
