M305S now a single shot with case jam!!!

hatman1793

hatman1793

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My M305S long barrel ran fine with the steel cased, non corrosive ammo. Got some military brass cased "SB 78" ammo and it shot fine, too, for a bit.

Believe that the SB78 is corrosive so two times ago, stripped the rifle down, cleaned the barrel with some Windex to neutralize the corrosive action, oiled & re-assembled it. FYI my only non-factory modification is installation of the Black Freather recoil spring guide road.

Next range outing the rifle turned into a single shot and the cases would not eject, but stuck and had to be forcibly removed. Again, stripped, cleaned and oiled the barrel for the next outing. In between, advice was offered that the chamber might be the problem. I suggested the gas port was plugged but advice claimed not. Copper wire brushed the chamber, and also used the hard nylon one that was in the cleaning kit.

Next range outing proved the same. Single shot only & the brass cases had to be forcibly removed.

What's going wrong? Some expert advice would be helpful...thanks...
 
As I noted in this thread I made; http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/1282472-M305-Feed-ramp-problem

I still get feed/eject issues but it's getting better each time I go to test. If the oprod ring stays in place next time I think that will resolve a lot of it but I also think it needs more use to break things in. As I'm not an expert this is a guess based on things like my SKS and MR1. I also have the M14.ca guide rod but added the Archangel stock. If things don't improve next time I might change back to the original equipment just to see if things work better and then tweak as needed.
 
you removed the oil from the barrel before shooting it right? firing through a wet barrel and chamber makes for some very high pressure spikes....

next... your using the proper grease on all those moving parts?

lastly... what does the brass look like coming out? is it ballooned? hows the head spacing on this gun?


is the action cycling freely? i've seen a lot of m305 that come with a bent op rod, takes some force to open it...



but honestly... post some pictures of the action, cases and what not....
 
My first thought was short stroking as well, and from your post if I had to guess I'd say you cleaned/oiled your barrel with the rifle in the upright position? This would allow windex/oil/whatever into the gas port.

Without looking at it, I'd say 45ACPKING has spot on advice. Sounds like a gas related issue to me.
 
45ACPKING said:
Have you put the original in and tried the rifle? Can you hear the spring compressing when you cycle the action? Often , and regardless of manufacturer, the aftermarket NM guide rods can cause some drag between rod/spring and oprod tube due to the tighter tolerances created.
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I'm at this point as well. I only fired 5 rounds before switching guide rods and stocks but it cycled fine. It was also different ammo, SP not FMJ, so that could be part of the issue.

Still waiting to hear back from the OP to see what he's found based on all the feedback.
 
Art Luppino says you can put a drop or two of oil in the gas cylinder and says it's his opinion it does no harm. Others are dead set against it. The HK SL-8 manual tells you to put oil in the gas cylinder.

If you oil your barrel and chamber for storage always remove it before shooting. Knew a guy 25 years ago complaining he couldn't open the bolt after each round. Guess what he was leaving oil in the chamber which prevents the case from gripping the chamber walls when the shot is fired and allows the case to put extreme pressure on the bolt face. For me that's what a mop is for, to get the chamber free of solvent and oil. Last step in cleaning the bore. But then living in a dry climate I don't oil my barrels after cleaning for storage. If I was in Vancouver I would.
 
45ACPKING said:
What you are describing is classic short stroking.
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I don't agree, because he states that fired cases must be forcibly removed to clear the malfunction. If it was simply a short stroke the empty case should be ready to fall out of the chamber on its own. It seems to me like there must be some roughness in the chamber, or he somehow found a hot batch of ammo. Which is odd since Spanish SB ammo was noted for being quite lightly loaded. That steel cased ammo you were shooting, was it copper plated or lacquered?

hatman1793 said:
Believe that the SB78 is corrosive so...
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No, it isn't.
 
this ain't an hk sl 8- it's an m14 clone and the real manual says It should be BONE DRY- LOOK UP FM 23-8- nowhere does it advocate leaving anything in the gas system , Period-you're getting as bad as sunray with your superfluous advice
 
I think I'm gonna stop with the m14 advice on the internet.
There's Tony bens and tactical teachers for that, although I don't see them offer advice on these kinds of problems much.

Good luck, hope ya figure it out.
 
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45ACPKING said:
I think I'm gonna stop with the m14 advice on the internet.
There's Tony bens and tactical teachers for that, although I don't see them offer advice on these kinds of problems much.

Good luck, hope ya figure it out.
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I've noticed many newbies on here with di-or-e-ah of the mouth.
It's up to the OP to state a proper case, with pic's. Till then it's all up in the air
 
Eject or extract? These operations are related, but different.
I am going to guess that this is an extraction problem, not an ejection problem.
The fired case is stuck hard in the chamber?
Chamber roughness may be the culprit. If there is pitting there, that is a real problem. The chamber should be chrome plated, but careful cleaning and inspection would be in order. I do not know if 78 dated Czech ammunition is corrosive or not. Almost all Western made 7.62x51 ball is non-corrosive, but the same cannot be said for East Bloc stuff made for heaven only knows whom. As far as cleaning after corrosive use goes, Windex does not neutralize corrosive residue. The water in it will dissolve corrosive salts, but nothing more than that.
If the gas system is inoperative, the rifle will be bolt action, but cases will not be stuck in the chamber.
Clean the chamber thoroughly and try different ammunition, but if the problem persists, I would suspect that the problem is in the chamber.
 
t-star said:
this ain't an hk sl 8- it's an m14 clone and the real manual says It should be BONE DRY- LOOK UP FM 23-8- nowhere does it advocate leaving anything in the gas system , Period-you're getting as bad as sunray with your superfluous advice
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Can't put anything past you.
I have the manual and I'm familiar with it. The point I was making is that a bit of oil in the gas cylinder probably isn't going to stop the rifle from cycling. That's supported by a man who has forgotten more about the platform than you or I will ever know. I have not seen excess build up in my SL-8 where I do use oil in the gas cylinder. They are not the same rifle but you have a tube with a hole and a piston in a cylinder so in that respect they are not unlike each other are they?
 
T-star...the new Sunray...

I really hate when people post a question and then disappear.

Let's just assume he forgot to put the valve in the right orientation and is to embarrassed to admit it.

:)
 
45ACPKING said:
I think I'm gonna stop with the m14 advice on the internet.
There's Tony bens and tactical teachers for that, although I don't see them offer advice on these kinds of problems much.

Good luck, hope ya figure it out.
Click to expand...

Thomas most of us recognize the experience you have and are grateful for the advice and help you have given members here. Don't expect everyone to be in complete agreement with what you suggest every time. In my professional life we frequently have peer reviews to establish the best course of action. Everyone's input is welcomed and there are always people present with considerably more experience than the others. In the end their input is given more value but looking at things from different angles not only uncovers new ideas but it teaches the new guys how to analyze a problem and adds to their experience when it gets solved or doesn't. Our tubes are as much as 4800 meters long and 3000 meters below surface. Very strange things happen when you deal with tools at that depth and pressure. Not being able to see it makes it that much more difficult not unlike trouble shooting a guys cycling problem from a written description.
 
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Seafury, it's not because people disagree. It's because out of the "perceived" experts around here.... I'm the only one trying to help with the real problems and rifle malfunctions. And I've hit the wall and just don't feel like doing it anymore.
 
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