Made in Auschwitz as a selling point???

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cantom

cantom

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I can't believe this ####.

What kind of twisted individual would consider this something positive as a selling point?

Personally I can't stand the sight of Swastikas or Nazi stuff, unless it's a helmet with a bullet hole in it.

Mausers, fine...great rifles. But pushing having been made in a death/extermination/slave labour camp...a bit beyond the pale?

In all of the years I've owned guns and collected, I've never seen anything like this before.

Lest my silence be misinterpreted as agreement, I'm speaking up.




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Different collectors seeking different things I guess. As awful a time period as it was, it is history. Some of the most grim things do appeal to some folks. Some other folks embrace "lest we forget", and keeping that kinda crap around certainly makes forgetting difficult.

In that ad though, it's a story for sale with no provenance. I hate that almost as much as Nazism.
 
swastika on my mausers and hell even one of my Israeli mauser rifles has one doesn't bother me one bit...

Now the pushing about death camp welcome to everyones rifles being worth more then they are so everyone tries to create a reason why its worth more then the norm rifles for sale.... Some collectors buy up the stories of the rifles even if there is no proof
 
The G/K43's that were made in the Buchenwald death camp tend to command higher than normal prices due to their scarcity. Im not saying that people specifically go looking for a death camp rifles, but people want to have a nice BCD coded rifle to round out their collection.
 
Isn't this the reason why Nazi stuff commands high (insane) prices by collectors?
A K98 without swastika is most certainly not worth $2000, people are attracted and pay for the dark side of the history.
I own a Mauser collection, but there is not a single rifle with a swastika.
 
No provenance is more offensive to me when claiming something is what it is.
Only a moron believes these stories with no provenance. Only an ####### tells them.
 
Lot of German war stuff was made by forced labor,right up to planes and missiles, no way around it. Everyone else was basically conscripted into the army.

Grizz
 
While I can understand the OP sentiment I would like to throw this out, there are people out there saying that the holocaust did not happen.
While I don't have any use for someone who shaves their head and brands a swastika into it, I believe that memorabilia that starts a conversation is important if we wish to prevent another.

At one time the Jews said never again. Now many prominent Jews in Hollywood are pushing for similar laws that made the Holocaust easier.

Now I myself am not a collector and I don't know what the motivation of the k98 seller is, but I would suggest that if one is offended by such things talking to them through PM is probably more productive then public shaming.
 
Yeah, you can pretty much guarantee that the ad is a complete fabrication.

Auschwitz-Birkenau was not a "factory camp", such as BuchenWald etc...

There may have been industry and smaller shops in the surrounding areas that used foreign slave labour, but to say that ammo pouches were made in Auschwitz is entirely disingenuous and tacky.
 
Sleeper said:
While I can understand the OP sentiment I would like to throw this out, there are people out there saying that the holocaust did not happen.
While I don't have any use for someone who shaves their head and brands a swastika into it, I believe that memorabilia that starts a conversation is important if we wish to prevent another.

At one time the Jews said never again. Now many prominent Jews in Hollywood are pushing for similar laws that made the Holocaust easier.

Now I myself am not a collector and I don't know what the motivation of the k98 seller is, but I would suggest that if one is offended by such things talking to them through PM is probably more productive then public shaming.
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I think that there are two distinct camps on this issue. The first being as you said, those who buy the memorabilia to preserve the memories and educate others about the Shoah so that it doesn't happen again. The second camp are those who believe that the selling or buying of anything related to the Shoah is profiting off of the dead.

I personally believe that education trumps the other camp, but I can see why people take issue with it.
 
TheNewfieBullet said:
I think that there are two distinct camps on this issue. The first being as you said, those who buy the memorabilia to preserve the memories and educate others about the Shoah so that it doesn't happen again. The second camp are those who believe that the selling or buying of anything related to the Shoah is profiting off of the dead.

I personally believe that education trumps the other camp, but I can see why people take issue with it.
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I have to agree with you, personally I'd pay a little more for something that could be made as verified in one of the camps. And I'd do it so I could keep it as a reminder as what has happened as well as to remember those who perished during the holocaust.
 
I'm more offended that he can't post pics for a $2500 package and then does a little rant about his time and serious buyers. I'm interested in buying any all matching K98 but wouldn't even bother messaging the guy honestly.
Seems like the type when you ask for pics to verify all matching that he feels you are then obligated to buy it. Laughable.
On topic though , an all matching K98 is a great selling feature , a concentration camp made pouch not so much. Just stick to the facts and what you know as well , it shouldn't have been mentioned IMHO but it's his ad.
Like others have said some like the dark side of history and like it or not it happened. The Germans/Nazis of that time were a great military power and ahead of their time on lots of things. They made fine war implements and were intelligent as a whole , they would command great respect realistically if not for the atrocities they committed in WW2. But atrocities they did commit nonetheless , that is fact and a dark part of human history unfortunately.
 
The only reason to complain is if he is fraudulently representing what he is selling.
I wouldn't go to the admins - I'd go straight to the person selling the wares.
 
collector67 said:
Sad but true. Mausers that were used by SS concentration camp guards also command a high premium.....
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Despite what some may try to tell you any K98k MAY have been used by a concentration camp guard. I fail to see the attraction personally, seems a little morbid.
The rifles produced specifically for the SS and these were for the Waffen SS or "fighting SS" not so much camp guard slugs who were usually the bottom of the barrel, quality wise. The Steyr Daimler Pusch(spelling?) works in Austria produced a number of K98 rifles for the SS outside of the WEHRMACHT supply system. Staring in 1943 the were marked bnz 43 and bnz 44. They had a single rune on the receiver denoting SS intended rides. From what I have read by the end of the war the quality of Steyr produced rifles was the worst of any maker owing to the fact the SS were running the operation and slave labour was used in production. Many WW1 G 98 rifles were reworked to K98k specs early on(1930's) for SS use as the Wehrmacht was inclined to ignore the SS requirements at that time. Many would have a small death's head stamped on the side of the barrel.Other guys may correct me on these things as some have made a thorough study of all K98 variations regardless of who made hem.
A lot of people aren't aware but Albert Speer's economic miracle in war production was due in large part to slave labour from occupied countries. So many items of GERMAN make during the years 42 to 45 could have been made by slaves or camp inmates.
 
cantom said:
I can't believe this ####.

What kind of twisted individual would consider this something positive as a selling point?

Personally I can't stand the sight of Swastikas or Nazi stuff, unless it's a helmet with a bullet hole in it.

Mausers, fine...great rifles. But pushing having been made in a death/extermination/slave labour camp...a bit beyond the pale?

In all of the years I've owned guns and collected, I've never seen anything like this before.

Lest my silence be misinterpreted as agreement, I'm speaking up.




ttUlpZ8.jpg
Click to expand...

I don't understand your point of view. I collect nazi rifles. Basically all I collect. It's a dark time in history yes, but not the only reason to collect it. They made excellent rifles, with a variety of parts, and finishes. And I respect their wartime designs and improvements. Laminate stock, the kriegsmodell time saving designs. Also enjoy the g/k series. An attempt to counter the effectiveness of the SVT in the East. And with late war rifles you can start to see the panic and desperation. So there is more beyond the swastika.

And your stance on only owning a swastika adorned helmet with a bullet
Hole in it is a bit extreme. Its 2016 and history has shown that lots of Germans had little option. Not every German or even solider was a frothing at the mouth Nazi. This is the equivilant of suggesting you are a liberal because your province and country are liberal. You give the liberals taxes right? Basically a card carrying donating liberal. Lol. Everything of the time has a swastika.

After all that I agree, the quest for "camp" items is lame. And suggesting a pouch that is likely easily
Proven to be made elsewhere is not in the best taste perhaps.
 
Op, all is history whether it's light or dark, do you have the same opinion of the cross? The Church has committed far more atrocities through history but yet I see pictures of Jesus and the cross's adorned around the world. How do you feel about the ruskies and their solution to the slavics during WWII? I have ancestors that fought against the Germans, they were all soldiers and followed orders. War is hell and yes there are horrible people with or with out it that commit horrendous acts. I don't agree with the pouch being labelled as an camp made item as that's likely false, but if your going to put down and label one group of genocide why not paint all the genociders throught history with the same brush. Which is close to every race and religion out there.
 
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live4therut said:
... The Church has committed far more atrocities through history ....
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Really?

Than the Nazis with their plans and protocols for systematic murder and/or enslavement of the 'inferior' races? Not to mention 'medical experiments'?

I think not.


cantom said:
I can't believe this ####.

....

Personally I can't stand the sight of Swastikas or Nazi stuff, unless it's a helmet with a bullet hole in it.

...]
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The more I learn about Nazi's and their genocidal plans for humanity, the more appalled I am and the more I agree with Cantom. They had it in for any NUMBER of races or individuals that didn't meet their criteria.

Humanity has to be very, VERY grateful they were stopped where they were.

And I can understand why many, including Canton, want nothing to do with Nazi memorabilia of any sort.
 
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No problem with any of CanadianAR except for him saying the pouch was from Auschwitz. That did bother me.

I don't mean people should only own helmets with bullet holes in them...haha.

But given a choice, I take the Canadian/British/Commonwealth/US side. After all, our whole country mobilized to fight the Axis powers.

.303's my calibre....not 8mm.


CanadianAR said:
I don't understand your point of view. I collect nazi rifles. Basically all I collect. It's a dark time in history yes, but not the only reason to collect it. They made excellent rifles, with a variety of parts, and finishes. And I respect their wartime designs and improvements. Laminate stock, the kriegsmodell time saving designs. Also enjoy the g/k series. An attempt to counter the effectiveness of the SVT in the East. And with late war rifles you can start to see the panic and desperation. So there is more beyond the swastika.

And your stance on only owning a swastika adorned helmet with a bullet
Hole in it is a bit extreme. Its 2016 and history has shown that lots of Germans had little option. Not every German or even solider was a frothing at the mouth Nazi. This is the equivilant of suggesting you are a liberal because your province and country are liberal. You give the liberals taxes right? Basically a card carrying donating liberal. Lol. Everything of the time has a swastika.

After all that I agree, the quest for "camp" items is lame. And suggesting a pouch that is likely easily
Proven to be made elsewhere is not in the best taste perhaps.
Click to expand...
 
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