milsurp alert!! - check this out!

Horilka said:
So 91/30S?
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Knowing the history of the development of these speciments, I wouldn't give any special name to this model. Rifle itself is just a regular 91/30, bayonet in fact is detachable, so it was possible to fit it at any rifle. Plan at production on them sounds like "rifle mod.91/30 - 84000, 10000 of them with folding Semin bayonets"
So any name that will be selected, will be just an opinion - soviets did not have any special name and GAU code for them.
But, there was one design from 1943, also with folding bayonet, that have it's own GAU code. Currently it is not known to public. In this case I think it worth for a special name - modification was related not only to the bayonet
 
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Ratnik: given the rifle's stock was modified to clear the bayonet and the bayonet was not removable by soldiers outside the depot level, is the lack of a designation perhaps related to the pattern not being adopted beyond trials?

Generally things get GAU codes when the pattern is accepted, after trials, for manufacture and general issue, is that not the case?
 
In collecting it is common practice to assign a name to a modification that had no official name, just to distinguish from other models. I also wouldn't call the bayo removable, is it not held in place by pins?
 
Horilka said:
In collecting it is common practice to assign a name to a modification that had no official name, just to distinguish from other models. I also wouldn't call the bayo removable, is it not held in place by pins?
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It is, yes. You can't remove it with the standard issue tools, but it can be removed by a unit armorer.
 
To me it is stupid calling it removable bayonet! Do we call the sks removable bayonet? Cause they are with tools.
 
Claven2 said:
Ratnik: given the rifle's stock was modified to clear the bayonet and the bayonet was not removable by soldiers outside the depot level, is the lack of a designation perhaps related to the pattern not being adopted beyond trials?

Generally things get GAU codes when the pattern is accepted, after trials, for manufacture and general issue, is that not the case?
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When new model was accepted to the service, it received GAU code and official name. For example, M44 carbine was officially accepted in January 1944 as "7,62 mm carbine model 1944", and got GAU code 56-B-224. Before this, in 1943 it was called "carbine mod.1938 with non-detachable bayonet". And same document call rifles as "rifle mod.91/30 with folding Semin bayonet".
But for example short M91/30 manual, published in February 1944 call rifles and carbines as models with "non-detachable bayonet".
In January 1944 was issued an order, which mentioned that production of M91/30 should be stopped since February 1944 in Izhevsk, and March 1944 in Tula. All efforts were put to the production of M44, and later to the design of shortened rifle, but this is another story. In fact, rifles were produced in Izhevsk up to the end 1940's, but in very small quanties. This order was an end of the M91/30 rifles era. Semin folding bayonet was designed too late..
Actually, I don't care how they will be named nowadays, I just try to provide accurate information how they were named that days
 
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Ratnik said:
Knowing the history of the development of these speciments, I wouldn't give any special name to this model. Rifle itself is just a regular 91/30, bayonet in fact is detachable, so it was possible to fit it at any rifle. Plan at production on them sounds like "rifle mod.91/30 - 84000, 10000 of them with folding Semin bayonets"
So any name that will be selected, will be just an opinion - soviets did not have any special name and GAU code for them.
But, there was one design from 1943, also with folding bayonet, that have it's own GAU code. Currently it is not known to public. In this case I think it worth for a special name - modification was related not only to the bayonet
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Am I getting that there are other very rare mosin on the verge of import or of going on sale that you have information on?
 
Im stuck on this semin bayonet, not sure why it never let fly on the battlefield. Seems like it would really help to cream the Germans, swipe them off the map like a gym sock. A real handy piece of hardware if you ask me.
 
derr12 said:
Im stuck on this semin bayonet, not sure why it never let fly on the battlefield. Seems like it would really help to cream the Germans, swipe them off the map like a gym sock. A real handy piece of hardware if you ask me.
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Just look at the M44 and even the SKS. Bayonet fighting and mass attacks were very much part of Soviet Army doctrine far longer than in the west.
 
Interesting to see this bayonet.. ht tp://www.bayonet.lv/ru/articles/Russia/M1943.htm

The folding bayonet of the 1943 model to the rifle of the Mosin system
 
Pblatzz said:
Interesting to see this bayonet.. ht tp://www.bayonet.lv/ru/articles/Russia/M1943.htm

The folding bayonet of the 1943 model to the rifle of the Mosin system
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That's the same bayonet, though it's missing its rifle. Again, the rifle's have slightly modified stocks as well. It seems the intent was to retrofit all 91/30 rifle's to the new pattern, but then a decision was made to switch entirely to M44 carbines and ppsh guns at the unit level, so the idea was dropped and the 91/30's were collected for long term storage as-is, except for this trials batch.
 
I just received mine from the mailman an hour ago and got right into cracking it open. Typical wartime metal finish, the bolt feels like two pieces of shale rubbing when its moving in the receiver. Mine is all matching and seems original. The stock like the others posted has the remains of the oil finish peeking through on the top and all the cartouches present. The bayonet is a pretty cool piece of kit, it does change the balance of the rifle compared to my other Mosins. The bore is mint and bolt face is untouched making me wonder if it was fired after proofing... I'm now debating whether or not to shoot it! I think it's a super cool rifle and it'll be sitting in my collection for a good long time. :redface:

Bz2KgPC.jpg
VPgzRF9.jpg
59GnEZy.jpg
gaoKfuz.jpg
 
BlackPowderBurner said:
I just received mine from the mailman an hour ago and got right into cracking it open. Typical wartime metal finish, the bolt feels like two pieces of shale rubbing when its moving in the receiver. Mine is all matching and seems original. The stock like the others posted has the remains of the oil finish peeking through on the top and all the cartouches present. The bayonet is a pretty cool piece of kit, it does change the balance of the rifle compared to my other Mosins. The bore is mint and bolt face is untouched making me wonder if it was fired after proofing... I'm now debating whether or not to shoot it! I think it's a super cool rifle and it'll be sitting in my collection for a good long time. :redface:

Bz2KgPC.jpg
VPgzRF9.jpg
59GnEZy.jpg
gaoKfuz.jpg
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She's a beauty! I wouldn't fire it personally because she looks so damned ###y but it would be nice to see how she shoots with both bayonet back and bayonet out
 
I love the Russian RED stock!

It's amazing to think that any Mosin lived through the war without being issued to the front lines. I keep reading about how in a rush they were to produce guns. With the Russians halting production of the SVT40's to build Mosins, it really speaks to that need they had.

These look beautiful in that rough and unfinished sort of way!! LOL! It sure isn't a Tikka T3 stainless that's for sure!
 
Just got my 2. Both are perfect. Bores are pristine.

A 3Б. All matching.

And a BB. The magazine baseplate was restamped to match (seems like the original font). The bolt does not have the BB prefix but does have the same 4 digit numbers. Buttplate matches.
 
Got mine earlier tonight, has some interesting double stamping on it. The bore looks like it lacks corrosion but has some dirt/dust from storage possibly in it, I'm not sure if I'm going to clean it out or just leave it as is...
lNsVeRq.jpg
 
Aestus said:
Got mine earlier tonight, has some interesting double stamping on it. The bore looks like it lacks corrosion but has some dirt/dust from storage possibly in it, I'm not sure if I'm going to clean it out or just leave it as is...
lNsVeRq.jpg
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Hahahah wow.... even the bottom 1943r looks double stamped haha so it's a triple dated rifle haha
The Soviet crest is double stamped, so is the Izhevsk triangle...

Vodka does wonders. ;)
 
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