- Location
- Saskatchewan
is the modern varminter a better investment then an xcr l? i am between the two any advice would be great!
Modern Varminter?
- Thread starter Wiseguym70
- Start date
- Location
- Saskatchewan
that true. i am asking basically people with modern hunters like the rifle
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
Hopefully I will be able to form an opinion between the 2 soon, but in my opinion the best option overall both now and for the foreseeable future will be a custom Bushmaster ACR.
If the MV is anything like the MH it will be equal to or better than an XCR in every way but will still have it's little quirks and small issues just like the MH.
I'd love to get my hands on a MV and do some load development and testing on it but I already have a non restricted ACR with 223 and 300BLK conversions that I'm not getting rid of so a MV will probably not end up in my collection.
So far I've shot three MH's and while I think they are a very nice rifle with some fantastic features I can live without one of my own, I should be getting a chance to spend a day with a fourth one in the next week and maybe it will help me gain a better opinion of them. I've seen plenty of failure to feed issues and pierced primers (with factory ammo) from them and never seen 1moa or less, so for the money I think there are better options. I'm hoping the MV will take it up a notch and hopefully ATRS corrects a couple of the small issues with the MH in future batches (all three so far were first batch).
Don't get me wrong though, I'd take a MH or MV over an XCR any day even with the issues I've seen with the MH, I'm being extremely critical of them. Considering how much they cost I feel it's ok to expect a little more.
I'd love to get my hands on a MV and do some load development and testing on it but I already have a non restricted ACR with 223 and 300BLK conversions that I'm not getting rid of so a MV will probably not end up in my collection.
So far I've shot three MH's and while I think they are a very nice rifle with some fantastic features I can live without one of my own, I should be getting a chance to spend a day with a fourth one in the next week and maybe it will help me gain a better opinion of them. I've seen plenty of failure to feed issues and pierced primers (with factory ammo) from them and never seen 1moa or less, so for the money I think there are better options. I'm hoping the MV will take it up a notch and hopefully ATRS corrects a couple of the small issues with the MH in future batches (all three so far were first batch).
Don't get me wrong though, I'd take a MH or MV over an XCR any day even with the issues I've seen with the MH, I'm being extremely critical of them. Considering how much they cost I feel it's ok to expect a little more.
I've seen a lot of MOA groups shot with the MH's. But like all rifles, no matter how good, they only perform as well as the guy pulling the trigger, and the ammo you feed them. I have shot MOA groups, but even using the exact same ammo, I can't do it every time. I have to say that it's not the rifles fault, but mine. I'm just not a consistent MOA shooter. I have my good days and my bad ones. cr5 did say factory ammo, and there is some with soft primers that is not recommended by ATRS. He also didn't say "factory match".
In my experience all guns have their quirks, and they all have ammo that they like and don't like. Find the ammo that particular gun likes, and stick with it.
In my experience all guns have their quirks, and they all have ammo that they like and don't like. Find the ammo that particular gun likes, and stick with it.
If the MV is sub MOA it will be nothing like the XCR or the ACR. It's much lighter for one thing, and has a completely different look. I've shot 1 MOA with a CCR that o previously owned but at 10+ lbs it wasn't an ideal rifle.If the MV can shoot sub MOA come in at under 8lbs and be reliable. Then it's hard to say it's not the better platform. But if your not concerned with the extra weight and the accuracy then the XCR is a great rifle. I can't say much about the ACR as I've never shot one, but from what I've read , the only difference between it and the XCR is the accuracy. So because the ACR is a more accurate gun, that would be my choice. It's also difficult to have an opinion about a rifle, that hasn't been released yet.if the MV is Sub MOA then compare them.
XCR, $2800,accuracy is hit and miss,10 lbs?
ACR $3000 ,1 MOA or less, 10 lbs?
MV $3300, accuracy ???, 7+ lbs
XCR, $2800,accuracy is hit and miss,10 lbs?
ACR $3000 ,1 MOA or less, 10 lbs?
MV $3300, accuracy ???, 7+ lbs
ACR is 2200 Used. I know ive been away from EE for a while...lol... But when the heck did they go up to 3g's
Im saving up for a MV, but I can't see myself ever selling my ACR .
way to much fun.
XCR's are more fun in X39, and they would fall last on my list.
Im saving up for a MV, but I can't see myself ever selling my ACR .
way to much fun.XCR's are more fun in X39, and they would fall last on my list.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
Are you factoring weight of optics on the XCR and ACR but not the MV or how do you come up with those weights?
The KEYMOD XCR-L with light profile barrel has been the lightest non-restricted configured black rifle I have owned to date.
My ACR is not a 10 lb gun even with its heavy profile barrel and metal handguard, but with my Elcan I am sure it is close.
I believe the approx lightest configuration of the MV is 7lbs.
I've seen a couple used , $2800., New one are around the $3000 point.ACR is 2200 Used. I know ive been away from EE for a while...lol... But when the heck did they go up to 3g's
Im saving up for a MV, but I can't see myself ever selling my ACR .
XCR's are more fun in X39, and they would fall last on my list.
Your were only gone for a couple months, not years..
I think my XCR keymod HB was 10+ lbs. Not really sure about the ACR, I've only seen on here that it's 10+ lbs . The MV with HB is 9 lbs, so not really much lighter I suppose...
But it does look like and hopefully feel like my AR
But it does look like and hopefully feel like my AR
1+lbs. heavier is still a significant weight difference that will definitely be noticed when away from the bench.
IIRC a XCR saves a 1Lb. when going to the light weight barrel where as the ATRS MV should come in around 7Lbs. when equipped as light as possible, making for a 2+Lb. difference, so scoped the MV will weigh what the XCR does bare.
XCR would be my last choice due to it's accuracy or lack of accuracy (design of the barrel retention system just can't be over looked for myself) which I expect to fall far behind a Modern Varminter's Sub MOA capabilities (if they are to be anything like a MH which has proved to very, very accurate in competition against bolt guns no less).
Modern Hunters have shown to perform very well accuracy wise (sub MOA) with the right ammo., optics and shooter and I believe the Modern Varminter will be no different.
If the XCR was a $1,000 less then the Varmnter it still wouldn't be my choice, Varminter based on design, craftsmanship and accuracy capability (doesn't hurt to support a Canadian company that made these available from scratch either) and lets not forget the build quality and fine craftsmanship that are offered in the premium match grade ATRS MV.
It's really apples to oranges due to the accuracy potential of a ATRS MV and the MV's superior craftsmanship/design as compared to a XCR.
Cheers D
P.S. Since we're discussing the .223 calibre here I would also consider a new Swiss Arms Black Special/Classic Green rifle (Black Special flat top/folding sights 1/7, AR mag. capability would be my personal choice), especially if they come in well under $4,000.
Unless competing or wanting the very best accuracy at long distances (600M+), then the Modern Varminter would be the first choice due to factory available barrel options.
Otherwise the Swiss Arms would be my first choice of all the NR .223 black rifles, but only because the Canadian Colt's are Restricted.
IIRC a XCR saves a 1Lb. when going to the light weight barrel where as the ATRS MV should come in around 7Lbs. when equipped as light as possible, making for a 2+Lb. difference, so scoped the MV will weigh what the XCR does bare.
I think my XCR keymod HB was 10+ lbs. Not really sure about the ACR, I've only seen on here that it's 10+ lbs . The MV with HB is 9 lbs, so not really much lighter I suppose...
But it does look like and hopefully feel like my AR
XCR would be my last choice due to it's accuracy or lack of accuracy (design of the barrel retention system just can't be over looked for myself) which I expect to fall far behind a Modern Varminter's Sub MOA capabilities (if they are to be anything like a MH which has proved to very, very accurate in competition against bolt guns no less).
Modern Hunters have shown to perform very well accuracy wise (sub MOA) with the right ammo., optics and shooter and I believe the Modern Varminter will be no different.
If the XCR was a $1,000 less then the Varmnter it still wouldn't be my choice, Varminter based on design, craftsmanship and accuracy capability (doesn't hurt to support a Canadian company that made these available from scratch either) and lets not forget the build quality and fine craftsmanship that are offered in the premium match grade ATRS MV.
It's really apples to oranges due to the accuracy potential of a ATRS MV and the MV's superior craftsmanship/design as compared to a XCR.
Cheers D
P.S. Since we're discussing the .223 calibre here I would also consider a new Swiss Arms Black Special/Classic Green rifle (Black Special flat top/folding sights 1/7, AR mag. capability would be my personal choice), especially if they come in well under $4,000.
Unless competing or wanting the very best accuracy at long distances (600M+), then the Modern Varminter would be the first choice due to factory available barrel options.
Otherwise the Swiss Arms would be my first choice of all the NR .223 black rifles, but only because the Canadian Colt's are Restricted.
Last edited:
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
I have yet to shoot my newly aquired Swiss Arms Black Special flat top or HK SL8, but the ACR still feels far superior. The Swiss is a dated design and quite heavy.
The SL8 is also very heavy from factory, curious to see where I can take it with some modification.
The SL8 is also very heavy from factory, curious to see where I can take it with some modification.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
ACR also has a free floated barrel with the exception of the gas system. The Swiss has POI shift issues.
We tried nine different types of factory ammo, the best performance was from the Hornady 168 z-max loads which would average about 1.5moa. None of it was premium match but there was a box of Nosler trophy grade and a couple others that were decent quality. I shot it back to back with my 16" AR-10 with a Rainier Arms match barrel and they were about the same except than my AR-10 was 100% reliable and the MH had quite a few failure to feed issues no matter which magazines we used between the few gen 2 pmags and a couple XCR-M pistol mags.
My non restricted ACR was 8.5 pounds with light barrel and no glass, I sold that barrel and haven't weighed it with the new one but it's definitely not 10 lbs.
ACR is 2200 Used. I know ive been away from EE for a while...lol... But when the heck did they go up to 3g's
Im saving up for a MV, but I can't see myself ever selling my ACR .
XCR's are more fun in X39, and they would fall last on my list.
Unless I missed something in the last few months a used restricted ACR goes for $2200-$2400 and once in a while you can get a new restricted one for around $2600. As soon as there is a non restricted barrel on it $2800 is the cheapest you'll find one but those sell fast.
And from my experience the ACR is more accurate and way more consistent.
I had a SA classic green flat top with 7 twist barrel and it was a very nice rifle but my ACR is way more consistent, the SA flexes way too much, your groups shift all over the place depending how you hold it or support it. Bipod shooting would group 5 moa higher than shooting off the magazine. I liked the rifle and when I first got it I figured I'd never sell it but I just couldn't get over the groups moving around unless you always shot it from sandbags. In the field it would be all over unless you were very careful to relax and hold it just like you did when you sighted it in. Today, after all the NR semi's I've owned and also had the chance to shoot I would put the SA around #3 or #4.
Last edited:
I only paid 2200 for my NR ACR last year. Actually I think it was even less after I sold the extra stuff that was included with it.
I would never shell out 3g's for one, lol... Thats crazy. Heck even the prices of Tavors are out of hand...lol...
the MV has been on my shopping list for a long time, But I will also buy it used on the EE and let someone else take the hit on depreciation..
Actually I think it was even less after I sold the extra stuff that was included with it. I would never shell out 3g's for one, lol... Thats crazy. Heck even the prices of Tavors are out of hand...lol...
the MV has been on my shopping list for a long time, But I will also buy it used on the EE and let someone else take the hit on depreciation.
.
