Modern Wingmasters? Quality Level?

[madashell]

I'll be the outlier here and say that current wingmasters are not the same quality as previous generations especially since big green went private equity almost ten years ago. I went to the trouble of importing an older stock NIB 870 LW Wingmaster in 28ga from the US because the current models didn't have the same wood, bluing, polishing of the internals or wood to metal finish and I looked at a lot of them. Everything Remington produces nowadays has been cost cut and if you don't want to believe that go ahead, I won't bother explaining what PE firms do with their portfolio of assets.

Patrick

Just going on memory because I haven't done a direct comparison between an old wingmaster and a newer one recently but I fear you are essentially correct phinton81.

From what I recall the number one and two differences are the internal polishing and the bluing.

 

[st1264]

Just going on memory because I haven't done a direct comparison between an old wingmaster and a newer one recently but I fear you are essentially correct phinton81.

From what I recall the number one and two differences are the internal polishing and the bluing.

Growing up on the farm I remember using my Dad's Wingmaster (early 70's manufacture would be my guess) and it was smooth as silk. Never bought one of my own or handled a new one so I can't say. All I can attest to was that the older ones were top notch.

 

[Coachgun67]

870 aren't what they used to be...I rather stick to the older ones.

CG

 

[Kenny]

the gun I mentioned that had a broken trigger, was a express, some one told me that the new wingmasters have the same triggers, not sure if that is true or not ? I hope not because it is a weak spot

 

[madashell]

the gun I mentioned that had a broken trigger, was a express, some one told me that the new wingmasters have the same triggers, not sure if that is true or not ? I hope not because it is a weak spot

Yes, figured it was an Express.

The trigger design is the same for all 870's (with a design change long ago for flex-tab). However, I've yet to hear of any internal trigger parts being "plastic" (??) save for the polymer trigger guard.

I can see the the trigger internals not being as well polished or as well finished but internal plastic ?

Too bad you don't have pictures or are able to confirm with gun smith because I'm guessing this was just the trigger guard ?

 

[enefgee]

I have a Wingmaster that was built in 1952, it's a plain, no frills base model - and it's truly wonderful. Frankly I'd try to find an older one and lavish some top quality attention on it, rather than pay what they're asking for a new one. But I'm cheap.

 

[Mark Mags]

I would not hesitate buying a new Wingmaster... just hope you have better luck then me trying to find one in Canada. And yes, a shotgun from the 50's will be slicker than a new one, simply due to the number of rounds put through it. In 60 years from now, a 2016 production 870 will be just as smooth.

 

[phinton81]

I would not hesitate buying a new Wingmaster... just hope you have better luck then me trying to find one in Canada. And yes, a shotgun from the 50's will be slicker than a new one, simply due to the number of rounds put through it. In 60 years from now, a 2016 production 870 will be just as smooth.

As long as you blindly believe that Big Green is producing the same quality of firearms they did 50 years ago, they'll gladly take your money and prey on your nostalgia. For those of us having owned multiple generations of their guns, we're a little harder to fool

Patrick

 

[Rob F]

I just bought a new 870 Wingmaster a couple months ago. I've had it out for some patterning and practice, as well as couple goose hunts and a couple grouse hunts. The finish and blueing on it is very well done and the action is very slick for a gun that's only had 6 or 7 boxes through it. I got it soaked in the rain last week (thoroughly soaked) and it functioned fine and cleaned up easily. One obvious big advantage to the newer ones that nobody has mentioned is the removable chokes. It's fine to say an older Wingmaster has a slick action and a nice finish, but if it's choked full like a lot of them are and you can't (or at least shouldn't) shoot steel out of them they're not of much use to me.

 

[madashell]

I think far too many equate the Express stuff with the higher end models.

The majority of companies are putting out cheaper entry lever models today. There have to be compromises in order to play that game. It's often easy to get the two levels of products intertwined because there are far more Expresses on the shelves than Wingmasters and 870P's.

Mark Mags point on an older gun being well worked in and smooth vs a new one can't be ignored. And Rob F's point on factory threaded chokes is a good one. It's just easier to deal with.

 

[phinton81]

I think far too many equate the Express stuff with the higher end models.

The majority of companies are putting out cheaper entry lever models today. There have to be compromises in order to play that game. It's often easy to get the two levels of products intertwined because there are far more Expresses on the shelves than Wingmasters and 870P's.

Mark Mags point on an older gun being well worked in and smooth vs a new one can't be ignored. And Rob F's point on factory threaded chokes is a good one. It's just easier to deal with.

I think many are missing the point that this is not a comparison WM's of today and 50 years ago. My WM was made shortly before Remington went private equity and its considerably nicer than current iterations and that's because Remington has undergone massive cost cutting initiatives that have cheapened their offerings in order to make the company more profitable for its fund managers.

If someone has a brand new or made in the last couple of years WM please post some pics of the bluing/wood/metal and overall finish and I will do the same and you all can judge for yourselves. For the record, screw in chokes have been available on WM's going on 20 years now so it's not a new feature. My 28 ga has a lovely set of Brileys that came stock.

Patrick

 

[Mark-II]

I was considering one myself, but instead opted for the Ithaca Featherlight in the role of a higher-end pump gun.

Should have it within a month, and hopefully it compares favorably with the older ones.

 

[madashell]

I think many are missing the point that this is not a comparison WM's of today and 50 years ago. My WM was made shortly before Remington went private equity and its considerably nicer than current iterations and that's because Remington has undergone massive cost cutting initiatives that have cheapened their offerings in order to make the company more profitable for its fund managers.

If someone has a brand new or made in the last couple of years WM please post some pics of the bluing/wood/metal and overall finish and I will do the same and you all can judge for yourselves. For the record, screw in chokes have been available on WM's going on 20 years now so it's not a new feature. My 28 ga has a lovely set of Brileys that came stock.

Patrick

I'd like to see some pictures on that as well phinton81. Not agreeing or disagreeing with you. I'm curious what the exact differences are.

 

[phinton81]

I'd like to see some pictures on that as well phinton81. Not agreeing or disagreeing with you. I'm curious what the exact differences are.

Will do as soon as Photobucket lets me access my pics,

 

[dimeN]

my marine has metal trig guard.. bought it the year they came out, so thats awhile back

870's are great shotguns... i just had an experience with a tinchester 1200 pump yesterday that got jammed up when putting the barrel on in the field (due to sh-t ejector design ) it made me appreciate my 870's ... sometimes you just need to try other pumps to see for yourself what kind of absolute crap is on the market .

got my first 870 sp mag when i was 17 and its seriously smooth as silk, today ... 30 years later

I looked at a Marine Magnum a while ago, it had a plastic trigger guard.

 

[madashell]

my marine has metal trig guard.. bought it the year they came out, so thats awhile back

870's are great shotguns... i just had an experience with a tinchester 1200 pump yesterday that got jammed up when putting the barrel on in the field (due to sh-t ejector design ) it made me appreciate my 870's ... sometimes you just need to try other pumps to see for yourself what kind of absolute crap is on the market .

got my first 870 sp mag when i was 17 and its seriously smooth as silk, today ... 30 years later

This is the thing, guys want their SG's to be "30 year smooth".

They have the option of taking it to a good smith and have them polish it.

It's possible 30 year old Wingmaters were polished smoother than a new Wingmaster is today right from the factory, I can't really confirm that. If it was though, I highly doubt it was much smoother. And I doubt old or new was as smooth from the factory as the older 870P's I had smoothed out by Tac-Ord.

 

[phinton81]

Here is my pre-private equity 870 Wingmaster LW in 28ga. Bluing is high lustre, stock is high gloss, internals are polished beautifully. The action on this gun falls open and has done so since new. New Wingmasters are not the same, if you've got one made recently, post up some pics.

Patrick

 

[langbanger]

Here are pictures of my wingmaster purchased new in 2014. The trigger guard is not plastic. It runs flawlessly, cycles smoothly and looks pretty darn good in my opinion. I would not trade it for a 1950's wingmaster or any other pump for that matter. Sorry for the bathroom pics it's the best lighting in the house. It looks even better carrying it out in the field on a sunny day. From MY experience, all this talk about new wing masters being junk us BS.

 

[madashell]

Very nice WM phinton81.

.... but I dunno man, langbanger's WM looks pretty darn good for a new one !

Don't think I'd have a problem with either era judging by these photo's. (thanks for posting them guys).

 

[phinton81]

Here are pictures of my wingmaster purchased new in 2014. The trigger guard is not plastic. It runs flawlessly, cycles smoothly and looks pretty darn good in my opinion. I would not trade it for a 1950's wingmaster or any other pump for that matter. Sorry for the bathroom pics it's the best lighting in the house. It looks even better carrying it out in the field on a sunny day. From MY experience, all this talk about new wing masters being junk us BS.

Never said anything about junk, they've just had more corners cut and they are more expensive than ever, to those of us having owned older ones, they're not worth the money but certainly not junk.