mosin nagant

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I bought a matching set of Russian WW2 swords with the bayonet mounted to the side of the scabbard. Now I'm thinking I should have the appropriate rifle to go with them. If I remember right in the movie "Enemy at the Gates" there was a Russian Officer waving a sword towards the Germans when they attacked. Would he have a rifle as well as a revolver. Seems like alot of gear. Which rifle would he carry ???
 
In WWII it would have been a moisin, or maybe an SVT 40? Pistol would most likelty be a Nagant, or maybe a TT33? I am speculating here, but these were the majority of the Soviet issue firearms during WWII as far as I know.
 
I know little to Nothing about these rifles or swords. I just thought they were cool. :cool: What you call Impulse buying :D
WWllRussianswordswithbayonetironsca.jpg
 
got to go said:
I bought a matching set of Russian WW2 swords with the bayonet mounted to the side of the scabbard. Now I'm thinking I should have the appropriate rifle to go with them. If I remember right in the movie "Enemy at the Gates" there was a Russian Officer waving a sword towards the Germans when they attacked. Would he have a rifle as well as a revolver. Seems like alot of gear. Which rifle would he carry ???
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Those are Post 1881 Trooper's swords with the cruciform type Bayonet holder. The matching rifle would be the 91/30. SVT-40 uses a blade bayonet with a frog.

The Officer's job was to ensure that his men pushed the attack home and any who turned back from the attack were shot. PPSH for killing retreating soldiers, Nagant revolver for finishing off the wounded and a nice thick wall for hiding behind during the attack.
 
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In one of my copies of "Heraldry and Regalia of War" those swords are listed as "Post 1881 Troopers' Sabre with cruciform bayonet holder".

The picture I have is of an identical sword but there are no markings on the pommel/tang beyond a serial number. The sheath is unadorned and painted a medium brown, the brass polished. I see you have stamping/engraving on the blade above the fist guard. Close ups?

Officers swords are of a different "pattern" (think Cavalry) and have filigree and obviously no bayonet holder.

Swords are no different than rifles. They are the the 1918 "PATTERN" - they could have been manufactured at any time after - just like a Mosin Nagant 91/30 rifle.
 
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How long did they make these swords ? They seem so Archaic for WW2. Would it only be officers that were issued these ? Where officers also issued rifles ?
 
Sometimes officers were issued rifles but more often, they were issued revolvers and PPSH's. I believe swords were personal preferance to infantry, but very common among Cavalry commanders. If you could take a picture of the markings just below the hilt of the blade, I believe I see some etched markings on the steel.
 
I believe these types of swords with the side-mounted bayonets would have been issued to Dragoons or Cossaks Regiments. Its going to be hard to find the Mosin-Nagant 1891 Dragoon rifle used by these Regiments since most were converted to the 91/30 Pattern.
 
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Good score! I'm thinking Dragoon issue as Cossacks would have the guardless "Shashka" type sabres. I have seen a similar bayonet mounting on that type as well.

BTW, can you post pictures of the markings?
 
- The 1891/30 is not a Dragoon Rifle, the real Dragoon is different in many ways.

- Not only Officers but most Cavalrymen were armed with swords. Dragoons and Cossacks sometimes acted as Mounted Infantry they needed a rifle and bayonet
 
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Very nice swords! I would think they would be issued to either a Cavalry "Cossack" unit, or too a long-time serving officer as a "moral booster". I'm surprised they would still issue it, my understanding of the Soviet mentality was not to make one man stand "above his peers"?
 
You are correct. Not many people would carry swords unless they are commanders of some sort. If you had a horse you would have a mossin and a sword. SVT was more of sniper rifle.
JP said:
I believe these types of swords with the side-mounted bayonets would have been issued to Dragoons or Cossaks Regiments. Its going to be hard to find the Mosin-Nagant 1891 Dragoon rifle used by these Regiments since most were converted to the 91/30 Pattern.
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They're still not Officers' or Commander's swords. They're MOUNTED TROOPERS' swords. Cavalry was issued swords. Not belt fed machine guns, not SVT-40 semi auto rifles, not sniper rifles, not pocket battleships - SWORDS. Cossacks had their version, Dragoons had their version, etc. etc...

In places like the Second Ukrainian Front mounted infantry (ie. TROOPER) was indispensable. The Russians employed cavalry extensively - horses are easy to keep, cheap to feed and cover broken terrain better than pretty much any vehicle ever to mount a gun. A mounted soldier can cover miles in a day over ground that a tank or truck could not hope to cross at all.

The rifle was used for dismounted fighting. If you think it's easy to hit a man sized target off the back of a galloping horse with a bolt action rifle, you've seen too many cowboy movies. The Russians did not employ Cavalry like the Americans did. They did it like the Indians would have if they had thought of it first.

Mounted troops were used to patrol, scavenge and in flanking maneuvers. They hit flanks and supply lines while armor did the frontal attacking. Gallop through, chop up a few Germans, wheel about, repeat or dismount and use the rifles.

GOOGLE "Russian Cavalry Tactics". A little digging is necessary, but it's there. It's not like looking up "Mosin Nagant" and discovering your inner expert.
 
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