"must have" items

[alexD92]

Hello,
My dad and I have recently joined a new gun club with a range of 100 to 600 yards. My dad is already equipped for the little run, but for my part...im naked.

So I have been doing some shopping on my spare time, I was looking at a Remington 700 Police rifle and a Leupold Mk 4 LR/T 6.5-20x50 M1 30mm scope. Currently working on getting a good deal for the 700P and not sure about the scope.

What I really want to know is what items I should get. I need to be mobile enough since we will be moving from 100 to 200 and then 200 to 300 and so on.

I've heard about drag bags? Can i carry my ammo, spotting scope and other stuff I'd be needing for a day at the range?

Any suggestions would be appreciated,
Alex

PS. No spamming about me just being 16, I'm not just that, I'm planning on making a career out of firearms. This summer I am an apprentice at a local gunsmith, next year after highschool im taking the gunsmith course at Centre de formation professionnelle de La-Valle-De-La-Haute-Gatineau in Maniwaki

 

[maynard]

Just throw all you stuff in a range bag or duffle bag and hump it. Get a soft case with a shoulder strap for your rifle.
Tell your dad what he really needs is a Fold-it cart so you can both throw all your stuff into it. Google Fold-it cart. I think Sinclair Int'l also sells a range cart.
If you go to Ottawa during the CFRC you will see everything from modified baby strollers to deer carts to electric golf carts. Then you will see cadets walking around with all their kit stuffed into a duffle bag, thrown over one shoulder and carrying RPA target rifles over the other.
A good drag bag is about 1/2 the cost of a 700P.

 

[sendero]

This school is excellent, my friend is certified gunsmith from this school, what can help you a LOT is try to learn basic milling and lathe turning in the mean time

where are you in quebec alex...

congrat

sendero

 

[Blygy]

I was looking @ a Mark 4 really hard and recieved some good advice.. The reticle in the mark 4s is in Mils.. the turrets in MOA. this requires some calculations to make adjustments..

The nightforce and IOR both offer scopes with MOA reticle and MOA turrets.

This makes corrections easier..

Just something to think about..

I'm saving for a nightforce.. Half way there now..

 

[catnthehatt]

Like Maynard said Alex, a fold-it works well, as do some of the small garden carts available.
The problem with a drag bag is that although they hold a lot of stuff, you still need to carry things like a shooting mat/ground sheet, and sometimes a spotting scope needs to be broken down to go into the bag, which is a lot easier to put it into the cart.
IOR, BTW , are fine scopes, but the warranty for them I have found takes upwards to half a year to get you scope back if there is an issue with it!
I have more than a few of them, but if I buy another it will be a Leupold or Nightforce, just in case.
Cat

 

[alexD92]

Thanks for the replies guys.

@ Sendero: Im in Valcartier.

Carts sound good but I dont know how practical they would be in case of zombie invasion. Anyways, we already have a small range bag where we put the spotting scope, targets, stapler and other little gimmies. a larger one might be good.

But i'd probably need to get another case for the rifle, but if i get some sort of drag bag or shooting mat that servers as both case and mat and also has some pouches then i might be saving something somewhere, I've seen some Condor gear at my local army surplus, already have a smaller case for one of my rifles, its nice not as great as other real world stuff but does the job.

Also, what seems to be the best price for the 700P these days? i've seen 1005$ a little higher but nothing lower then that.

 

[2bad4u2]

I've heard about drag bags? Can i carry my ammo, spotting scope and other stuff I'd be needing for a day at the range?

Probably the best $200 I ever spent. I got an Arktis brand bag from the group buy here a while past. I use it every single trip to the range as requires me to walk about 300 yds. to the firing line.

Sure, you'll need to carry other items but that's why it's nice when a second or third person tags along to pick up the slack.

A good drag bag is about 1/2 the cost of a 700P.

Not necessarily so, though some are quite elaborate and expensive.

I see that you're joining a 600 yds. range. Why not consider a Rem 700 LTR if weight savings and compact storage are considerations? It's more money than a 700P but it's an option worth some thought. That rifle is more than capable for the ranges you're looking to shoot at. Something to consider.

 

[alexD92]

I see that you're joining a 600 yds. range. Why not consider a Rem 700 LTR if weight savings and compact storage are considerations? It's more money than a 700P but it's an option worth some thought. That rifle is more than capable for the ranges you're looking to shoot at. Something to consider.

I'm not sure about the LTR, doesnt it come as a package? Not too fond about packages.

And what advantage does the LTR version have over the standard Police one?

PS.
A good drag bag might be half the cost of a 700P, but how rough is a day at the range? As long as the zippers on it dont break I'm happy with it.

 

[2bad4u2]

No, a LTR is just the rifle itself, not a package. Advantages/differences? Stock isn't as bulky (shorter and slimmer fore-end), shorter fluted 20" barrel, more compact, doesn't have the annoying HS Precision palm swell, and lighter weight.

A drag bag is worth the cost. Follow the link... h ttp://www.arktisusa.com/Professional/Specialist/

 

[alexD92]

That's what I like about the 700P, it has a fat fore-end making it more stable (at least thats what I think), a longer barrel and the swelled grip. At first when i held it, it felt weird, but I held it for a little while and kinda liked it.

Alex.

 

[Glock-a-maniac]

Annoying palm swells are for guys with small hands. LOL
Anyways, you're on the right track. drag bag definitely. Lots of pockets. Rem700P over LTR. Nightforce over Leupold anyday. If you pick up a 5.5-22x50mm NPR-1 reticle, you won't need a spotting scope unless you're shooting 800yds plus. Spend the money, get a decent scope with MOA ret. and MOA turrets, and you'll never regret it. I just sent you a PM.

Cheers,

T

P.S. Carts are for old farts. LOL

 

[alexD92]

From what I've been told by experienced shooters at that range, the spotting scope isnt for the holes in the target, its for seeing the mirage, or something like that.

I've checked out the Nightforce optics, they are all 50mm? isnt that a little big? i mean, its not like im hunting at down and dusk and need as much light as i can get.

 

[maple_leaf_eh]

If your question was about what gear to bring to the shooting range, here is my short list:
rifle AND BOLT
case
trigger lock and key
cleaning rod and assorted supplies
spotting scope on tripod
scorebook, notebook and pen
ammunition
stapler
targets
bug spray
sun screen
something to rest the rifle on
something to absord the recoil with
box for empties
screwdrivers and wrenches to tighten the obvious pieces
anything and everything else in the gun room that I think I might need

I have a couple of canvas duffle bags and a hard box, which I almost never use amymore. A drag bag is a fancy name for a sniper's soft-sided case. I don't care about looking good, just as long as I have all my stuff.

 

[Epoxy7]

If you're thinking Remington:
the LTR as others have mentioned. 20 inch barrel, smaller stock, fluted barrel.

The police model. 26" bull barrel, HS stock with flat forend and palm swell.

The 5R milspec. 24 inch bull barrel 11.25 twist rate, 5r radial rifling, HS stock with flat forend and palm swell.

Nightforce is a good scope choice but spendy. Zeiss Conquest is a decent sporting scope at a good price. I think it's better than the Leupold MKIII, but that's personal preference.

As for mildots. I prefer scopes with hold over marks rather than mildots. MP20 reticles are more my thing if you had to have a mildot distance reticle. That being said, laser rangefinders are a lot more accurate. A laser rangefinder with a good reticle that has accurate hold over points and you're set.

 

[kombayotch]

If you want to do a lot of long range:

-Kestrel wind/weather meter
-Old Palm pilot w/ballistics calculator.
-Anti-cant scope level.
-Camel pack/canteen
-Cleaning kit.
-Hat to keep the sun off, maybe a bandanna for the back of the neck.

 

[Hammerhead]

I would defiantely go with the 700P over the LTR. The LTR is nice, but it's not going to get you out to the distances that the 700P will. Just get a trigger job and bedding done and you have a super accurate rifle at a relatively cheap price. I've had mine out to 850yrds no problem. As for the palm swell, I like it, in fact I like the 700P stock MUCH more then the LTR stock.
As for the scope, I had mounted on mine a Leupold Mark 4 6.5-20x50 with an illuminated TMR reticle and loved it. That scope has since moved onto my H-S Precision HTR .300wm and I now have a Mark 4 4-14x50 with the TMR on the 700. I have never had a problem with the Leupold scopes and I am very fond of their TMR reticle. I also know that their customer service is second to none. I know that people say that the nightforce are a better option and they very well may be, but I like the Mark 4's and I figure that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. But whatever you buy, I would recommend you purchase an anti-cant device for it just like Kombayotch said. Hope that helps a little.

 

[2bad4u2]

I would defiantely go with the 700P over the LTR. The LTR is nice, but it's not going to get you out to the distances that the 700P will.

Sure, the longer barrel will give you a bit more distance because of the slight edge in muzzle velocity, however, it'll likely be no more than a 200 yard difference. At the 600 yard line, either will perform well.

I have a custom .308 700 based on a 700P stock, a .308 700 VSF, a custom .243 700 on a LTR stock, a .223 LTR, and I just aquired another LTR stock for a future .300 Whisper custom.

Based on my experience alone, I feel the LTR offers more by giving you less.

My suggestion is to shoot both if you have the means to do so. If you just instinctively like the 700P, then go for it! In the end, it doesn't really matter which stock you go with as long as it fits you, you're comfortable shooting it, and don't mind the extra weight.

From what I've been told by experienced shooters at that range, the spotting scope isnt for the holes in the target, its for seeing the mirage, or something like that.

With a 20x power scope you'll get all the mirage you want and more. If anything, you may end up going with a reduced magnication so the target doesn't appear to move around so much.

A spotting scope would be useful in estimating wind direction and speed by viewing wind flags, tree/grass/vegetation movement, and to an extent the movment of the mirrage (ie. broiling upwards vs. side movement).

At 600 yds. you'll need the spotting scope to help spot holes unless of course someone is using marking discs which would make the spotting scope somewhat unecessary for that particular task.

 

[Obtunded]

If you have a rifle scope with side focus, all you need to do is dial back your focus to read mirage... works very well. Spotting scopes are one of those things that there is no point wasting money on for a cheap one. Look through someone's Leica or Pentax ED to see what I mean.

The bottom line is you'll want a rifle that YOU like but I second the opinion that an LTR is a good option. For all intents and purposes, you will not lose an appreciable amount of velocity and you may actually gain accuracy with a short stiff barrel.

 

[bigmatty]

Needs :
- Rifle ( remmy 700p or 5r)
- Scope ( without breaking the bank get a Mk4 with TMR reticle, NF are great for to start you dont need it)
- Bipod ( Harris swivel with pod-lock)
- Rear bag
And most important...

AMMO

shoot, shoot and shoot

You can have all the gadgets in the world but without trigger time and getting use to your set up they are useless.

 

[alberta tactical rifle]

From what I've been told by experienced shooters at that range, the spotting scope isnt for the holes in the target, its for seeing the mirage, or something like that.

I've checked out the Nightforce optics, they are all 50mm? isnt that a little big? i mean, its not like im hunting at down and dusk and need as much light as i can get.

Larger objectives will gather and pass more light through to your eye. The more light transmitted means the clearer and easier the image will be to see, especially at higher magnifications. This is assuming same quality of optics is used for comparison purposes.
NF makes low magnification scopes in 24mm objectives, and higher magnification scopes in 50 and 56mm objectives, all are 30mm tubes though.

The higher the magnification the thicker the lens needs to be, so to keep the lens from resembling a football shape they make the lens larger in diameter to prevent as much distortion. There is more to it, but you get the idea.

Having more magnification than you really need is not a bad thing, it is easy to turn down a scope with lots of magnification, but very hard to turn 1 up past the upper power on a low magnification scope.

Hammerhead I agree the service from Leupold is excellent, until you have an issue with a MK4, then YOU are responsible to get the permits in place to return it to Beaverton Oregon. Korth, the warranty depot for Leupold in Canada does not repair any MK4 or CQT scopes.
MK4 scopes are very good, why however Leupold insists on using moa turrets with milradian reticles eludes me, WAY too much math for this old guy.

The difference in cost between a 6.5x20x50 MK4 TMR Illuminated and the NF 5.5x22x50 is $100.00. All NF scopes have illuminated reticles.

The differences between the 700P and the LTR are marginal, the extra 6" of barrel will add some weight to the end of the rifle, this will have a slight recoil reduction effect, due to the added barrel weight. Bullet velocity will also be slightly higher. To say that a 20" barrel will make it harder to get to 1000 yards is rubbish.
We built several 308s this year for the BCRA match that all have 21.75" long barrels, and we shoot them well beyond 1000 yards with no problem.
Where longer barrels in 308 shine is with iron sights, the sight radius is longer.