My box test looks like a diamond

ebruder

ebruder

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Hi guys...

I am in need of your collective wisdom...

I took my new TR iron sights out today... shot a box test for fun, and my box looked like a diamond...

First group in the middle... second group (adjust up) up and left... third group (adjust right) was higher than it should have been and right... fourth group (adjust down) came in lower and more right than it should... and the last group (adjust left) was back where it started...

This tells me that the sights adjust reliably, the square was there, just rotated counter clockwise 15 degrees...

Now I'm trying to diagnose the problem...

Do you think my front sight is off plumb?


I'd appreciate your input.

EB
 
Sounds like the sights are not lined up with gravity or (as you called it) plumb. This means that 1.0 unit of elevation will give you (for example) 0.7 units of elevation and 0.5 units of windage and vise-versa.

I've never leveled iron sights but setting a scope up so that it is plumb is the first and arguably the most important thing in precision shooting. Once set up, there is no need for a bubble level. Those are required for another thing.
 
Sights either not plumb or you have a wicked cant going on. Does your front sight have a level in it? You can but Gehmen front sight levels that fit betweem the sight body and the iris. The iris holds it in place when you tighten it up to the sight body.
 
maynard said:
Sights either not plumb or you have a wicked cant going on. Does your front sight have a level in it? You can but Gehmen front sight levels that fit betweem the sight body and the iris. The iris holds it in place when you tighten it up to the sight body.
Click to expand...
This past year a master shooter from Saskatchewan, sorry can't remember the name, noticed I didn't have the rifle level at a match. I was to busy to even check the level but I was sure off even though everything in the site picture looked great. I will have to try this test myself and see how much of a difference there is shooting what appears level and what is.
 
Firstly, congrats. It's particularly nice to hear of a new TR shooter coming out to play (we sure need 'em!).

At what distance did you do this test? What kind of rear and front sight are you using? Does your front sight have a bubble level? Does your front sight element have anything that would give you a horizontal reference? (Anschutz apertures have an arm from the left and an arm from the right which give you a horizontal cue; Tiger plastic elements have a fine horizontal line scribed across the bottom portion; some front sights are square in shape, so the sight body itself provides horizontal and vertical cues).

If your box is rotated by 15 degrees, that's a fair bit. Whatever the cause of this is, it is not subtle; it should be clearly and unmistakably visible once you find it or figure it out. You won't need precision measurement tools, a simple glance will tell you, once you are looking at the correct thing.

One possibility is that your rifle and sights are correctly set up, but you fired the test with a fairly consistent 15 degree cant. Note that this is *not* a subtle amount of cant, at all; if when you were firing the sequence, the sight picture looked basically correct (i.e. your front sight was visibly level more or less, then this is not the problem.

Another possibility is that you are shooting the target with your front sight square to the target, as you should be, but your rear sight is mounted 15 degrees off-vertical with respect to your front sight. Have a look at your rifle - if the rear sight looks more or less "straight up and down" with respect to your front sight, then this is not the problem.

If those aren't the problem, would you be able to take a photo of your rifle, which includes both the rear and front sight, and post it here?
 
Hi again. Thanks for the input so far...

I am using a PGW single shot target action with an integrated picatinny rail on the top of the action... I am using a phoenix precision rear and front sight set... the front sight has a clear lens with the round circle without the cross bars. I do have a sight bubble level...

I think the front sight was off level... I leveled the rifle (well... the scope rail) and the front sight was off... so I've re-plumbed it...

Now I will re-try it with the sight re-adjusted... I'll also shoot it off the bench too to make sure it's the sights...

I'll let you know how it goes.

EB
 
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