My freakin flash hider fell off!!

muscles1000

muscles1000

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WELL... isn't this just GREAT!

Ok... I am hoping the M14/M305 brain trust on here can come to my aid once again...

Last weekend i did a bit of shooting with some pals in the woods. During this excursion the vortex flash hider actually fell off my Norc shorty... i don't know when this occurred but it is gone... it was never loose before... and yet when i got back to camp... no flash hider...D*MNIT.

I am certainly not going to the woods with a metal detector so a new one is the only choice. As i am the second owner of this piece i have no real idea what kind of flash hider the old one was, as a consequence, i don't know what the threading pattern will accept in terms of a replacement. (it MIGHT be a rooster33 item, maybe...someone might have suggested that at an M14 clinic)

I do, however, have a picture of the old one on the gun...(see below) so if someone here can tell me what kind of flash hider it was and has ANY idea if the threading would work with an SEI vortex than i will give them 1000 INTERNETS!!! w:h:

Thanks everyone!! :)

(yes i felt massively stupid when i got back to camp and saw the threaded barrel, thank you for asking!:rolleyes:)

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What are the threads on the barrel?
Measure them, and you will be able to consider replacement options.
Then you will be able to get a new unit, and some Loctite.
 
muscles1000 said:
I do, however, have a picture of the old one on the gun...(see below) so if someone here can tell me what kind of flash hider it was and has ANY idea if the threading would work with an SEI vortex than i will give them 1000 INTERNETS!!! w:h:
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I tried a SEI Direct Connect California Compensator p/n 2015 (same thread pattern as the SEI DC Vortex p/n 2000V) on a spare Chinese barrel. It's NO GO. The metric thread pattern is not close enough for the imperial dimension SEI Direct Connect muzzle attachments.
 
After you have determined what threads you have, and are picking a replacement, you might want to consider a brake rather than a flash hider.
 
Different said:
I tried a SEI Direct Connect California Compensator p/n 2015 (same thread pattern as the SEI DC Vortex p/n 2000V) on a spare Chinese barrel. It's NO GO. The metric thread pattern is not close enough for the imperial dimension SEI Direct Connect muzzle attachments.
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OMG!!!
These "flash hidder's" are harder to find than hens teeth up here in canada too.
Were did you say you lost it? :rolleyes:
 
Guys..... that is NOT a Dlask product
Dlask never made a Vortex type or NAV-14 with those machining details.... I 100 % guarantee it.
 
M14Doctor said:
Guys..... that is NOT a Dlask product
Dlask never made a Vortex type or NAV-14 with those machining details.... I 100 % guarantee it.
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Actually he did for AR series, a few years ago, and got into trouble with Smith Enterprises. Wolverine sold them. The Helix on the hider was in the wrong direction.
 
RePete said:
Actually he did for AR series, a few years ago, and got into trouble with Smith Enterprises. Wolverine sold them. The Helix on the hider was in the wrong direction.
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as with many things you read on the internet, this is NOT correct.
Dlask did several years back manufacture a flash hider similar to the smith enterprise Vortex. I've spoken with ron smith on the subject and there has been NO contact between Mr Ron Smith and Mr Joe Dlask about this muzzle device. Yes wolverine did stock the dlask type at one time, and YES a sample of that flash hider was sent to Smith Ent. This was MANY years ago now.

there was another machinist making m14 items that many of us are aware of that was copying smith ent items and got slapped for it, his business shut down and to this day he has not brought his product line back to cgn, his mistake was marketting clones smith ent items to brownells. He made muzzle devices, scout mounts, tactical bolt stops and several other items..... and he was from Chilliwack. I will not post the name but it has already been mentioned in this thread. I KNOW this as I have spoken with Ron Smith directly on the issue.

THIS IS A DLASK NAV-14 flash eliminator.... and yes it resembles the smith ent trademarked Vortex. the issue with the whole deal is the name, as Vortex flash hider is a trade mark name owned by smith enterprise.
M14Doctor30calVortex.jpg

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The dlask version's Vanes are also cut in such a fashion that they self tighten the flash eliminator while firing. I have never had a client complain about them and i've seen 100's go through my hands.
 
M14Doctor said:
as with many things you read on the internet, this is NOT correct.
Dlask did several years back manufacture a flash hider similar to the smith enterprise Vortex. I've spoken with ron smith on the subject and there has been NO contact between Mr Ron Smith and Mr Joe Dlask about this muzzle device. Yes wolverine did stock the dlask type at one time, and YES a sample of that flash hider was sent to Smith Ent. This was MANY years ago now.

there was another machinist making m14 items that many of us are aware of that was copying smith ent items and got slapped for it, his business shut down and to this day he has not brought his product line back to cgn, his mistake was marketting clones smith ent items to brownells. He made muzzle devices, scout mounts, tactical bolt stops and several other items..... and he was from Chilliwack. I will not post the name but it has already been mentioned in this thread. I KNOW this as I have spoken with Ron Smith directly on the issue.

THIS IS A DLASK NAV-14 flash eliminator.... and yes it resembles the smith ent trademarked Vortex. the issue with the whole deal is the name, as Vortex flash hider is a trade mark name owned by smith enterprise.
M14Doctor30calVortex.jpg

M14DoctorVortex.jpg



The dlask version's Vanes are also cut in such a fashion that they self tighten the flash eliminator while firing. I have never had a client complain about them and i've seen 100's go through my hands.
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He did, because a gunsmith friend of mine had them on his web site and Smith Enterprises saw them and threatened him with a law suit and they asked him to send one to them, which he did. I have seen the lawyers letter that was sent to him.

He bought them in good faith from Wolverine and Wolverine bought them in good faith from Dlask..
 
OLD NEWS and this has been rehashed in several threads. i'd post a link but it's really not something that needs everyone's attention.
that thread link was emailed by 2 people from CGN to Smith ent, last year, one of those being me.
from smith ent's position, the issue is the "trademark" violation and despite what some would rant....... not about a "patent" violation.
TRUE Ron Smith aggressively seeks out and challenges all infringements of HIS trademark. He did so with the U.S. military and won..... again , old news and posted right on his site.
I have permission to share with you the emails that have gone back and forth between me and Ron Smith over the past year or so regarding the product with the trademark, VORTEX FLASH HIDER, but from where i sit , there is no point.

Bottom line...... and as i was to understand from my direct communication with Ron Smith AND Joe Dlask on this topic...... even though there are specific machining differences between the Smith Enterprise Vortex and the Dlask product, they are NOT the same item as far as the "patent" is concerned. However, Dlask can not call the flash hider a Vortex without risking "trademark" violation ..... IF Smith Enterprise applies for and is granted trademark rights in Canada. Something he himself told me recently he was pursuing on all his products.

Long and short, and i don't care what the opinions of some here might be.....get yer facts in line before starting another ... yippeee.... let's trash on dlask again thread.

As I stated, Ron Smith himself, in his own words explained to me how he did go after and put out of business an M14 parts maker from chilliwack who not only violated U.S. patent law, also violated trademark law on several of his products that he marketted here on CGN and in the U.S. through Brownells.

my point...... if Smith Enterprise went after one outfit for violations ... and as stated by Mr. Smith himself, he aggressively pursues trademark and patten violations.... even against the U.S. military (one of his largest clients) ....... someone here with more info than myself can enlighten me on why ZERO patent or trademark violations nor any legal , lawyer written "cease and desist orders" have landed on Joe Dlask's desk via those representing Smith Enterprises. Ron Smith did tell me he was setting his sights on ANY violators in the U.S. or abroad and was as of about 6 months ago (as per my email records) he was indeed trying to secure trademark and patent protection rights in Canada.

the last time this whole crap came up about this flash hider I suggested to Joe that if his flash hider is in fact different, however small the difference may be..... he would be wise to market it under a different name to avoid any trademark infringements. I suggested this as I have a lot of respect for Ron Smith for taking the time to make things clear for me on the issue..... and in the end, I agree with the principles behind trademark protection. I did not read a bunch of crap on the internet and run around preaching misinformation on the subject.
Joe's flash hider is not new..... it's been around for MANY years now........ I see no legal battles or threats of legal battles from smith ent to dlask...... mind you , I'm not the guy opening Joe's mail hehehehe

the dlask flash hider is called the NAV-14 Eliminator and is NOT a smith enterprise Vortex plain and simple.

My apologies to muscles1000 for my part in this thread veering off your original question.
If you are worried that it was a Dlask product from early days....... take the photos you posted with you to dlask on tilbury island and tell him i sent you...... he will verify for you if that unit came from his shop.
 
I do not remember every early variation of the dlask model but i can tell you, the one you have appears longer than any dlask version i've seen. measure the length and get back to me here or by p.m.
I am also not aware of all the versions made by R33 , he made versions of several of smiths items including muzzle brakes and flash hiders. When I first came to gunnutz several years back (as 45ACPKING) and joined the site with what I bring to the table (as per m14's) , R33 products were still availlable at brownells and here on CGN for a VERY short time. There are others here such as Skullboy, GirlsGunsnfastBikes ect that will be MUCH more familiar with the R33 products as shortly after I joined CGN, his status as a M14 part/accessory manufacturer went innactive. I do believe he frequents the site and associates with many lowermainland service rifle shooters that I am aquainted with..... but I have never been privvy to info directly from himas to what all products he did make and why he no longer makes them. I have only spoken with Ron Smith and Joe Dlask , directly, about products being discussed here.

so long and short...... I gots no idea who made that one but i will concede that it could be an early, very early dlask version....... but i'm thinkin not.
 
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I appreciate everyone weighing in on this. I have decided on a course of action: As per M14Doc... will hit up Dlask with the pics, called them this AM and they seemed cool with taking a look at the thread pattern/pix and sorting this out for me... at what cost i don't know, but at least that is a solution.

I am beginning to suspect quite strongly that this item came from the defunct shop that was mentioned earlier. IF that's the case (i really liked that flash hider and the neat machining details) then I am going to the damn woods with a damn metal detector... we collected our casings but i am sure it will be a fun afternoon with the mosquitoes and who knows how many casing we missed on the cleanup to complicate the search.

Finally i will attempt to to contact the old owner, he is around here somewhere... and see if he has some input on this.

Thanks again for your opinions everyone. Thomas, your time is particularly appreciated!!
 
M14Doctor said:
I do not remember every early variation of the dlask model but i can tell you, the one you have appears longer than any dlask version i've seen. measure the length and get back to me here or by p.m.
I am also not aware of all the versions made by R33 , he made versions of several of smiths items including muzzle brakes and flash hiders. When I first came to gunnutz several years back (as 45ACPKING) and joined the site with what I bring to the table (as per m14's) , R33 products were still availlable at brownells and here on CGN for a VERY short time. There are others here such as Skullboy, GirlsGunsnfastBikes ect that will be MUCH more familiar with the R33 products as shortly after I joined CGN, his status as a M14 part/accessory manufacturer went innactive. I do believe he frequents the site and associates with many lowermainland service rifle shooters that I am aquainted with..... but I have never been privvy to info directly from himas to what all products he did make and why he no longer makes them. I have only spoken with Ron Smith and Joe Dlask , directly, about products being discussed here.

so long and short...... I gots no idea who made that one but i will concede that it could be an early, very early dlask version....... but i'm thinkin not.
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I would send you the length pronto-tonto but i actually lost the damn thing...I never saw it fall off!!! it is entirely possible one of my pals fired the gun without it a few times. In fact i think the gun jammed on the last mag we put thru it.

The little bastard is under a leaf on the side of a mountain about half a km from an old logging road somewhere north of Pemberton.
 
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