My personal M14 evolution

Ardent

Ardent

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Well, this is kind of an odd thread, but I wanted to ask and see if anyone else is in the same boat. I once heard a fellow here say of AR's, that most start with a 20" rifle, then they deck out their AR and progresses to a carbine shorty with all the bells and whistles, and ends up back with a standard, boring, 16" or 20" AR pretty much stock by the end of it all.

Well, this is true for my AR's, and is even more true in concept for my M14's. What I've found is that I started with a stock M305, loved it, then started adding parts... USGI stock first, then a TRW bolt, then a Smith Ent Navy Sight, then a scout mount, then reparkerizing, then a Smith Vortex flash hider... then I built another from scratch with everything being TRW except the receiver... And there was about 3 more after that. What did I find? I liked em stock. :p

I found the stock Norinco's shot just about as well as the tweaked guns, and I found I preferred the M14's excellent iron sights to the in my mind poorly suited optics platforms. I find the ergonomics of the M14 and its sights make it an exceptional iron sight rifle and a fairly poor scope platform.

There are 4 mods I still do, none of which I really need to do but one (op spring) to make me happy but I wouldn't stop doing them; a USGI op spring, a USGI stock, a set of Springfield National Match sights, and for vanity's sake reparkerizing, though 50% of mine are original finish, it does just fine.

I found I shoot just as or more effectively with the iron sights, especially the NM sets, as the cantankerous scope setups. The scope's groups are tighter, but I mean effectiveness, as far as speed to aim and amount of time between aimed shots and sighting on the target again after recoil. I can comfortably hit targets of reasonable size at 600 yards or more with the stocks sights, to me that's fantastic, I have yet to try those ranges with my NM sights but I can't wait to push farther. I find the rifles a joy to carry as issued, the scope systems I had, not so much, with their high optics levels and cheek rests. I also find the stock barrel too light for precision work, this is not a deficiency, I just realized the role the M14 fills for me. Perhaps with a heavy barrel, it would be better suited, but frankly at that point I'd turn to a boltgun or AR10, then again the AR10's restricted and the M14's a steal so I don't look down on those who choose to accurize them, it still makes sense, I'm simply stating what the M14 is for me.

So in the end I ended up with pretty much stock Norincos, just a few tweaks, and love em. The bolt's are just great, barrels decent (yes the USGI barrels I installed did improve things a tad, but not a much), and everything but the stock and op spring top notch. Anyone else ran into this sentiment or is it just me? :redface:
 
I myself am going to do just the most basic upgrades - op rod spring guide, USGI stock, and some gas shims. I felt these would probably provide the most cost effective improvements yielding good gains, and anything past this would start to become more expensive improvements for small gains (the law of diminishing returns). For my wants this is all I need. I'm not after a 'tack driver', but more of a 'battle rifle'. Thanks for reinforcing my thoughts about what mods provide the best 'bang for your buck'.

That said, I have two. One will be a 18.5" shorty (fiberglass stock), the other will be remain a full length barrel (birch stock). As we know, for the 18.5" the Navy front sight is the only option, and I think I'd like to try a Smith Vortex on it.

Nice post Ardent, thanks.
 
Ardent said:
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There are 4 mods I still do, none of which I really need to do but one (op spring) to make me happy but I wouldn't stop doing them; a USGI op spring, a USGI stock, a set of Springfield National Match sights, and for vanity's sake reparkerizing, though 50% of mine are original finish, it does just fine.
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I could get away from the USGI Fiberglass version...Just like that wood feeling, however I tried a Mcmillan stock on a SuperMatch M1A...WOW!
 
I'm with you there, and by USGI I mean either wood of fiberglass, here's one of each from my vault:


P1030898.jpg

P1030893.jpg
 
This is a journey I'll be taking soon. I'm looking forward to the trip.

PS Love that shiney new GI fibreglass stock.
 
Steiner said:
I myself am going to do just the most basic upgrades - op rod spring guide, USGI stock, and some gas shims. I felt these would probably provide the most cost effective improvements yielding good gains, and anything past this would start to become more expensive improvements for small gains (the law of diminishing returns). For my wants this is all I need. I'm not after a 'tack driver', but more of a 'battle rifle'. Thanks for reinforcing my thoughts about what mods provide the best 'bang for your buck'.

That said, I have two. One will be a 18.5" shorty (fiberglass stock), the other will be remain a full length barrel (birch stock). As we know, for the 18.5" the Navy front sight is the only option, and I think I'd like to try a Smith Vortex on it.

Nice post Ardent, thanks.
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No worries, as for the op spring guide, I think that's one of the best money pits haha, the Norc one is just fine, same as USGI. All that really needs changing there is the spring, I honestly never noted any benefit in spring life or reliability from the cylindrical style guides, another mod I tried for awhile.
 
Yup I had my m14 'tricked' out on a student budget (scope + mount, r33 cheekrest, recoil buffer, nm spring guide.. etc) and I tore them all off and prefer the regular stock m14 (with the exception of the buffer and spring guide)
 
the_big_mike said:
Yup I had my m14 'tricked' out on a student budget (scope + mount, r33 cheekrest, recoil buffer, nm spring guide.. etc) and I tore them all off and prefer the regular stock m14 (with the exception of the buffer and spring guide)
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In that case, if your looking to sell the r33 cheekrest......:D
 
Ardent ... life is a circle ... with a few side trips in between.
BUT,
you did not mention the shorties ... every time I get a 14, whatever make, sooner or later it goes into the bench grinder to grind off some of that 22" barrel.
The 14s just balance better, and handle faster for me with an 18 1/2" barrel. Of course, the idea of a full powered 7.62 NATO riflwe as a CQB weapon is a bit of an OXYMORON ... but I keep going there.

enjoy the journey ...
 
Stock guns are fun. When I go to the range quite often the buzzards come around to shoot my guns and offer their foolish evaluations. They shoot the serious guns, then grab my old standard mauser and start chasing the 200 yard gong with it. By the time they start to hit with it regularly...they have burned up all my ammo and then look at me with sheepish, foolish expressions on their faces and feeble excuses for their ammo gluttony. The mauser always runs out of ammo first; it never fails.

There is a mentality setting up among the younger shooters that they have to have all the tricks of the pimped out rifle in order to shoot effectively. The fact is that unless you are in the military, or you are hunting trophies and medals and are up against snipers...most of those mods are unnecessary.

Shoot off your hind feet. Get off the bench. Practice the positions. Compete against the other gun geeks. Have fun- and take no prisoners.
 
PS- I used to be that way too about guns. I think most serious gun geeks are for the most part. Serious guns have their place...but the fun guns are often where you would least expect them.
 
Yeah, I have the most fun competing with a friend to see who can hit a brick from farthest away with the same iron sighted gun. Scopes are fine when you're trying to get down to nitty gritty precision at long range, but iron sights are just so simply and easy.
 
I too have gone from stock M14s all the way to BIG $$$$$$$ custom builds and back.:rolleyes:

The stock M1A/M14/M305s are decent shooters in the stock form.For those looking for a fun rifle to plink with at the range/in the bush, you are good to go after a GOOD degreasing.

However for those in search of peak accuracy, there lies a long and expensive road ahead.;) Is it worth it???? You are the only judge.I have had custom M14s that would hold 0.25 MOA out to 300 meters and hold 0.5 MOA out to 600 meters.Some were built for me, and some were built by me.The last custom M14 I built for myself would of been around $4000.00 if I didn't have a good source for parts and didn't do all the work myself.

The only Mods I really recomend are:

-Ditch the Chu wood stock. Go USGI fiberglass or aftermarket wood.
-Replace the op rod spring with the USGI spring.
-Replace the op rod guide with the NM round guide.
-Shim the gas cylinder if needed.

These all all relatively cheap and easy to do.Except the gas cylinder shimming.Proper tools are required and can be a pain in the ass with Norincos.

My last M14 I sold off (I no longer have any at this time...:rolleyes: ) was a 18.5" shorty with iron ghost ring/Navy sights, that above listed mods, and a USGI TRW bolt.This was my K.I.S.S. gun.Np optics and handy to point and shoot.With iron sights out to 200 meters, I could nail a 12" X 12" steel plate pretty much every time.

You have to decide what you want to do with the rifle, what you expect it to do, and how much money and time you want to spend tuning it.

A lot of the new M14 style rifle owners don't realise how maintenace intensive the M14 is, and how much tuning is required to get peak accuracy from it.

Been there.............Done that...........MANY times........;)

SKBY.:D
 
Ardent said:
Anyone else ran into this sentiment or is it just me? :redface:
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I am just starting this M14 journey. Having gone a few years without a center fire rifle I have put allot of personal criteria and pragmatism choosing this rifle. It is and will be my only center fire rifle for a very, very long time. The one gun that will do it all. Will it be stock? Most likely but it will evolve to meet the requirement for the different tasks I will demand from it. I think it was Jeff Cooper or maybe Elmer Keith that said that a man should have one good rifle and one a good handgun to be complete. Will this humble, cheap to most, Norinco M14S meet this idiosyncratic ultimatum?

I will probably succumb to the advises of the experienced orators of this forum. But I have to remain passionately practical if I want to meet my objectives. This was a list of the prerequisite for the one rifle I will use for everything. (1) It needs a good set of iron sites. (2) It needs to be legal to hunt big game in Canada. (3) It need to be a caliber that is extremely accessible from surplus, commercial, and hand loads components. (4) It has available parts form different manufactures. (6) It can deliver a fast second shot. (7) It has the potential to carry more than 5 rounds. (8) It can accurately deliver devastation up to a 600 yards on soft or hard targets. (9) It will handle necessary abuse to get the job done. (10) It has to have natural pointing ability like a shotgun at skeet. (11) It can be used for an IPSC 3 gun match and other matches I can find for it. (12) It can use strip clips to reload. (13) It can take both a forward scope (scout) mount or traditional scope mount. (14) It has to have a integral storage area on the butt stock for doodads. (15) It needs to be inexpensive. (16) It has the potential to be upgraded or even transformed if needed. (17) My favorite, it has to age well when it's all scratched, dinged, faded and old.

Give me that one rifle that I call my own and I will master it in every way possible. I want to see if this Norinco M14S will meet this rifle challenge as STOCK as possible. I hope so. BTW, I've been shooting the same handgun since I was 14 years old. It's a Colt MKIV series, single stacked in 45 ACP. I've put that gun through the paces from carrying in in the woods to shooting pistol matches. I'm originally from the states if you wondering about the carrying in the woods part. I had to eventually retire it after 27 years of service with me three years ago. I am now 41. I am now shooting a SA loaded, single stack 45ACP for everything. See the route this M14 will be taking soon. :)
 
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