N.W.M.P. marked Lee Metford carbine
- Thread starter Iron Duke
- Start date
- Location
- In the Badlands of Alberta
There was a sporterized one sold on the EE last spring for $175 if I remember correctly.
Jwirecom109
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Rural Alberta
pictures help judge the value
Actually a wee bit more than that, Sean. I bought it, and it had a cracked receiver, (which I knew about at the time of purchase.)
There is a certain range of known serial numbers to these Carbines, and they are not all in sequence. Because of the scarcity, there have been attempted alterations to some of these in order for unscrupulous people to get a lot of money for them.
Fore-ends have been spliced, (much like some Ross rifles), and non-carbine actions have been used. Bolts and Magazines are very different too.
As mentioned, detailed pictures are necessary to value something like this. Particularly the butt stock, the fore-end, and the action.
However, I will say that a butt stock alone was being advertised for over $300 a while ago.
Lets see some detailed pictures.
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Well, after descending into the cave to check it out, the NWMP carbine is a Lee Enfield, the Lee Metford is marked to a Hussar regiment. The Enfield is all matching unless it's been professionally tampered with, the Metford is not matching. Serial number range is correct for the Enfield, I will post some pics when I can,
Where did the Metford come from? No previous mention of a Metford. Sounds like the OP is looking at buying them and would like to find out a price range.
It would seem, after he "descended into the cave to check it out," that some more detailed information could be posted, such as other markings on it, date of manufacture, barrel length, possible unit numbers, barrel markings, etc., that would help establish a price.
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Some of the more advanced collectors have used what RNWMP / RCMP records that are available to come up with a list of serial numbers that are KNOWN Carbines. Many of these have a mis-matched bolt and only about 10% of the known ones have bolt and receiver matching.
Of course, such a list is not "written in stone," and more information comes to light every so often as firearms are found in Estates and other places.
Bolts, Receivers and Barrels are numbered, and there are certain other characteristics that distinguish these RNWMP Carbines from others, or from firearms made up to look like them.
Many advanced collectors notice these little things, and while they do share the information with other serious collectors, we tend to keep some of these little identifiers restricted, otherwise there are unscrupulous people out there that do make up these fakes and forgeries who would also attempt to duplicate these things on their Bogus (and high priced) offerings.
While this might seem selfish, particularly in this day and age where everyone and his dog seems to think that they have the "right" to this inside information, and it should be public for everyone, then I say that you have to earn that "right." I have over 55 years collecting, shooting and handling collectable firearms, and I have put in my dues over that time.
And, we keep notes on these things. I have seven loose leaf binders of these little things that I have found over the years. And, this is why these forums are good, because others like me will be more than happy to identify or help someone out, because they have the information collected over many years.
So, post some good detailed pictures, and we will help out if we can.
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- Location
- Tucson, Arizona
Of course you could buy the book,
Arms & Accroutrements of the Mounted Police (Phillips and Klancher)
Museum Restoration Service
Bloomfield, Ontario 1982
that lists the serial numbers
Arms & Accroutrements of the Mounted Police (Phillips and Klancher)
Museum Restoration Service
Bloomfield, Ontario 1982
that lists the serial numbers
Yes, the books ARE available.
I have one of these things and it has some MOST unusual features, but you have to know what you are looking at in order to identify them. If photos are up, I am more than happy to help out.
But there are people out there who are totally unscrupulous. I am thinking right now of a gunsmith I knew in Vancouver, many years ago, who turned out a dozen or so LUGER CARBINES and sold them AS ORIGINALS to unsuspecting guys who wanted to get a real prize. If you know what you are looking at, the identification as a Fraud is easy. (In this case, a hint: original Carbines were Commercial guns, Commercial guns were not DATED..... and the S..... M...... Carbines all have DATES. Be warned!)
On something as rare, and as valuable, as a really nice RNWMP Carbine, I want to be sure the gun exists BEFORE I ID the thing positively. Remember, we ARE looking at a factor of near 50 to 1 in cash value between one of these in real nice original shape..... and a Bubba-project-gone-wrong....... which can be made to LOOK LIKE the Real Thing.
With the junk I have lying around here, I could fake up some SUPER rarities, had I a mind to become a crook. I am very certain that some other guys on this forum can say likewise. That we have not done so, and will not do so, is a testament to our dedication to this hobby and to our own innate senses of honour and decency and self-respect. We CAN be crooks but we CHOOSE not to.
Can everyone out there say the same?
I think not.
Anybody wanna buy a brand-new 1873 French Modele d"Ordonnance revolver? They were made in .45ACP, you know!
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I have one of these things and it has some MOST unusual features, but you have to know what you are looking at in order to identify them. If photos are up, I am more than happy to help out.
But there are people out there who are totally unscrupulous. I am thinking right now of a gunsmith I knew in Vancouver, many years ago, who turned out a dozen or so LUGER CARBINES and sold them AS ORIGINALS to unsuspecting guys who wanted to get a real prize. If you know what you are looking at, the identification as a Fraud is easy. (In this case, a hint: original Carbines were Commercial guns, Commercial guns were not DATED..... and the S..... M...... Carbines all have DATES. Be warned!)
On something as rare, and as valuable, as a really nice RNWMP Carbine, I want to be sure the gun exists BEFORE I ID the thing positively. Remember, we ARE looking at a factor of near 50 to 1 in cash value between one of these in real nice original shape..... and a Bubba-project-gone-wrong....... which can be made to LOOK LIKE the Real Thing.
With the junk I have lying around here, I could fake up some SUPER rarities, had I a mind to become a crook. I am very certain that some other guys on this forum can say likewise. That we have not done so, and will not do so, is a testament to our dedication to this hobby and to our own innate senses of honour and decency and self-respect. We CAN be crooks but we CHOOSE not to.
Can everyone out there say the same?
I think not.
Anybody wanna buy a brand-new 1873 French Modele d"Ordonnance revolver? They were made in .45ACP, you know!
.
