All feedback is helpful. I gather that you consider the three rifles I mentioned to be generic. If so, maybe the next "step up" I am considering isn't enough. I've addressed my possible turn to reloading elsewhere in this thread.
Need Consistency at 1,000 Metres
- Thread starter Mad-Dog
- Start date
All feedback is helpful. I gather that you consider the three rifles I mentioned to be generic. If so, maybe the next "step up" I am considering isn't enough. I've addressed my possible turn to reloading elsewhere in this thread.
The 6.5 Creedmoor is also an option I am considering. The words, "go small" are advice I am hearing from a number of long range shooters. As expected, everyone has their own personal favourite. The cost and availability of factory 6.5 CR ammo would push me into reloading for sure.
Sure, ftr is 308 or 223 only. If ammo cost is a big issue to him it may be a good choice that will allow him to get a lot of trigger time in.
I think I would find a Remington action and get it trued up and build off that. With a good barrel from any top maker you will be good to go. That combined with reloading will get you to 1000. Not saying you can't do it with a factory rifle but a semi custom won't break the bank and should be a guaranteed shooter. Or treat yourself and buy a custom action. It's worth it to me but they are expensive. The 6.5's are nice. Couldn't be happier with my 6.5x47. No recoil and very accurate.
I just recently got into the 1000+ thing...
Here is my $0.02... which is a repeat of what others have said in this thread...
Whatever you get, caliber wise, make sure the rifle is sub MOA, closer to 1/2MOA - otherwise you're lobbing bullets, and hits are with luck rather than skill... A good barrel and reloading will get you there.
Spin on a good quality barrel on the action of your choice, find a load, then go shoot. 6.5's will get you there with less grief.
Here is my $0.02... which is a repeat of what others have said in this thread...
Whatever you get, caliber wise, make sure the rifle is sub MOA, closer to 1/2MOA - otherwise you're lobbing bullets, and hits are with luck rather than skill... A good barrel and reloading will get you there.
Spin on a good quality barrel on the action of your choice, find a load, then go shoot. 6.5's will get you there with less grief.
Something to think about if you are leaning towards competing. 308 and .223 are classed as FTR. Any other caliber is classed in the F(O)open class. Some of the calibers in the open class burn out competitive barrels in about 1200 rounds. A .308 or .223 will still be competitive at 4000 rounds.
For the price of about 10 boxes (200 rounds) of match ammo, you can be set with a pretty good reloading kit to get you started. I do not know of any competitive long range shooter that uses off the shelf ammo, unless they are from a country that does not allow handloads like the UK or the West Indies.
For the price of about 10 boxes (200 rounds) of match ammo, you can be set with a pretty good reloading kit to get you started. I do not know of any competitive long range shooter that uses off the shelf ammo, unless they are from a country that does not allow handloads like the UK or the West Indies.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
The term - Garbage in, garbage out pretty much sums up why you need to reload if you hope to reach out further... or get real lucky with an off the shelf product with the 308
Just got back from competing at 1000yds in a some pretty "trying" winds. Shot in FTR using a 308 against F open shooters who had a range of 7mm and 6.5's. The top wind readers using 7mm scored substantially better but I wasn't too far off and the 4th highest score when all F class shooters were included.
Your American is likely capable of sub MOA with the right reload. Given what you have suggested, the ammo is at its limit at 500m... dispersion will get dramatically bigger the further you go. Can you lobe bullets out to 1000yds, absolutely. Will you have anything approaching aimed fire??? Only you can tell by launching lead that far.... and how big a target you consider acceptable.
Personally, for what ammo and range time costs, I would just start reloading. The overall costs will be lower and the chance of success many times better.
If you really want to stick with factory ammo, I would suggest you get a 6.5 CM as there are far more options that will do a decent job out to 1000yds.
If you reload, then pretty much anything will work as you will make it work. the Leading edge 308's will do a pretty good job keeping up with the best 7's and pretty much the same as the 6.5's
YMMV.
Jerry
6.5 is an excellent choice as is x47 lapua, If you want to stay with factory ammo and still shoot a bit further, why not 300 WM, Recoil isnt that terrible especially if you have a brake. Plus you can find ammo for very cheap if you look (I found some for around $30 a box, sell your brass and recoup some money
)^^^ just to add, looking at ballistic tables, most 6.5's shooting 140's will be close to or even better (certainly from a recoil point of view) than a 300wm shooting 180's to 1500m.... 200gr+ will put you further, but i am not sure what options there are for that (Match ammo) if you don't reload.
This is my latest 6.5x55 project. It started as a S&L M69 barreled action with sights ($199), added a NOS Czech bolt ($100), Boyds stock ($150), Bold trigger ($50), worked up some loads with the irons and it's good to go now. Have an EGW base to D&T, bend the bolt and go try at 1000+.
I don't know what a comparable barrel would cost today (27" medium/heavy) but I imagine $500 would be the starting point.
This is much more fun and satisfying then dropping $1000-$2000 on some production 6.5CM.
This looks like a fun project. This spring I was shooting at Ben Avery and our class was run in parallel to the Vintage Sniper Rifle class. I pulled targets for a talented lady shooting a tuned up 6.5x55 vintage rifle and she put six consecutive shots into 1/2 minute at 1000. The other 4 opened it up as conditions changed, but that showed me that the cartridge can shoot.
Chris.
Personally, I would probably dress up the American a bit, get a basic reloading kit (doesn't have to cost a fortune, the press I currently use cost 40$) and keep shooting what you got. In the mean time start saving for a real step up. Nothing wrong with any of those options but there are a ton of better options that aren't really that much more. That or start building a rifle from the ground up (nothing like building something exactly the way you want it). That being said you could use any of those rifles as a start point and do the same thing, I just doubt you would see dramatically better results worth the investment. I see rifles on the EE in close to the same price range that are ready for 1000 metre shooting, lots of people (like myself) seem to enjoy the build almost as much as the end result. I've built a lot of guns that I sold almost as soon as they are finished just to start building another one. But back to your question, I'd probably get a 700 barreled or unbarreled action and start from there, toss it in an MDT chassis, throw a Timney etc. trigger on it and go from there. Parts commonality and availablilty being the driving force for the 700, don't see bare actions for the other 2 nearly as often. I have a ton of random take off parts kicking around that are basically worthless and could have been money better spent on the build. Just my perspective.
Sherlock Gnomes
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- St.Catharines
Savage would be my choice but then again i like the accutrigger and don't switch it out. Tikka would be good choice and I don't know how good their triggers are.
p.Rundle
CGN frequent flyer
I went Savage. Due to their easy barrel change system, I should be able to go from 308 to 6.5 CM in a few seconds. You can get them for a great price. SFRC just had a sale I think, and Cabelas has them for $100 off, and there's a $100 rebate. Total cost, $600.....Go for it...you know you want it...do it...
Barrel switching sounds like a good option, but where can I buy a barrel for the Savage? Let's assume that I buy a .308 rifle, I would need to source 6.5 CM barrel. Are we talking factory or strictly custom? None of the retailers I've searched thus far seem to be offering them.
Second scenario, if I buy a 700 in .308, again where would I get a 6.5 CM barrel, IF the Remington barrels are interchangeable?
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
Give me a pm or email and I will be happy to help with prefit barrel options from Shilen, McGowen and CarbonSix.
If you need barrel blanks for a Rem install, can help with that too... lots of 6.5 blanks instock.
Thanks
Jerry
There's no shortcuts to quality. Special thanks to Mystic Precision. I am going to try a different approach than I outlined originally, still a factory rifle, with a decision pending on reloading.
I have looked long and hard at Senderos and 700 SPS Varmints. Prices on the former seem high; barrels on the latter do not appear to be bedded. Of course, I could have the bedding done by a good smith if I am prepared for a long wait.
All things considered - including the Savage and Tikka options I mentioned at the outset - I am homing in on a Remington 700 Long Range in 7mm RM. Proven action and it seems like a reasonable compromise of quality vs. cost. I am looking before I leap and wondering whether anyone can share their experiences with a Remington Long Range in this or another calibre at a grand.
I have looked long and hard at Senderos and 700 SPS Varmints. Prices on the former seem high; barrels on the latter do not appear to be bedded. Of course, I could have the bedding done by a good smith if I am prepared for a long wait.
All things considered - including the Savage and Tikka options I mentioned at the outset - I am homing in on a Remington 700 Long Range in 7mm RM. Proven action and it seems like a reasonable compromise of quality vs. cost. I am looking before I leap and wondering whether anyone can share their experiences with a Remington Long Range in this or another calibre at a grand.
RangerPark
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Near Edmonton, AB
Senderos are expensive, that's true, but they're on sale right now, $1,487.49 and free shipping. I've had one in .300 WM and regret selling it. Should also be great in 7mm.
None of those options are substantially better than what you have.
As others have mentioned, start reloading.
Once you've got reloading dialled in after a year or two, build a quality rifle.
A rebarreled tikka action is a great choice, on a budget.
Something in a short action 6 or 6.5mm is very versatile.
As others have mentioned, start reloading.
Once you've got reloading dialled in after a year or two, build a quality rifle.
A rebarreled tikka action is a great choice, on a budget.
Something in a short action 6 or 6.5mm is very versatile.
Personal opinion.
7mm Rem Mag. Tons of factory ammo with many in match loads if you dont want to reload, but in the end you really need to. Dont have to worry about burning a barrel and the 7mm is has got got a great BC and shoots flat. Im definitely not a 308 guy so Im biased and wonder if it got popular just because its the same size as a NATO round. (Can hardly wait for comments on that little gem). BC is the key with the wind as everyone has already stated. 30 cal you typically need to go heavy on the weight of the bullet to get a decent BC, which with a 308 which is already slow makes a large bullet drop. With a heavy weight then you get the larger recoil etc etc.
7mm Rem Mag. Tons of factory ammo with many in match loads if you dont want to reload, but in the end you really need to. Dont have to worry about burning a barrel and the 7mm is has got got a great BC and shoots flat. Im definitely not a 308 guy so Im biased and wonder if it got popular just because its the same size as a NATO round. (Can hardly wait for comments on that little gem). BC is the key with the wind as everyone has already stated. 30 cal you typically need to go heavy on the weight of the bullet to get a decent BC, which with a 308 which is already slow makes a large bullet drop. With a heavy weight then you get the larger recoil etc etc.
