Need help with 6.5mm X ?? rifle - Carcano?

If she was an Italian rifle, the markings would have been on the barrel including the year, maker, and serial number. If the original barrel was pulled out and a sporter barrel put on, that information is lost to time sadly.

They may be a chance to identify what the rifle once was or who used it by careful examination of any markings that are left unless those were polished off.
 
At one time is was owned by a 'K. W. Gilby'. It's engraved on the buttstock twice under the metal plate. Kinda neat to know who that is.

It must be a sporter barrel as opposed to a cut down original. No markings whatsoever.

I'd really like to find a slick scope mount for it. After I verify that it's safe to fire that is.
 
AdrianM said:
Lastly, has anyone easily mounted a scope on one of these? I've done some research and it doesn't seem like anyone makes a mount that works well with the stripper clip loaded in the top.
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I've seen two on the E&E in the past year :yingyang: (bought one of them ;) ) - I highly recommend waiting for a scope-mounted one to come up for sale instead of paying to have it so outfitted to an otherwise unadorned rifle....:redface:

That's also my policy with sportered SMLE's :D , btw....

SKScanuck said:
Scope on a Carcano, Oswald comes to mind....
Click to expand...

IIRC, Oswald's mounting was a very cheap one (and perhaps of Japanese manufacture as well).
 
Have you had the barrelled action out of the stock? Look at the bottom of the breech end of the barrel. Is there a setscrew? If so, the barrel is the Cooey modified factory barrel, and not a replacement sporting barrel. The 6.5 on the top of the barrel breech is a Cooey feature.
 
Yes, the Germans abandonned conversion of Carcanos to 7.92, but not because of strength issues with the action.
 
OP:

I think I have a few rounds for you...a few weeks ago, a fella gave me some 6.5 ammo. It is marked D.C.Co
(Dominion Cartridge Company...shoot 'em with pride!) 6.5 M-M.

I did a bit 'o' googling and, have found that D.C.Co made 2 different 6.5's (at least)... one in Ammunition 6.5mm Mannlicher and, one in 6.5x55. I've determined (strong word for plastic, dollar store calipers) that these rounds are about 1mm shorter brass but, the ball extends out further than any of my of Soft point 6.5x55...

Any gurus here know for sure what the stamps are for older Dominion ammo? I won't be chambering these until I know what they are for (definitively).

Can post pictures later.
 
Picture001-3.jpg


I can't take a good picture of the headstamp...macro isn't working.

From left to right:
Privi Partisan 6.5x55
S&B 6.5x55
Winchester 6.5x55
Older surplus 6.5x55

alone, on the right: D.C.Co 6.5 M-M

If they turn out to be for OP's rifle (and he's close enough) free to him. If that fails (and they turn out to NOT be 6.5x55) free to someone within driving distance.

EDIT:

I find, in the above picture, it's easiest to see the length disparity at the shoulder...
 
Thanks Camster. But I already have a box of the Dominion ammo that came with the rifle. It's Mannlicher-Schonauer 6.5X54mm. There is also one round of norma that is similar but appears to be 6.5X52mm ammo for a rifle chambered in Mannlicher-Carcano.

And Tiriaq; I did tear the rifle apart this morning and started refinishing the stock with Tru-Oil. The set screw is there. So it's a modded original barrel.

Another question; where can I get a sling swivel for the underside of the buttstock? It was filled with putty that fell out when I stripped it. I'd like to install an original part instead of filling it again.
 
How long before I can post pics? I have a couple of it when I'm taking it apart to check the set screw and clean it.
 
Far as I can remember, Dominion put out 3 diferent kinds of 6.5mm ammo:

6.5x55, which has a base diameter of about .473" and works really well in 6.5 Krags and Svedish Mausers. If you get desperate, you can make it out of .30-'06.... or you can buy it from any of the American manufacturers (who now have discovered this round). For many years, this was the only 6.5x55 available in North America.

6.5x53 Mannlicher-Schoenauer, a sporting cartridge adapted from the Greek 1903 military round, which was a slight modification of the Italian 1891 cartridge although with slightly lessened pressure intensity. This is the world-famous elephant-killer, whereas the more powerful Italian round is well known as a total piece of crap. Something around here doesn't make sense, but that's the way it is. You can make this one frm .303 Savage, given that you have a lathe. For a LONG time, Dominion was the only North American source of this round, which was de-listed in the States in the '30s.

3. The mysterious R cartridge, which was made for this rifle and sold in pink boxes of 20 rounds through Eaton's. Only headstamp was a capital letter "R" at 12 o'clock position. I have a single round of this stuff, will dig it out and measure it tonight, post the exact measurements later.

Ammunition marked "D.C.Co." is pre-War Two.

Ammunition marked "DOMINION" is from shortly after War Two, to the early-middle 1960s.

Ammuniton marked "IMPERIAL" is from about 1964 or '65 through to the end of production by CIL in 1968. The "IMPERIAL" name was continued by IVI and some of their early production in these calibres was leftovers from CIL. The CIL stuff was great ammo, but IVI had no idea whatsoever of quality control and their product deteriorated until it became posiively dangerous, at which point I wrote a newspaper article in Newfoundland which was printed in at least 11 Nfld newspapers and copied in Nova Scotia (without permission but with my thanks), at which point IVI finally took notice, tried to sue me for half a megabuck and the publisher for another 500,000; they pulled their horns in when confronted with several hundred rounds of their own defective brass. IVI pretty much pulled out of the Canadian civil ammo market, alowing the evil Americans to dominate it, despite punitive taxation measures (prompted by IVI whining) designed to keep them out.

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OP:

Must be a big box 'o' ammo you have currently! If you have a chance, could you check your head stamps to help me determine what I've got (or don't have)...

As far as I know, there is no "time limit" until you post pictures... You have to post them to a second parties site (I use photo bucket) and, copy the IMG code. I was a touch troubled about posting pictures but, caught on. There's a thread somewhere on the "easiest" route to post pictures here.

Smellie, you seem to have weathered the litigation in good form!

add-on

Ontario folks...I'm aprox. an hour north of Kingston or, Belleville. If you have a rifle that can eat these (and I don't...confirmation required) let me know and, they are your's.

Anyone else...if you're far enough away to require shipping, your's for the cost to get them there.

Best option...hot blonde nymphomaniacs with ammo collections, I'm willing to travel.
 
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Brutal...so the box I have isn't for my rifle. I was under the impression that almost all Cooey Carcano's were 6.5X54mm. This box of Mannlicher-Schonauer is 53mm and isn't much good then if what smellie tells me is right. And he sounds like a guy that knows.

SIGH...I checked with my trusty plastic ruler and they measure out to about 53mm at the rim.

I'm betting that's what you have too Camster.

I'll post some pics. My box is CIL Mannlicher Schonauer and inside is one norma carcano that measures about 52mm. Then there are the dominion and D.C.CO. that smellie rained on my parade with. :D
 
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There are three 6.5 Mannlicher rounds. Rimless x52 Mannlicher Caracano for Italian service; then the x53 and x54. Rimless is Mannlicher Schoenauer, rimmed is Dutch and Roumanian service.
The C-C rifles seem to have all been rimless M-S; might find these as x53 or x54, depending on who made them.
 
I guess where I got confused is when I started my research on this rifle I checked wikipedia (don't laugh!) and it said that Mannlicker-schonauer was 6.5X54mm so I thought the box I had must be 54mm.

Camster, if your box is 54mm I'll take it. We'll just have to arrange shipping to Nova Scotia.
 
6.5x53 Mannlicher-Schoenauer and 6.5x54 Mannlicher-Schoenauer are exactly and precisely the same ammunition. The difference arises from the slightly-odd length of the casing, some manufacturers selling it as a 53mm case, others as a 54mm case. The actual casings are identical.

The Italian round was called the 6.5x52 Mannlicher-CARCANO.

The Dutch and Romanian cartridges were RIMMED, thus had an "R" suffix, as 6.5x53R.

These things can be awfully confusing until you get them sorted out. I know they certainly confused me when I was first making their acquaintance!

Good luck, friend!
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Thank you so much for clearing that up Smellie!

I'll take that box of ammo Camster if it's still up for grabs.

I'll post some pics of the stock in progress. It's actually a very nice old piece of wood.
 
Yes, the stocks on these are very nice. They are the original military stocks reworked into sporters.

But then, where else can you get your hands on a piece of fine Italian walnut which has been curing for a century?

Treat her gently and, when she's all finished, she'll sit up and do tricks for you.
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