Needing some advice on picking a shotgun.I've owned Remington semi's & pumps with 30" + 34" barrels.Liked them very much.But,I'm looking for my kid to shoot ,grouse and some trap. I have only owned 12 gauges, so is the 20 gauges lighter then the 12 gauge models? I have been lookin for 20 or 12 gauge in over/under or semi or side by side for her. What should I look for that won't kick to crap out of her and not to small for myself to shoot.would anything at tradex would be be okay? or does a fellow have spend $1000+ toget something half descent.I know you only get what you pay for .thanks marba
Needing some shotgun advice
- Thread starter marba
- Start date
Beretta687EELL
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- SW Ontario
IMHO, since you already have lots of experience with Remington semis, I would suggest a 12 gauge 1100. Short stocks and barrels are readily available. It is far easier to put together a great light recoiling 12 gauge trap load than a 20 gauge. As I see it, the only advantage a 20 gauge has is it is usually lighter to carry in the field, and a lighter gun will have more felt recoil.
Most inexpensive O/Us and SXSs have punishing stock dimensions for most people.
Most inexpensive O/Us and SXSs have punishing stock dimensions for most people.
greyman441
CGN Regular
- Location
- Wasaga Beach, ON
You would definetly want a 20 gauge. 12 gauge has a little to much kick. If this is the first time shooting for her then I would guess a single would be best but if you are looking to shoot it as well then a semi would be your best bet. Some 20 gauges have the same receiver as a 12 gauge model so I dont see there being to much weight difference. O/U's are usually pretty expensive and a SxS 20 gauge doesnt come up for sale often. I havent checked trade-ex so I am not sure if there is any there but I would personally go for a cheap semi on the EE for the first youth gun.
All a youth gun is, is a shorter stock and barrel pretty sure the same receiver. If you had to just swap out the stock and shorter barrel on one of your shotguns.
All a youth gun is, is a shorter stock and barrel pretty sure the same receiver. If you had to just swap out the stock and shorter barrel on one of your shotguns.
Then you don't see it all. There are many advantages to a 20G for a young person and upland game. The only disadvantage is you have to learn to shoot just a bit better to get the same results. Recoil will be less than a 12G in a lighter gun.
What single shots? What loads? Some of the cheap old things I have seen would kick like mules because of design flaws. That means nothing.
Get a good pump 20G from any recognized brand, and you will have a very nice upland gun for anyone. Pay enough for a good over/under, and see how smooth they are. Recoil is as much about gun design as about gauge. No well designed 20G will recoil as hard as a well designed 12G.
If the recoil of a well designed 20G is too much for anyone, then more shooting practice with all sorts of guns is needed before we go hunting with a shotgun.
Get a good pump 20G from any recognized brand, and you will have a very nice upland gun for anyone. Pay enough for a good over/under, and see how smooth they are. Recoil is as much about gun design as about gauge. No well designed 20G will recoil as hard as a well designed 12G.
If the recoil of a well designed 20G is too much for anyone, then more shooting practice with all sorts of guns is needed before we go hunting with a shotgun.
I would go with the above advice and get an 1100 in 20 gauge. I own one in 12 and it is a very light kicking gun as it is, but at the same time i'm 6 feet tall and 180 pounds. For a new shooter and a young daughter I would imagine the 20 gauge would be perfect. And as stated above, shorter stocks are available for it.
greyman441
CGN Regular
- Location
- Wasaga Beach, ON
Ya true I didn't see the thing about shooting trap. In that case it would definitely be a 12 gauge.
Hi:
You are fortunate that you didnot find a 11-96. That was the gun as you know that was going to replace the 1187 and was actually shot gun of the year in 1997. I bought one new and had cycling problems so sold it. By 2000 they were out of production and very few sold in US and canada.
Much better off with a 1100.
My brother bought a 11-96 new from wholesale way back when and never had a issue . Thats why I was looking for one, he has shot thousands of rounds ,not a issue.But, you will get a lemon in any make or model. A friend bought a new Browning semi ,top of the line of the semis. Once to the range and wouldn't cycle right. Brand new ,had to send it away.So, gemlins are in all major makes. thanks for the input so far,keep it up. thanks
Asking for a shotgun to perform optimally for upland Grouse hunting(light carry weight, open choked) and formal Trap (heavy tightly choked) is just not going to happen.
Asking for a shotgun that can be used in the uplands for Grouse and for non - competive Trap is doable.
Where is the focus going to be ?
Trap ? A 12 ga. gas autolaoder capable of cycling 7/8 or 1 ounce loads below 1200 fps is going to be a lot easier recoil wise than pretty much anything else. fitted stock, 26" barrel max w/ choke tubes and one could press it into service in the uplands.
Upland Grouse ? A 20 ga. autoloader as above will be lighter to ease carrying and one will not be shooting 100 rounds in a couple of hours unless they have stumbled upon the fabled "lost forest of grouse every sq inch land".
Single shot....... any ga. = featherweight snot kicker outer ! stay away unless you plan to rid the kid of any desire to shoot.
A 20 ga. does not automatically mean more kick. Outside of proper gun fit, its all about weight of the gun vs payload weight/velocity of the shot.
1 oz at 1200 fps out of a 5 1/2 lb 12 ga. is going to kick more than 1 oz at 1200 fps out of a 6 1/2 lb 20 ga.
Asking for a shotgun that can be used in the uplands for Grouse and for non - competive Trap is doable.
Where is the focus going to be ?
Trap ? A 12 ga. gas autolaoder capable of cycling 7/8 or 1 ounce loads below 1200 fps is going to be a lot easier recoil wise than pretty much anything else. fitted stock, 26" barrel max w/ choke tubes and one could press it into service in the uplands.
Upland Grouse ? A 20 ga. autoloader as above will be lighter to ease carrying and one will not be shooting 100 rounds in a couple of hours unless they have stumbled upon the fabled "lost forest of grouse every sq inch land".
Single shot....... any ga. = featherweight snot kicker outer ! stay away unless you plan to rid the kid of any desire to shoot.
A 20 ga. does not automatically mean more kick. Outside of proper gun fit, its all about weight of the gun vs payload weight/velocity of the shot.
1 oz at 1200 fps out of a 5 1/2 lb 12 ga. is going to kick more than 1 oz at 1200 fps out of a 6 1/2 lb 20 ga.
sledman8002002
CGN Regular
- Location
- Hastings Highlands, Ont. 613 area
I think you and her would both be quite happy with an 1100 in a 20ga Marba. Hard to find a good used one at a reasonable price though. Which can be considered a plus as, if you decide to sell it down the road, you shouldn't have a problem.
Might I also suggest the possibility of the 1100 in a 28ga? A great all around shotgun for bird hunting and clay games. Ammo is more pricey, but it's a shotgun that you'll enjoy alot as well.
Might I also suggest the possibility of the 1100 in a 28ga? A great all around shotgun for bird hunting and clay games. Ammo is more pricey, but it's a shotgun that you'll enjoy alot as well.
I know for most of us we know what we would like and can afford but I have found that the most important factor to consider is her feelings. I went through this with my own daughter. It doesn't matter if you can get a great deal on a particular gun or that's what you started with or like. This is going to be her gun no matter how much you want to use it later. If she isn't comfortable with it (as LITTLE recoil as possible and manageable weight) she isn't going to enjoy it. And if she doesn't enjoy it, it will just collect dust in the gun safe and you losing a new shooting/hunting partner.
When my son was 8 or 9, I got him a .410 cooey single shot and reloaded the lightest loads in the book. I cut about 4 inches off the stock because he was quite small for his age. He shot lots of grouse with that. Our trap director at the range would set the trap to shoot birds straight out and my son stood right at the trap house. Got some good fun and practice with that but he was only shooting grouse on the ground or in trees anyway at that time.
When he was 11 or 12, I got him a 20 ga 1100, cut 2 inches off the stock and loaded shells so light they would not cycle the action. So what? there is only one clay pigeon at a time. He started moving back at the trap range. When we went hunting birds, I reloaded shells just heavy enough to cycle the action. He loved getting doubles even if they were on the ground. By the time he was 16 he could handle regular 20 ga loads and there was no problem.
By the time he was 18, he had a 12 ga 1100 and shoots factory loads or what ever he wanted and he is deadly. Poor bird that gets within 40 yards.
My suggestion - start them out with light loads = no or low recoil and gradually increase as they can handle it and still have fun!
When he was 11 or 12, I got him a 20 ga 1100, cut 2 inches off the stock and loaded shells so light they would not cycle the action. So what? there is only one clay pigeon at a time. He started moving back at the trap range. When we went hunting birds, I reloaded shells just heavy enough to cycle the action. He loved getting doubles even if they were on the ground. By the time he was 16 he could handle regular 20 ga loads and there was no problem.
By the time he was 18, he had a 12 ga 1100 and shoots factory loads or what ever he wanted and he is deadly. Poor bird that gets within 40 yards.
My suggestion - start them out with light loads = no or low recoil and gradually increase as they can handle it and still have fun!
This is the truth (and you already know it, because you know that a 20 ga. you tried was rough on her). The gauge is irrelevant. What you want are 1 oz. loads (or lighter) in a gun that weighs at least 6 lbs, but no more than she's comfortable handling. Semi's are desirable because cycling the action soaks up some of the recoil. But, I wouldn't recommend a semi unless the shooter has enough experience to maintain proper muzzle direction at all times.
I went through this with my daughter. I eventually realised that she does best with light loads in heavy guns. She's 17 now and shoots trap competitively. She shoots her own FAIR Carrerra Sporting these days (U/O).
