New Generation Hunting Bullets

joe-nwt said:
What, if any, would the rational be for banning lead hunting bullets? With migratory bird hunting, lead shot was banned because of a supposed claim that other birds were eating the lead from the bottom of the lake/pond/slough and getting lead poisoning.
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The ban attempt that is going on in California is from scavengers supposedly ingesting lead from gutpiles... lead due to fragments. At least so the antis would have us believe.

What I would like to know is this: If I eat a WHOLE LEAD BULLET, will I become ill?

What is the toxicity threshold of lead ingestion?

If I could eat a whole lead bullet without adverse effect, why would a portion of one be problematic?
 
Silverado said:
The ban attempt that is going on in California is from scavengers supposedly ingesting lead from gutpiles... lead due to fragments. At least so the antis would have us believe.
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Well then. Californian's need to stop gut shooting their game.
 
Win 38-55 said:
Well I use cast bullets in all my guns, including my 30-30, made from used wheel weights and that's my idea of the 'next generation' bullets. To clarify, they are 'recycled and reused', they are cheap like borscht, they are 'all natural (made from all natural ingredients) and they don't come apart, at least not the soft cast bullets I use. That YouTube stuff has a long way to go before it becomes peer-reviewed literature.

And another thing ..... I don't eat the wound channel. I figure that any lead that comes off my cast bullets is mostly in the first 1/2 inch of meat/bone/guts around the channel and I don't eat that anyway as it's all bruised. But I sure don't trim back 3" (although I use slow-chugging bullets that make a nice hole but not a massive bruise like those hyper-quantum-space-curving-light-speed-whoopee-magnums do). I recommend promoting the soft-cast lead bullet made from recycled wheel weights pushed at sane velocities .... the environmentally friendly, all-natural, recycled solution to the bullet problem.
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Hyper Quantum Space Curving Light Speed Whoopee Magnums....what if I use cast boolitz in my 300 Winnie, would that count???:D
 
Silverado said:
The ban attempt that is going on in California is from scavengers supposedly ingesting lead from gutpiles... lead due to fragments. At least so the antis would have us believe.

What I would like to know is this: If I eat a WHOLE LEAD BULLET, will I become ill?

What is the toxicity threshold of lead ingestion?

If I could eat a whole lead bullet without adverse effect, why would a portion of one be problematic?
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I understand that most harmful lead effect to human is via vapour and dust as in molding and mining. Lead vapour has even fewer lead in weight than fragments from bullets. It is how the body absorbs lead but not the amount of lead.

Lead poisoning will get to your brain via blood flow and can be determined by measuring levels of lead content in the blood. Long term exposure will cause accumulation of lead in your body and cause irreversible brain damage.

The danger of lead has long been known and has now been banned in paint, toy….

Remember to wash your hands after shooting at the range and reloading sessions?

If you find lead poisoning sucks just ignore it. :p:p:p
 
Danny Boy said:
This is the early stage warning, like warnings about cigarette smoking 30 years ago alerting the general public about lung cancer. Despite the warning, a significant portion of the population continues to smoke. Some are cancer free living into the 90s. Unfortunately a large number die of lung disease each year.
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I wouldn't compare this fear mongering to cigarette smoking. Probably closer to fear around microwave ovens slowly cooking children who watch too close, high voltage lines causing cancer, etc.

No one eats bullet-hole meat, therefore no risk.
 
I was just practicing my guiatar couldn't write a song if my life depended on it though...

When I am in the bush and I need something to do I do a lot of shooting thats why I can shoot better than play... :D
 
If you start digging you will find that there are many restrictions around the world regarding the use of lead in hunting bullets. In most cases it is due to the fact that scavanging birds find gut piles and those animals that are wounded and not recovered. They then eat the animal including the bullet/bullet fragments. The bird keeps the bullet fragments in the gizzard where it is used like stones to grind food. This grinds the bullets down and releases large amounts of the lead into the birds system (you swallow the bullet and drop it in the toilet a few days later with minimal abrasion to the bullets surface). The bird (vulture, hawk, eagle) then gets sick and or dies.

But why believe me
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6495313

Mandatory use of non toxic hunting bullets is coming, all it needs is one good news story of a sick eagle being rescued by some school kids and its tragic death of lead poisoning to make it law. On the plus side the current offerings seem to work well and are actually the bullets of choice for many hunters.

If you want to knowingly eat meat containing lead and feed the same meat to your kids that is your decision.....
 
I look at it this way. Several generations of hunters have been shooting lead bullets, and their families have been eating the game shot with those [gasp! :eek:] lead or jacketed lead bullets. I have 5 children. These all were raised on game meat shot with those evil lead-containing projectiles. Three of these kids were principal's list all through school, one won her awards through her artistic talents [considerable, if I may act the proud father!] The last one is still in elementary school, but the initial results look mighty good. If, in fact, ingesting lead causes irreversible brain damage, it's effects have been lacking in my narrow sphere of experience. Now if you were talking lead vapor, or easily broken down compounds containing lead, that might be a different story. But the human digestive system will pass most of that lead through with little, if any ingested into our bloodstream. The weak hydrochloric acid in our stomach has next to NO effect on lead, and the short time that lead fragments would remain in our digestive tract[<24 hrs] means that a very high percentage of those lead fragments would pass on out intact. I agree wholeheartedly with H4831 on this issue. It's "chicken little" syndrome. That being said, no harm in using copper/copper alloy bullets if you find they work well. Just no point in going off the deep end over a very "iffy" possibility. Regards, Eagleye.
 
My bullets exit 98% of the time anyway. I hardly ever find one, so I'm not too worried about ingesting one...Or even pieces...
 
Lead is undeniably toxic. but the dose makes the poison. And elemental lead is far less toxic than lead oxide or other chemically altered forms of lead. The most toxic form of lead that shooters are exposed to is primer residue. So if you clean barrels, or handle empty cases, or reload, or shoot in poorly ventilated indoor ranges, you are likely exposing yourself to far higher levels of lead toxicity than you are if you eat game meat shot with lead bullets. But the bullets get all the publicity, and common sense is not very apparent in the debates.
Just wash your hands after reloading, shoot in well ventilated conditions, trim bloodshot and bullet damaged meat, and live a long and healthy life.
 
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