New Smith and wesson M&P 9mm Problems. Dealer Passing buck?

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CamDelle

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So I ordered a M&p 9 Just under a month ago. Used it at the range and it seems that the front and rear sights are a mismatch. Shoots 3-5 inches low at 5 yards. Was recently in a course with it and had a few expert shooters use it and its groupings were all over the place off a bench.

Contacted the selling dealer and they are telling me to contact Murray Charlton about it.

This gun is under a month old. Shouldn't the dealer be doing a little more than just giving me a website URL.
 
What kind of expert shooters? Bullseye shooters will have a rotten time with the M&P - the same as they do with a Glock, these aren't highly tuned guns with great triggers and highly visible, precise sights. Correct sight alignment for an M&P is with the dot on the target, known as 'driving the dot' while bullseye guys shoot 6 o'clock hold. If you're holding at the 6 you'll be low with a combat gun. Additionally, 1911 guys tend to have issues with striker guns, due to differences in the method used to control the trigger - it's very common to see a guy who shoots 1911's exclusively shoot beautiful, small groups low and left when handed a striker gun. Glock guys (including at least one really, really tuned in instructor) have issues pulling shots with the M&P - I don't know why this happens, but I've seen it more than once. If the groups are tight, and the sights aren't loose, it's an aiming issue. Try cleaning up the trigger, the current M&P's have pretty much all of the kinks worked out and quality control is much better than it used to be. Maybe some details on where the groups are on the target and the hand used (R or L) to shoot each group would give us a better idea, photos of the targets would be great. I've seen lots of guy say the M&P can't shoot, it's not an issue I've experienced with mine over 7 years and 55K rounds.
 
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kgb81 said:
i've put around 500 rounds or so through my M&P and its still all over the place. likely the shooter.
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I've witnessed this for myself in a friend's M&P Pro. You guys aren't the only one's claiming issues with accuracy. Some M&P's had accuracy issues years ago but I thought that was all sorted out? Either way, I was turned off from them and would never own one.
 
My buddy has one with the apex upgrade and Novak adjustable sights. It groups terrible , even when rested on a sandbag. I had one with the apex trigger upgrade and it also grouped terrible. These guns are not for shooting groups, black out the back dots, and just use the front , white dot. Cover your target with the front dot and your good to go. If you install adjustable sights , you can then set it up for the6 o'clock position, but this ,still will not make the group much better.
 
Brianma65 said:
My buddy has one with the apex upgrade and Novak adjustable sights. It groups terrible , even when rested on a sandbag. I had one with the apex trigger upgrade and it also grouped terrible. These guns are not for shooting groups, black out the back dots, and just use the front , white dot. Cover your target with the front dot and your good to go. If you install adjustable sights , you can then set it up for the6 o'clock position, but this ,still will not make the group much better.
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Sorry you had bad experiences with the M&P, but they do not speak for everyone. Several of them in use at our local IDPA club, and they shoot just as well as any other duty gun pressed into action shooting, and hold their own on the scoreboard at the end of the day just fine. If you're having problems that can't be explained by some mechanical or physical defect (they are pretty easy to ascertain), then its most likely the shooter, and not the gun.

enefgee said:
What kind of expert shooters? Bullseye shooters will have a rotten time with the M&P - the same as they do with a Glock, these aren't highly tuned guns with great triggers and highly visible, precise sights. Correct sight alignment for an M&P is with the dot on the target, known as 'driving the dot' while bullseye guys shoot 6 o'clock hold. If you're holding at the 6 you'll be low with a combat gun. Additionally, 1911 guys tend to have issues with striker guns, due to differences in the method used to control the trigger - it's very common to see a guy who shoots 1911's exclusively shoot beautiful, small groups low and left when handed a striker gun. Glock guys (including at least one really, really tuned in instructor) have issues pulling shots with the M&P - I don't know why this happens, but I've seen it more than once. If the groups are tight, and the sights aren't loose, it's an aiming issue. Try cleaning up the trigger, the current M&P's have pretty much all of the kinks worked out and quality control is much better than it used to be. Maybe some details on where the groups are on the target and the hand used (R or L) to shoot each group would give us a better idea, photos of the targets would be great. I've seen lots of guy say the M&P can't shoot, it's not an issue I've experienced with mine over 7 years and 55K rounds.
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Yep.
 
Distributors handle warranty work, so not uncommon to be referred there.
Now most dealers will try and help you out with issues, but if you called up with accuracy complaints at 5 yards.... Nobody got time for that #### lol
 
I never said I had bad experiences with mine, just saying it's not the most accurate gun in the world. And I'm guessing it's not meant for accuracy any way. The trigger is horrible, that's why so many are doing the upgrade. It's a very reliable pistol and is great if you like shooting at 6 inch gongs. We have no shooting sports here so I've done a lot of target shooting and the 2 m&p 9s are the least accurate. And I know it's not me because I can get good groups with my other handguns. I now have a sd9ve ,it's just as accurate as the M&P but with the same crappy trigger. It's a great fun gun.
 
Brianma65 said:
I never said I had bad experiences with mine, just saying it's not the most accurate gun in the world. And I'm guessing it's not meant for accuracy any way. The trigger is horrible, that's why so many are doing the upgrade. It's a very reliable pistol and is great if you like shooting at 6 inch gongs. We have no shooting sports here so I've done a lot of target shooting and the 2 m&p 9s are the least accurate. And I know it's not me because I can get good groups with my other handguns. I now have a sd9ve ,it's just as accurate as the M&P but with the same crappy trigger. It's a great fun gun.
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To be fair, the "most accurate gun in the world" on any given day is probably an ordinary gun in the hands of the best shooter. I have seen M&P 9s win a few competitions, both action shooting and regular bullseyes, some of them in my own hands. The factory trigger gets crapped on a lot - and I agree, there are many better triggers - but the trigger alone will not make you a good shooter.
 
I agree , they are good guns, for their intended purpose. Duty , carry, IDPA. Which the first two most of us will never see and the last may be awhile , for me. People need to understand what the gun is intended for. I only have the option of paper punching and would have liked to know that info when I first started. M&P would not have been my first choice. But at the time there were so many for sale in the EE and so cheap..I just couldn't resist :)
 
Brianma65 said:
I agree , they are good guns, for their intended purpose. Duty , carry, IDPA. Which the first two most of us will never see and the last may be awhile , for me. People need to understand what the gun is intended for. I only have the option of paper punching and would have liked to know that info when I first started. M&P would not have been my first choice. But at the time there were so many for sale in the EE and so cheap..I just couldn't resist :)
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Its true that if people want to stand around and try to make itty bitty groups all day long, maybe a Walther SSP is more your style. That said, the M&P is quite capable of making good groups in the right hands.
 
I don't have any accuracy issues with my 5" Pro Series with the 1:18.75 twist rate. But, I also have a new 1:10 twist barrel that I haven't tried out yet.
 
Talked to md charlton today. There is a lot of m&p 9mm that came up here with screwed up barrels. A lot of them supposedly had the sights mismatched as well. Sounds like I won out on both accounts.

Grouping is one thing. But 3-5 inches low at 5 yards is unacceptable to me.

They have the barrels in stock but no sights. Should be um...... Interesting to see how long this takes.

But the gent at md charlton was awesome to talk to.
 
CamDelle said:
Talked to md charlton today. There is a lot of m&p 9mm that came up here with screwed up barrels. A lot of them supposedly had the sights mismatched as well. Sounds like I won out on both accounts. Grouping is one thing. But 3-5 inches low at 5 yards is unacceptable to me. They have the barrels in stock but no sights. Should be um...... Interesting to see how long this takes. But the gent at md charlton was awesome to talk to.
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Yes, MD Charlton is good to deal with.
 
Good to hear they're taking care of you and you're m&p, I've had nothing bad to say about mine. I find it very reliable and pretty damn accurate, it can shoot better than I can that's for sure. I don't find the stock trigger that terrible, reset is definatly noticeable.
 
CamDelle said:
Talked to md charlton today. There is a lot of m&p 9mm that came up here with screwed up barrels. A lot of them supposedly had the sights mismatched as well. Sounds like I won out on both accounts.

Grouping is one thing. But 3-5 inches low at 5 yards is unacceptable to me.

They have the barrels in stock but no sights. Should be um...... Interesting to see how long this takes.

But the gent at md charlton was awesome to talk to.
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I thought Murray Charleton Enterprises in Brentwood Bay does all the warranty for S&W.
 
I have to friends of mine, they're brothers, one has an M&P 9mm which is a few years old, the other a new M&P 40 with the ported barrel. Both guns have horrible accuracy and have been shot by several experienced shooters who all had the same issues.
 
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