New (to me) Gewehr 88 Turkish?

pvtjohnson

pvtjohnson

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Hey everyone, picked up a few rifles today, and this one is pretty cool, and think you guys would appreciate it.

It's a Gewehr 88, from Turkey I believe from some google research. It's nice shape, bolt cycles beauty, and the bore is nice and shiny and sharp.

Just pretty much wanted to show off, and see if you guys know any extra stuff about it. Thanks!

Oh also, was it built in 1935, or went through some sort of conversion or refurb?






 
Oh wow ! Very cool. It's one of the late conversions. Take off the top handguard and you should see some of the remains of the old barrel heat shield I think .
 
Basically conversion of Gew 88 as you can see from the receiver markings. IMO most beatiful German rifles after 71s, but I prefer them in full configuration with heat shield.
 
Just for your information. That rifle has been altered to be fed from the more modern 5 round strip type chargers which will be discarded upon loading. If this is the case, the bore diameter will be the modern .323 in and there will be a cover plate over the hole at the bottom for the earlier style en blocs that were needed. I see your rifle has this cover. This means that the cartridges are held in the mag well by a flat spring type side plate that also acts as a guide lip to feed the cartridge into the chamber when pushed by the bolt face. The receiver is also notched for the longer Spitzer type bullets.

Those rifles are really under appreciated. Almost all of them have seen decades of service and untold actions. I have a small collection of them. One of them is original and requires the en blocs to load them. The bore diameter is .318 and of course, the barrel has a full length metal heat shroud.

Your rifle was converted and rebarreled in 1935 at Ankara Arsenal. If the bore is good, I am willing to bet that rifle is a very decent shooter with good ammo. Now, you need a Turkish 1935 bayonet to accompany it. Tradex, a banner business at the top of the page has them. Most are pretty beat up, like the rifles.

Your rifle is actually in pretty good condition compared to most I've seen. It even has an original cleaning rod, often those are missing.

The bolts are usually smooth as butter.
 
Wow thanks for the info. The bore is very nice on it, and the bolt is very very smooth.

I actually bought this on a whim, it was the M48 I wanted that was being offered, the fellow brough this along as well, so I bought both.

Would I be able to run commercial ammo in this thing?
 
pvtjohnson said:
Wow thanks for the info. The bore is very nice on it, and the bolt is very very smooth.

I actually bought this on a whim, it was the M48 I wanted that was being offered, the fellow brough this along as well, so I bought both.

Would I be able to run commercial ammo in this thing?
Click to expand...

The Turks loaded their ammo to 48,000 psi. Commercial ammo is loaded to around 38,000 psi. The milsurp ammo being offered is all loaded to around 48,000 psi. You are good to go.
 
Great thanks for that. I'll probably put a few rounds through it to say I shot it, then put it up on the EE, but I always like to get some background info on the stuff I find.
 
You have a former Gew 88.05 that was given to Turkey as military aid during WW1 (sometime between 1916-1918) and retained by Turkey during the post war years. As you have noted, she went through a complete rebuild at Ankara (the capital of the Republic of Turkey at that time) during 1935. She is what I term a "third variation" as she has been completely rebuilt. With the Gew 88s, you see a number of different mix and matches as rifles were rebuilt and put back into service in one form or another. Yours is interesting in that the Ankara arsenal stamp was originally not struck hard and had to be re-struck. Sometimes, you can get lucky and see the original German arsenal name and year of make for the receiver underneath the Ankara arsenal stamp.

After owning five of these rifles, amongst other Gew 88s, they shoot quite well and I have no regrets owning any of them.
 
Proper designation of this rifle is an 1888/35.

It started off as a Gew. 88, went through the S, Z and '14 conversions, then was sent, likely after service on the Western front, to Turkey.

The majority of captured Turkish rifles during the war were stacked in piles by the British and set alight. The Brits did this through the Palestine campaign because they did not have enough troops to take and guard a zillion prisoners and still fight a war. The decision was taken to turn Johnny Turk loose to find his own way home, but to police up all the rifles from the battlefields and destroy them. I had this personally from Bty/Sgt Angus Kellie, 520 Siege Bty, RA. Sgt. Kellie served in the Middle East from 1915 through 1921, fought at Suez, Gaza, Beersheba, Jerusalem, Armageddon and right to the end of the campaign.

When the war was over, all Turkey had remaining were some Peabodies, 1871/87 Mausers, 1890s, 1893s, 1903s, Gew 98s, Gew 88s in SZ'14 configuration (standard and nm types mixed). When it came time to do something with this dog's breakfast of weapons, the decision was taken to get rid of the old Peabodies and 71/87s, being that they could not handle modern ammunition pressures. The 1890s, 1893s, 1903s all were in calibre 7.65x54 and many were pretty ratty. It was an easy job for Turkey's nascent gunmaking industry to ream these and convert them to 8x57.

88s and 98s already were in 8x57, so barrelmaking machinery was obtained and the changeover began with a massive cannibalisation of what they had. As to 1888s, as many as possible were rebuilt with cannibalised parts, some new barrels made. Surplus 1888 actions were set in new stocks made from Turkish Walnut and fitted with heavyweight 8x57 barrels. That is what your rifle is.

I have one and, as so many have stated before, it is a beautiful shooter. That heavy barrel really anchors thing nicely, even if it would be a bit of a chore to cart it around.

You have a very real piece of history there! Treasure it, load for it, have fun with it!

Late at night, if you listen carefully, it might tell you about what Liman von Sanders had to say..... or about the time it almost met Lawrence.

It was there; it is The Real Thing.
 
Bty/Sgt Kellie was a good friend whom I met by chance. We spent many nights talking about the Great War, things I don't think he told anyone else.

He was the night guard at the University I attended, a tall, white-haired old pensioner earning a few extra dollars. The other students made fun of him (behind his back) but they were wary of him because they knew he could get them into a world of trouble. I was older than most of the students (spent 4 years working before going back to school) and he stopped me one night as I was coming out of the Photography section, asked what I was doing. I saw his ribbons and was puzzled. He could see that and asked me what I was staring at.
"Your ribbons, Sir," I answered.
"What about them? You know anything about them?"
"A little, Sir. You have a Great War Victory Medal, an Imperial Defense and the other I'm not sure about."
"Why aren't you sure?"
"Well, Sir, it could be a 1914 Star or it could be a '14-'15."
"Why can't you tell the difference?"
"Because they used the same ribbon for both medals."
"You're right; they did use the same ribbon! It's a '14-'15"

And that started it. I was majoring in History..... and here was a man who had LIVED it and MADE it. We spent many nights talking. He almost met Lawrence ("crazy Englishman living out in the desert with the Arabs") but steered clear because Lawrence was talking to Allenby at the time "telling Allenby how to run the war". He WATCHED Allenby enter Jerusalem.... as a pilgrim. He stacked 100-pound shells for a month before the last battle at Gaza....... and then shot them all off in 4 days.

No lecture in a classroom could teach me what I learned from a man who was THERE.

The 26th Artillery/XII Manitoba Dragoons Museum in Brandon has their annual Vimy Night dinner coming up. I will be there and so will Angus's son, who has never heard these things. Ballsofice154 is an Assistant at the Museum and he has arranged a meeting.

It is going to be an interesting night.
 
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